Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
- Thread starter Xeromus
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Jeff_H
Dean Hardtail Fanologist
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
Yes, but there are as many opinions as there are trees. Here's what I understand generally.
Honduran mahogany is a lighter, more porus wood. Throughout the entire lenght of the tree light pieces of wood suitable for guitar manufacturing can be found, although generally speaking the pieces higher up in the tree are the most desireable, as the wood lower in the trunk compresses and becomes more dense to support the weight of the tree as it grows taller. Some people claim that trees that grow closer to the water are the most desireable, although I don't know how you would ever test that theory. Also, the same as woods in North America, old growth Honduran Mahogany is said to be superior to newer planted/reclaimed wood. Trees that grow in more dense growing conditions grow slower, and have more growth rings per square inch than those that grow faster. This is said to be more toneful.
African Mahogany is a much denser, heavier, wetter wood. It also, generally, tends to have higher mineral content than Honduran mahogany. It can still produce nice light pieces of wood, but these are fewer and farther between, and usually only found in the very highest parts of the trees. Since tree's are thinner at the top than at the bottom, only a select few pieces from high up will be of sufficent size to make a guitar after cutting and planing.
You can debate the tonal differences all you want, and no one would ever be right. The original 57-60 Les Pauls were built with Honduran Mahogany, and you know how people feel about the tone of those guitars. I think as much has to do with them being 50 years old, and being cut from old growth wood. However, given the choice, I would shoose Honduran every time. Tradition, brainwashing....who knows, but that's what I would choose.
Yes, but there are as many opinions as there are trees. Here's what I understand generally.
Honduran mahogany is a lighter, more porus wood. Throughout the entire lenght of the tree light pieces of wood suitable for guitar manufacturing can be found, although generally speaking the pieces higher up in the tree are the most desireable, as the wood lower in the trunk compresses and becomes more dense to support the weight of the tree as it grows taller. Some people claim that trees that grow closer to the water are the most desireable, although I don't know how you would ever test that theory. Also, the same as woods in North America, old growth Honduran Mahogany is said to be superior to newer planted/reclaimed wood. Trees that grow in more dense growing conditions grow slower, and have more growth rings per square inch than those that grow faster. This is said to be more toneful.
African Mahogany is a much denser, heavier, wetter wood. It also, generally, tends to have higher mineral content than Honduran mahogany. It can still produce nice light pieces of wood, but these are fewer and farther between, and usually only found in the very highest parts of the trees. Since tree's are thinner at the top than at the bottom, only a select few pieces from high up will be of sufficent size to make a guitar after cutting and planing.
You can debate the tonal differences all you want, and no one would ever be right. The original 57-60 Les Pauls were built with Honduran Mahogany, and you know how people feel about the tone of those guitars. I think as much has to do with them being 50 years old, and being cut from old growth wood. However, given the choice, I would shoose Honduran every time. Tradition, brainwashing....who knows, but that's what I would choose.
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
Jeff, since Ana is from Honduras, I may be traveling there fairly often. I've been considering trying to source the choicest Honduran mahogany, amongst other rare woods from Central America. Where did you find that info on mahogany? I need to do some research, so I know what I'm doing when I go there and start ordering pallets of mahogany to be shipped here, so I can distribute it. I've been thinking that it may prove to be a great import/export business.
Jeff, since Ana is from Honduras, I may be traveling there fairly often. I've been considering trying to source the choicest Honduran mahogany, amongst other rare woods from Central America. Where did you find that info on mahogany? I need to do some research, so I know what I'm doing when I go there and start ordering pallets of mahogany to be shipped here, so I can distribute it. I've been thinking that it may prove to be a great import/export business.
Johtosotku
New member
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
I'd be careful with this subject, as I've heard that what is sold as Honduran Mahogany propably isn't the same as they used 50 years ago. So it's even harder to compare.
I'd be careful with this subject, as I've heard that what is sold as Honduran Mahogany propably isn't the same as they used 50 years ago. So it's even harder to compare.
kaknight
New member
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
My heritage's mahog is from s. america. It makes the guitar much lighter (like the original gibbys). the thing weighs in at around 8.5 lbs. Supposedly, they sound much better, richer, with more warmth, but that's hard to compare.
My heritage's mahog is from s. america. It makes the guitar much lighter (like the original gibbys). the thing weighs in at around 8.5 lbs. Supposedly, they sound much better, richer, with more warmth, but that's hard to compare.
casblah
New member
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
Weight issues aside, how can one tell by looking, the differences between these two species? I've got a Heritage LP that is supposed to be Honduran mahogany, but I really couldn't tell you any different if it was the African variety. It weighs about 9.5#, and has good acoustic properties.
Weight issues aside, how can one tell by looking, the differences between these two species? I've got a Heritage LP that is supposed to be Honduran mahogany, but I really couldn't tell you any different if it was the African variety. It weighs about 9.5#, and has good acoustic properties.
Jeff_H
Dean Hardtail Fanologist
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
Different places on the net, things I've read over at the LPF. Actually, probably the best source of info is the LPF. You could do a search over there and come up with hundreds of threads and pages on the subject.
There is so much hype about Honduran Mahogany now, it being endangered and all, it's hard to know who to believe. Some say it's not really engangered at all. I do think you would have to be pretty comfortable with your source in Honduras, or you could end up with some barnwood.
Gearjoneser said:
Different places on the net, things I've read over at the LPF. Actually, probably the best source of info is the LPF. You could do a search over there and come up with hundreds of threads and pages on the subject.
There is so much hype about Honduran Mahogany now, it being endangered and all, it's hard to know who to believe. Some say it's not really engangered at all. I do think you would have to be pretty comfortable with your source in Honduras, or you could end up with some barnwood.
Zerberus
Baron Von Shred
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
Jeff_H more or less got all of the differences with his post.... The other main difference is that Honduras is an endangered species....
Tonally after all the guitars I´ve built I still can´t tell a real difference, I used to think that the African was minutely darker, but after building a few more that was more or less dispersed as well... Optical difference is minimal, I honestly don´t think I could tell them apart not having built a guitar in a while......
For me it more or less boils down to: Do you want to support killing an endangered species for what is "mythically better", but in reality may or may not be? Given that, I´ll take the African tree for the most part
Well, you won´t be working with pallets but with huge (averaging approx. 50´x 5´ ) Logs, usually all the wood isn´t cut into Billets until it reaches North America /Europe /wherever (also for customs purposes, senseless to saw it up if the whole log gets rejected at the border.....) if at all. And those Billets are then sold to Luthiers or companies, only the small guys like myself buy tone wood by the Board foot or less.... Most large manufacturers actually go so far as to buy directly from the loggers and cut the whole downed tree up themselves
But it sounds like a good Idea... LMK how it works out
Xeromus said:
Jeff_H more or less got all of the differences with his post.... The other main difference is that Honduras is an endangered species....
Tonally after all the guitars I´ve built I still can´t tell a real difference, I used to think that the African was minutely darker, but after building a few more that was more or less dispersed as well... Optical difference is minimal, I honestly don´t think I could tell them apart not having built a guitar in a while......
For me it more or less boils down to: Do you want to support killing an endangered species for what is "mythically better", but in reality may or may not be? Given that, I´ll take the African tree for the most part
Gearjoneser said:
Well, you won´t be working with pallets but with huge (averaging approx. 50´x 5´ ) Logs, usually all the wood isn´t cut into Billets until it reaches North America /Europe /wherever (also for customs purposes, senseless to saw it up if the whole log gets rejected at the border.....) if at all. And those Billets are then sold to Luthiers or companies, only the small guys like myself buy tone wood by the Board foot or less.... Most large manufacturers actually go so far as to buy directly from the loggers and cut the whole downed tree up themselves
But it sounds like a good Idea... LMK how it works out
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Xeromus
Tone Ninja
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
Email from Tommy at USACG:
African is lighter weight and has a different tone than Honduras which is heavier and is what Gibson uses and has a great tone. Both sound good the Honduras just seems to have more punch and clarity. I stock both of them. Thanks for the inquiry and have a good one! Tommy at USA Custom Guitars.-----
Email from Tommy at USACG:
African is lighter weight and has a different tone than Honduras which is heavier and is what Gibson uses and has a great tone. Both sound good the Honduras just seems to have more punch and clarity. I stock both of them. Thanks for the inquiry and have a good one! Tommy at USA Custom Guitars.-----
Xeromus
Tone Ninja
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
I know, could be more myths out there than truths. Who knows.
Here's one way to tell:
My carvin is honduran mahogany neck and body, my warmoth strat body I ordered is one piece african mahogany. In a couple of months ( :laugh2: ) when they are finished I'll report back on the results.
Jeff_H said:
I know, could be more myths out there than truths. Who knows.
Here's one way to tell:
My carvin is honduran mahogany neck and body, my warmoth strat body I ordered is one piece african mahogany. In a couple of months ( :laugh2: ) when they are finished I'll report back on the results.
WITH FULL DISTORTION
F. Hails Railsologist
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
what about brazilian MAHOGANY?
what about brazilian MAHOGANY?
dani
Active member
Re: Difference between honduran and african mahogany?
pardon me. but i believe limba is a of a different wood species from african mahogany.
here are the scientific names of the 3 woods in question.
limba (black/white) - terminalia superba
african mahogany - khaya ivorensis
honduran mahogany - swietenia macrophylla
Jeff_H said:
pardon me. but i believe limba is a of a different wood species from african mahogany.
here are the scientific names of the 3 woods in question.
limba (black/white) - terminalia superba
african mahogany - khaya ivorensis
honduran mahogany - swietenia macrophylla
