Epiphone 59 Les Paul

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

Its like comparing a Hyundai to a BMW.

And have you seen a Hyundai Genesis? That ain't no budget car, baby.

Speaking of Epi Elitists (made in Japan, Gibson PU's), I think they give some of the Gibsons a run for the money. You certainly get a good guitar for what you spend.

For whatever reason, Gibson wants to keep a few visual differences between Epi's and Gibsons, even when the quality overlaps. With Fenders you have to get a lot closer to tell. So, big deal, different stategies. I'm glad Gibson offers higher-end Epi's.

 

[JeffB]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

snipped a bunch of stuff...

This is all well and good- Have you owned an R8? or R9?

If not, go play one for couple months set up to your preference along with pups, and get back to me. You are basing your opinion on theories and some internet discussion with "R- tards" (which frankly sounds like a comment made up by someone who is pissed they cannot afford a Historic and trying to justify their budget model) . I'm basing it on having been there, done that with roughly 20 Gibson Les Pauls in my lifetime ( 2 custom shop models) as well as 6 or 7 Epiphones standards, a handful of MIJ clones, and I've also played several vintage 50s intruments. Your hum drum average CS R/7/8/9/0 model craps all over an Epi, and 80% of the production standards out there.

I'm not trying to be a doosh, just going by actual experience, not hearsay or internet chatter and comparing one epi MIJ slash model to one Gibson CS Slash model.

 

[Ventilator]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

I've got one of the epi 2010 tribute models on layaway. It has very similar specs to this new 59 reissue except it has no laminate on the maple cap, it has a tapered neck, and it uses 57 classics with series/parallel push-pull options.

I know that it isn't a gibson. However, it is a lot of guitar for the $650+tax I'm dropping on it. Very solid, good tone, comfortable neck, and quality electronics. I cant ask for much more than that for the price. I mean, for the cost of a LP copy and the same upgrades, I'm coming out ahead. Case and strap locks included.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

'doosh.'

It's officially spell-check time.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

I've got one of the epi 2010 tribute models on layaway. It has very similar specs to this new 59 reissue except it has no laminate on the maple cap, it has a tapered neck, and it uses 57 classics with series/parallel push-pull options.

I know that it isn't a gibson. However, it is a lot of guitar for the $650+tax I'm dropping on it. Very solid, good tone, comfortable neck, and quality electronics. I cant ask for much more than that for the price. I mean, for the cost of a LP copy and the same upgrades, I'm coming out ahead. Case and strap locks included.

+1. For you and me, and most players, a good set-neck Epi LP suits our needs. More power to the guys that want to spend more for the Gibsons, especially the Custom Shop models. It's like buying a car: pay what you're comfortable spending & everybody's happy.

I picked up a used, mint-condition Epi LP Std+ this year with HSC, a pair of Seth's, and the 4 push-pull Jimmy Page system, for $480. I got my money's worth.

 

[BloodRose]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

Why? Can you tell about the Tenon by looking? Can you tell by the sound? The strength? I've been bending a short tenon like Steve freaking Stevens for DECADES.

This is EXACTLY my point. You can't tell by look, feel, or sound - but you already think it's an improvement.

I bet 100 bones if we took five long and short tenons you couldn't tell the difference after three randomized trials through the set. You'd be batting 50%

I couldnt tell the diff unless I pulled out the neck pup. I could only tell what guitars sustain better.. Im not bashing Epis, Aceman, I have an Epi that I think is quite good. I was saying that one of the things the vintage gibby purists hold dear is the long tenon, saying it affords better sustain.. I was saying that this (and some of the other special runs) have that feature. IMO they are closing in..

 

[FuseG4]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

i played one of these guitars and liked it alot. way better than std plus tops.
it held its own with a non-chambered gibson studio deluxe.

However the LP trad pro and trad pluses I've played have almost all sounded woodier, airyier, more open, more resonant, or whatever you wanna call it. Gibson's main stuff is, for me, sonically on another level. They feel balanced and have a rich tone, and the finishes, necks, and frets feel great on my hands.
If you're just looking for something to play, those epiphones are awesome. If you're looking for an instrument that feels like someone made it FOR YOU, to LOVE as well as play, get the Gibson. Thats about as well as I can describe the whole thing.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

This is all well and good- Have you owned an R8? or R9?

If not, go play one for couple months set up to your preference along with pups, and get back to me. You are basing your opinion on theories and some internet discussion with "R- tards" (which frankly sounds like a comment made up by someone who is pissed they cannot afford a Historic and trying to justify their budget model) . I'm basing it on having been there, done that with roughly 20 Gibson Les Pauls in my lifetime ( 2 custom shop models) as well as 6 or 7 Epiphones standards, a handful of MIJ clones, and I've also played several vintage 50s intruments. Your hum drum average CS R/7/8/9/0 model craps all over an Epi, and 80% of the production standards out there.

I'm not trying to be a doosh, just going by actual experience, not hearsay or internet chatter and comparing one epi MIJ slash model to one Gibson CS Slash model.

Hey - I've played a few and owned a few in my time. Without going into a finacial disclosure, I have spent quite a bit of time being able to afford one. Of course, I never bought one. I have only played between a half dozen maybe a few short times.

There are a lot of people who spent a lot of money who tell themselves it was worth it too - no matter how untrue that might be.

All I'm saying is there is only one way to tell - and that's cover up the label a do it blind (well, blindfolded in this case). But no one ever does that.

It happens at wine tastings all the time. And yes - expensive stuff tends to do well. But, people are often extremely surprised at something that costs only 10% of the price and has 90% of the flavor. Makes you really wonder in the mega $$$ is really worth it or just hype. Cork sniffing...interesting phrase when applied to guitar.

I honestly think there is more hate from the uber-high end buyers than Jelousy from the low end purchaser.

Scarey to think an Epi can do everything yours can - and that you would have enough left over for Mesa Dual Rectifier....

 

[IanBallard]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

I wouldn't kick one out of bed for eating crackers...

 

[jalguitarman]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

i would bet that more than a few pickers would want the look correct enough to save for the real lester,so maybe thats why the epis look different,it's a marketing ploy,to make sure purists only get the look from the real deal.

While I dig my epiphone I too hate the headstock. I agree it should look like the Gibson headstock,
For what it's worth I think thare are some slight differences between Fender MIA, MIM and squier head stocks.

 

[whatshisname]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

Henry has stated that one of the reasons Epiphone has their own headstock, is because the brand had existed for a very long time before the association with Gibson, so it deserves to stand on it's own. Or something like that.

 

[JeffB]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

Henry has stated that one of the reasons Epiphone has their own headstock, is because the brand had existed for a very long time before the association with Gibson, so it deserves to stand on it's own. Or something like that.

Which to some extent makes sense-especially as regards to the Epi Rivieras and their ilk.

But if Les Pauls and SGs, and the Gibson copy hollowbodies cannot have have the gibson headstock, why do the Vs and explorers get the correct gibson headstock? Never made sense to me in the grand scheme of things.

At any rate, I agree the made for USA imported headstocks are not terribly attractive and I used to absolutely hate the Epi headstock, but these days I have come to terms with it- ultimately it does''t really matter, as Ace pointed out: if you ( a general "you") are happy with the way the individual guitar sounds and plays.

Ace- I hear ya bro, the point I'm trying to get across (poorly perhaps) is simply that if one spends some quality time with a properly setup Historic, and pups that are to a individuals tastes, and then after a couple months you go back to an Epi, the differences will become extremely obvious. Of course in the end we all have to live within our means, and I'll make no arguments as to whether the price of a Historic is "worth it"- thats a personal call. I've gone from my days of owning 2K-3K guitars to a $900 dollar Tele, and a $300 Epi! Life happens

As for the actual Epi in question in the thread, I think for that kind of $ (aren't they around a grand? I've not see one in person) I'd grab a new/used MIJ import off ebay. While I had issues with my Edwards (super thick lacquer over poly finish, differences in body shape/carve, incorrect binding, etc)- it was a high quality piece, that was put together extremely well (rivalling the best production Gibsons), and played brilliantly. My Tokai, however was a MUCH better clone than the Edwards.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

Henry is an idiot. The fact that he runs a bajillion dollar guitar company does not change that. It could be a kaboodlekabajillion dollar company if they didn't do dumb@$$ things like that. Total agreement - the Dot, Riviera, etc...toal Epic Epiness. Les Paul?!?!?! WTF...

werd Jeff. And remember - at the end of the day, I'm a guy who digs Norlins (with legitamate reasons...). No question though that the Epi's are getting better, and the real deal LP's are at least a touch over-priced and subject to less than perfection...

But as you said - if it's what floats your boat, go for it. If you have one, you can probably afford a boat.

Hunter had a great statement on Gibson somewhere. Some dude was bashing every LP at a store. Like I said - they will all work just fine. And can be made great. But there are tons of guitars at half the price point that play and sound just a good.

I'm mostly over Gibson. Then again, I have three of them...and I'm not saying that someday there won't be at least a fourth, or maybe fifth. But there will likely be more Dean Cadillacs, or an ESP, or Hamer or whatever...And my ears and hands will be happy campers.

Unless i win the lottery.

And all of that said - there are some truly magic LP's out there. But they happen through complex construction and luck and mojo. I don't think there is any ONE recipe. Tenon/Wood/pups/hardware etc....When it comes together, it comes together.

I wouldn't trust Gibson to use the best wood on any guitar except ones that an artist is given. They have been too deceptive too many times.

I am rambling now...

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

At any rate, I agree the made for USA imported headstocks are not terribly attractive and I used to absolutely hate the Epi headstock, but these days I have come to terms with it.

I don't understand the negative passions that Epi headstocks ignite, when there are few things uglier in life than a PRS headstock. :eyecrazy: As someone who is on the Gibson/Epi side of the fence, I really dislike Fender headstocks. But as has been pointed out, it's a matter of taste and the headstock is the least of your worries with a guitar.

 

[aneyekay1]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

i'd definately buy an Epi if it looked like that
WAY nicer than the Epi headstock

 

[whatshisname]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

Henry is an idiot.

True as that may be, I was simply stating what he said. Take it for what it's worth, which may very well be nothing. :cool2:

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

But if Les Pauls and SGs, and the Gibson copy hollowbodies cannot have have the gibson headstock, why do the Vs and explorers get the correct gibson headstock? Never made sense to me in the grand scheme of things.

Yeah, why??? If you can do it on some, you can do it on all of them. They own all those headstock designs anyways.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

one of the things the vintage gibby purists hold dear is the long tenon, saying it affords better sustain.. I was saying that this (and some of the other special runs) have that feature. IMO they are closing in..

How much more would a tenon a few inches longer cost anyways? Why scrimp?

And why does Gibson use single wire leads on almost all the PU's in their guitars, but sell their 4 wire lead PU's as aftermarket? How much does that save them per guitar? What a poor decision that was for high-end guitars.

 

[Andrew Lamprecht]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

And why does Gibson use single wire leads on almost all the PU's in their guitars, but sell their 4 wire lead PU's as aftermarket? How much does that save them per guitar? What a poor decision that was for high-end guitars.

For what it's worth some people like Gibson using single conductor because it's more "vintage correct." I personally can't hear a difference but whatever.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Epiphone 59 Les Paul

For what it's worth some people like Gibson using single conductor because it's more "vintage correct." I personally can't hear a difference but whatever.

They are Henry's dumb@$$ followers.