Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

[davguitar]

This may not be news to anyone here, but I believe I've discovered that Fender's single coil pickups can have different magnet orientations within their own line of pickups, depending on the model.

I have a Fender American Standard Strat with the stock "Delta Tone" pickups. The tone is only OK, and not as "open" sounding as my Strat with all Duncan pickups. The Duncan's just seem to be more dynamic and allow the tone of the guitar to come through better than the stock Fenders. So I may go with a set of SSL-1's (maybe the California 50's set) for this one. I'm also thinking about a Twangbanger for the bridge position.

What I wanted to mention here is that I took a spare Duncan SSL-1, and laid it top-to-top against the neck and bridge pickups on the American Standard and they were attracted to each other. Then I took a Fender 57/62 replacement pickup and the same thing happened. They opposite occurred on my Strat with all Duncans and on a Fender Vintage reissue I have with Texas Specials. That means Fender pickups have two different magnet orientations. That seems a bit screwy on their part, especially if they hope somebody buys some of their pickups for aftermarket use along with existing Fender pickups.

Somebody correct me if I wrong, but I believe you need a whole set of pickups on a Strat that are magnetically compatible, if they're going to sound right. This is especially true if you're using a RW/RP pickup that has an opposite magnet orientation to the neck and bridge pickups. Am I correct about this?

 

[beandip]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

actually, it's just like SD said in the FAQ's. Fender usually uses a North polarity with their pickups (save for the middle, which is rw/rp) and SD usually uses a South polarity with their pickups (single coils anyway, and again, save for the middle, which is rw/rp). And whichever polarity the pickup is dosnt effect the sound. The sound, tone, and timbre of a pickup come more from the windings, type of coil used, and magnet type, not polarity.

 

[slightly_rude]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

actually, it's just like SD said in the FAQ's. Fender usually uses a North polarity with their pickups (save for the middle, which is rw/rp) and SD usually uses a South polarity with their pickups (single coils anyway, and again, save for the middle, which is rw/rp).

This only applies to Fender's American Series and American Delta Tone pickups.
All other Fender single coil pickups are southern polarity except for the RW/RP in the Fat 50's, Tx Spl. and Tex Mex sets. The one significant difference here is Fender's winding direction is opposite Seymour's so if you want to use a mix of each, one pickup (and only one) will have to be wired opposite what the instructions show for that pickup.

 

[davguitar]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

Thanks for the clarifications!

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

Mixing Fender and Duncan is very often a headache, because of what you said.

To get it sorted out, hit the search function for one of my old threads about polarity and wind direction. There have been pages written about the solution for mixing different brands of pickups on some of those threads.

 

[BlueGuitar]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

...
Somebody correct me if I wrong, but I believe you need a whole set of pickups on a Strat that are magnetically compatible, if they're going to sound right. This is especially true if you're using a RW/RP pickup that has an opposite magnet orientation to the neck and bridge pickups...

To make matters more confusing, only some of the Fender sets include a RWRP middle pickup (like the Fat 50's and the Texas Specials). The Custom 54's, the Custom 69's and the 57/62's are "period correct" and do not include a RWRP middle pickup. BTW Fender started out making their pickups North on top for the first few years then switched to South on top. I agree with you that Fender really ought to standardize their pickup polarities... Like when I got my '51 Butterscotch Blonde, the two pickups were NWNP so the middle position was not humcancelling.... I had to spend another $70 buying a NoCaster bridge pickup which was RWRP with respect to the neck pickup.

FWIW if Fender RI strats were to be "period correct" most of them would have 3 way switches... :smack: Maybe it'd be too little too late but Fender really ought to set some standards and try to follow them!

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

I just got a Texas Hot that I was going to install in the neck with the Fender Tex Mex's until I got another TH and TB for the bridge. This sounds like I need to wait until I have two more other Seymour Duncans before I do the install. Rats.

 

[davguitar]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

It's good to see Steve Ahola posting around here. I'm familiar with him from the AMPAGE forum. He's knowledgeable about guitars and guitar electronics, and he always posts informative stuff. There's alot of good people around here, for that matter, and I have found I can get questions answered here better than at any other forum for guitarists.

 

[Boleslaw Gers 666]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

To tell you the truth, I believe there is not one pickup Fender makes better than Seymour Duncan. Especially their humbuckers. They are abysmal.

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

To tell you the truth, I believe there is not one pickup Fender makes better than Seymour Duncan. Especially their humbuckers. They are abysmal.

Why do you think that is? The Fender company apparently has a longer history of making pickups it seems that they would know how to make a top notch pickup.

Do they just surrender to the thinking that pickups are a personal preference, They just fill the pickup routes with something assuming that guitar buyers are just going to change them out regardless of how good they are?

Are they making enough money on selling guitars that they don't care so much about the pickup market? but, how crazy does that sound?

 

[beandip]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

To tell you the truth, I believe there is not one pickup Fender makes better than Seymour Duncan. Especially their humbuckers. They are abysmal.

Sorry, but I gotta call bullsh*t. While SD does an AWSOME job making pickups, nothing beats vintage Fender pickups. Nothing.

 

[Guitar Toad]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

Sorry, but I gotta call bullsh*t. While SD does an AWSOME job making pickups, nothing beats vintage Fender pickups. Nothing.

So, you talkin 'bout the Fat 50's, custom shops?

 

[Luke Duke]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

To tell you the truth, I believe there is not one pickup Fender makes better than Seymour Duncan. Especially their humbuckers. They are abysmal.

I have to agree, all of the Fender pups I've tried have been incredibly blah, and generic sounding. Just didn't do it for me. Of couse pups in mass produced guitars have to appeal to the greatest common denominator.

In my book only one person at Fender has any kind of HISTORY with pups and that Abigail Ybarra. Being that Fender and Gibson are both consortiums of sorts I don't give them the credit of history or originality.

Luke

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

Sorry, but I gotta call bullsh*t. While SD does an AWSOME job making pickups, nothing beats vintage Fender pickups. Nothing.

I prefer the Duncan Antiquity Surfers and the Lindy Fralin Vintage Hots to the original pickups in my '63 Strat, and I prefer the Duncan Antiquity I and Fralin Tele Blues Specials to the original pickups that came with my '54 Tele...that's why the original pickups from my '54 Tele stay in the case and not in the guitar.

No two ways about it: the Duncans and Fralins are both "better" than the oldies, IMO.

Lew

 

[mrfjones]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

i have to agree with lew, i know a lot of guys have disected the old fender pickups and when they wind their own versions they make chages that should have been made in the first place, like a strat bridge that is a bit hotter than the other pickups or winding a p90 with less wire for a sweeter sound etc etc... it is a constant evolution of the style of a particular pickup.

look at the tele bridge pickup for instance, i like mine to be a bit raw with a little twang to it, but get nice and sweet when i roll off some volume. that means something in the broadcaster/nocaster or before 54 tele range would be best for me. After that the pickups poles were smaller and then raised. i don't like the sound of this, it is too clean and twangy for me. this is what someone else would like though, so i know what i am after, and now only a few guys know how to make that sound, an overwound flatpoled broadcaster pickup. this is what is good for me and i will not say that the vintage pickups were bad, but in some cases i know that they were (there are always some duds) so i now try and find the right pickup for me which has a specific vintage sound, which fender only made some of the time and really by accident (overwind).

personally i liked my voodoo te50 bridge pickup better than an original 53 tele pickup. the 53 sounded nice but it still wasn't raw enough. maybe that has smething to do with the fact that it was 50 years old, since the magnets lost some of their pull or maybe a little bit of the coil wasn't working or... the list goes on. point being that it is a process of selection and also learning how to do things better, even if it is in a vintage light.

as i stated before, I really like vintage sounds, so i try and stick with pickups that are hand wound to some sort of original spec. I had a great conversation with peter florance about this same topic rougly a year ago and also lindy fralin not too long ago. you should talk to them about all of this and they will tell you all about it.

 

[Istanbul]

Re: Fender Single Coils vs. Duncan Single Coils

Sorry, but I gotta call bullsh*t. While SD does an AWSOME job making pickups, nothing beats vintage Fender pickups. Nothing.

I , personally would change the pickups always.. Why?

As the stock guitar pickups are being made for a huge customer-target and they are oneway pickups..

If you buy a stratocaster (not important 1963 or 1999) you can play blues-jazz or country etc etc but there would come a moment that you would think ; "it doesnt fit" !!

so what to do? buy different guitars for different styles or modify your guitar to make it fit for several styles?

Example:
Seymour Duncan Stratocaster set.. i have seen that set in a Highway Stratocaster..

Bridge: JB Jr
Middle: Duckbucker
Neck: LI59

can you imagine how many different sound you can obtain with switching-wiring-coil splitting from that set?...