Fender ToneMaster Pro. When did this hit?

[Top-L]

A decade ago I had a Fender Mustang Floor processor which was quite decent except it was fairly basic. And over the past couple years they have built digital versions of their old classics. Now they have entered the MFX floorboard space.

Thoughts:

Looks inspired by Quad Cortex?
Does it have profiling?
There is a surprising lack of knobs. Is everything adjusted by touch?

https://www.sweetwater.com/c633--Mu...5W_nYpgMrPrxAZK1BJhoCTPMQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

[Seashore]

Rotary knobs and touchscreen (edit - you can use the footswitches as rotary knobs for parameters too... neat). But don't order one... with your luck it'll arrive with the knobs at the wrong angle, the left side raised up too high, and big scratches in the casing.

 

[beaubrummels]

$1700. It'd better sound stellar.

 

[Top-L]

Rotary knobs and touchscreen (edit - you can use the footswitches as rotary knobs for parameters too... neat). But don't order one... with your luck it'll arrive with the knobs at the wrong angle, the left side raised up too high, and big scratches in the casing.

I was waiting for someone to imply I'm too picky. Every one of those issues was return worthy.

Regarding this new Fender processor, I think it looks great. I have a Zoom G11 that I use for playing direct and I really like it, but this thing has alot more polish. When you turn the knobs on the hardware, you can see them change on the graphic.

The only problem is the price. Digital gear that cost 1700 today may be worth 500 in a few years. And while its a pretty thing, how much better does it sound? For the level of stuff I'm doing it would be hard to justify, but I'd like one nonetheless.

 

[Seashore]

I was waiting for someone to imply I'm too picky.

I was doing no such thing, bud, I agree you should've returned all of those guitars. Just trying to make you chuckle.

 

[Mincer]

I dig it, but no reason to switch from my Fractal. I also have a Tone Master Deluxe which I really like, so again, I already own what I would use this thing for.

 

[NegativeEase]

1700 dollars? the switch bank config is interesting, I guess it's not supposed to be on the floor then

 

[Top-L]

I dig it, but no reason to switch from my Fractal. I also have a Tone Master Deluxe which I really like, so again, I already own what I would use this thing for.

That is a common sentiment that you see fractal owners sharing in the thread over on tgp.

 

[Top-L]

The really great feature is the two analog switchable loops. You can install analog preamp and boosts without incurring any extra adda latency.

Also being fender they own rights to 5150. So there is that crossover.

Interesting that they didnt chase the profiling bandwagon. You can put a ToneX in the analog loop though.

And no footpedal, which keeps form factor small. I believe it is intended to integraye with normal pedalboard, but a footpdal raises price.

Latency is apparent ly 2.5ms which is very good.

​​​​​​The tones on most flagship modelers has converged to a very high level, but there are vast differences in ui between old and the new touch boxes.

The touch paradigm used by zoom, boss, headrush, qc, and now fender, is to touch the effect and then use the encoder bank to edit parameters.

Helix doesnt have a touchscreen, so you have to touch the capacitive button. Their next touch version will have a ui indistinguishable from the rest.

When tones are equivalent, does anyone need to spend 1700 when a boss gx100 does essentially the same thing for 500? Gotta love boss and zoom for holding a line on price. Helix, fractal, fender, qc all in the 1700+ range.

Yamaha/line6 not the big boy any more. There is a new sherriff in town. The 1000 watt fr cabinet at 500 looks even better deal.

The overall polish and the analog loops are what set this new box apart.

i am very interested in this, but also anticipate a lite version in the future.

That 1000 watt fr cab that looks like a hrd is hard to pass up.

​​​​​​

 

[DankStar]

watched Ola's review yesterday. pretty funny - they send him stuff but apparently don't give him a heads up, don't explain it, he has to just figure out what it is and what it does. he got it to make some amazing sounds (at this point though, how many freaking 5150/EVH high gain chug tones do I need to hear. they all sound the same, and even the budget units do it well). the funny part was, when he went to do certain things, like add an IR, it was not available yet due to a pending update. the app was also pending.

oh, one rad thing: some amps have a second screen with all the amp's little switches and such (like the HBE switch on a friedman). I always thought it was lame when a modeller doesn't have all the knobs and toggles as the real amps.

to be honest, the list of amps I googled seem kinda small for something that has 8 cores and is right off the press. there are only a handful of marshalls, no oranges, no bass amps (aside from the bassman). I guess they can add more through updates? he did a cool 2-cab mixing thing that I'd love to goof with.

it has the cool dual footswitch/dials that seem to be the norm now. the display looked awesome. the cabinet screen seemed kind of lame compared to the QC's.

I don't know if it can capture or profile, but any future digital thing I buy is going to have that feature.

 

[Top-L]

Fender has 1000x the R&D budget of Neural. They can do whatever they decide is profitable with the software. Captures? Sure, why not. The Neural team did something innovative, didn't have the budget to back it up, now the competition has copied whatever innovations they came up with.

I'm not expecting them to add a capture capability, but I wouldn't be surprised if they charge extra for amp packs.

Also, previous experience with the Mustang Floor, their own Fender amps were better than the other amps, to the point it was obvious they weren't even trying with the Marshalls.

The only thing that could hamper this things development is if they try to protect their brand superiority by making non Fender models inferior.

IOW, I expect the 5150s to be the best high gain amps that ever live on that device. That said, when you have generous EQ blocks and IRs, every high gain amp basically does the same thing. I don't care that it doesn't have Oranges.

 

[Top-L]

BTW, the above post is one I couldn't make on TGP without generating a complete shit storm. The Fender reps would say "our Marshall amp sims are the best! How dare you accuse us of that" and 100 other destructive tangents started by other posters who have a QC and still think its relevant, etc etc etc.

 

[Mincer]

Again, I am sure it is great. But you don't need to own Fender and EVH to have great Fender and 5150 amp sims. All you need is a copy of the amp. So Fender bragging about 'official' in their amps isn't much of a selling point.
I suspect a Tone Mast Jr by the new year.

 

[Top-L]

Again, I am sure it is great. But you don't need to own Fender and EVH to have great Fender and 5150 amp sims. All you need is a copy of the amp. So Fender bragging about 'official' in their amps isn't much of a selling point.
I suspect a Tone Mast Jr by the new year.

Thats true. The opposite is what has me concerned, that they would half-ass the Marshall and other branded models because they aren't Fender products.

If all amp models (between brands) are created equally, then I would buy this one for sure. It has a great user interface, and it has two switchable analog loops. Fender is large enough that I don't anticipate their development will peter out like Neural's did with the QC.

On the profiling front, I am still "wait and see". The Kemper has liquid profiles which apparently model the EQ and gain staging? Waiting to see if the other brands go in that direction or if it is just advertizing. But frankly, I would rather have amp models that are designed and built to sound like the real thing, even if that involves profiling behind the scenes. I don't really need/want the ability to profile amps myself, buy profile packs, etc.

 

[NegativeEase]

The really great feature is the two analog switchable loops. You can install analog preamp and boosts without incurring any extra adda latency.

Also being fender they own rights to 5150. So there is that crossover.

Interesting that they didnt chase the profiling bandwagon. You can put a ToneX in the analog loop though.

And no footpedal, which keeps form factor small. I believe it is intended to integraye with normal pedalboard, but a footpdal raises price.

Latency is apparent ly 2.5ms which is very good.

​​​​​​The tones on most flagship modelers has converged to a very high level, but there are vast differences in ui between old and the new touch boxes.

The touch paradigm used by zoom, boss, headrush, qc, and now fender, is to touch the effect and then use the encoder bank to edit parameters.

Helix doesnt have a touchscreen, so you have to touch the capacitive button. Their next touch version will have a ui indistinguishable from the rest.

When tones are equivalent, does anyone need to spend 1700 when a boss gx100 does essentially the same thing for 500? Gotta love boss and zoom for holding a line on price. Helix, fractal, fender, qc all in the 1700+ range.

Yamaha/line6 not the big boy any more. There is a new sherriff in town. The 1000 watt fr cabinet at 500 looks even better deal.

The overall polish and the analog loops are what set this new box apart.

i am very interested in this, but also anticipate a lite version in the future.

That 1000 watt fr cab that looks like a hrd is hard to pass up.

​​​​​​

I'll be interested in feedback in this, as I do not view Fender as a great software company typically -so love to hear how they change my mind on this.

 

[Top-L]

I'll be interested in feedback in this, as I do not view Fender as a great software company typically -so love to hear how they change my mind on this.

The Mustang modelers have been successful, just overshadowed by some others. This isn't their first rodeo, and they have deep pockets.

I'm of the opinion that the best algorithms have been hacked/copied, as evidenced by the success of the many pop-up Chinese modelers. Even if they have to decompile from assembly, there is no stopping anyone from getting their hands on fractal/Boss/whatever algorithm is out there. And then of course there is open source profiling algorithms that they could use as the basis for the models.

Failing all that, they could just buy modeling tech.

 

[NegativeEase]

The Mustang modelers have been successful, just overshadowed by some others. This isn't their first rodeo, and they have deep pockets.

I'm of the opinion that the best algorithms have been hacked/copied, as evidenced by the success of the many pop-up Chinese modelers. Even if they have to decompile from assembly, there is no stopping anyone from getting their hands on fractal/Boss/whatever algorithm is out there. And then of course there is open source profiling algorithms that they could use as the basis for the models.

Failing all that, they could just buy modeling tech.

Im not really concerned about the sound quality of the algortihms, I'm more speaking to the UI, Patches and UI stability

 

[DankStar]

I'm of the opinion that the best algorithms have been hacked/copied.

When line 6 started I got the impression that they actually had all those amps in their possession and modeled them. Now, who knows right?

 

[Top-L]

I'm trying to find a copy of the manual but cannot. Anyone have a download link?

Its very colorful and clean design, but I'm trying to figure out how much it can actually do. How many effects in a patch, assigns, parallel paths, footswitching, etc.

The amp/effect list is somewhat limited. More limited than my G11. Leads me to believe they may be intending to charge for upgrade packs.

It appears that it is closer to the Headrush in functionality than it is to say a Boss GT1000 or Fractal.

 

[Top-L]

When line 6 started I got the impression that they actually had all those amps in their possession and modeled them. Now, who knows right?

I doubt Line6 copied, because they were around before most of the new companies. The chinese pop-up companies like Donner, Ampero, Mooer, etc.. those are all copied illegal bullshit. Mooer was actually caught pirating a digital pedal in the past.

But a new product like this, I'm certain that Fender reverse engineered the competition. Not necessarily stole, but generated a repository of "best practices". I would be shocked if their algorithms are less than the other offerings. They sound good to me.