Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

[Kruspe]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

If you already have a 6505, you might want to look at the new 6505 mini head. 20w of tube power, weighs 16lbs and has a DI on the back of the amp so you can plug in to the house.

I saw a touring band last month (Artificial Brain - I believe the guitarist is also in Revocation) and one of the guitarist was using it. I was surprised to see such a small amp for a band that tours and does small shows to large fests. I don't have any experience with it, but it might be a cheaper (and fixable) alternative to a Axe FX rig.

I wouldnt suggest that one, i have had it, its not loud enough for playing with drummer but the main big issue is, that it keeps overheating, i could play like 30 minutes and then it would stop, wait 20 minutes, ready for next 30 minutes.. do not buy that amp, that amp is not good and sounds pretty bad to me as well. The DI is sounds like mesa cab clone, ****ty.

 

[Lazarus1140]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Roughly 1 month later - The Fractal Audio AX8 really sounds great. I was forced to give a better run when I woke up to a dead amp Saturday morning. The Fender Brown sound just kills!

 

[Mincer]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

I've had my AX8 over a year, and it is still remarkable. I've been digging the Dirty Shirley lately.

 

[htwheelz67]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

I've been playing for 40 years about 2010 I picked up a axe fx ultra and a couple years ago an axe fx 2, I've sold almost all my amps and haven't really even really used an amp for at least 5-6 years, I still use my ultra live because I have dialed some tones I havent been able to duplicate with the 2quite yet. Even live with the axe fx I get the BEST tones I have ever gotten out of any tube amp ever and it feels like a tube amp. I use mainly a tweaked dumble OD special patch which I tweaked to sound like my best "amp" sound and its way better, I built what looks like a 1/2 stack but its basically a powered stereo 4x12 cab with 2 550 watt power amps built in with EQ on the back, it can hang with the best tube amps. Besides the amps the effects are amazing, basically you can take your best studio tone and effects and get that sound live. You need a good ear for guitar tones when dialing, I have heared pretty bad tones out of an axe fx 2 when someone didn't know how to dial it and they plugged into my ultra and like WOW "that sounds great"
Absolutely, hands down the best equipment purchased in my life, you can tweak things that is virtually impossible to tweak in a real tube amp AND you can tweak things in a few seconds that an amp tech would do in a couple hours. Here is a pic of my cab, 12" woofers in the bottom, tweeters in the top into 12" round waveguides, split down the middle and some foam damping material carefully placed inside, 2 550 watt power amps built into the backside with volume and 2 band eq, weighs about the same as a typical 4x12 cab and it can go really loud.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Here is the main problem when it comes to gigging with a modeler vs a real amp:

YOU ARE MORE CONCERNED ABOUT YOUR OWN PERSONAL SOUND THAN THE AUDIENCE. Period. The End. Infinity.

The audience does not care, does not know, and is not interested. They want to hear a sound that is either just like the record, or they want a sound that isn't too piercing, or too loud. That's it and that's all. They want the band to be tight, they want to hear good clean vocals, because to THEM, that is the song. Live music is PERFORMANCE, not sound sculpting.

If after 2010 you have been carrying an amp, you have done it because YOU wanted to, so stop making up BS about how heavy it is, and your aches and pains, and the cost, and the 20% of the tone you can't get. Pro's have been dialing in their god-tones on POD's for years and having local unions line ups stacks just for looks.

I can dial in every sound your fans want to hear on a Digitech RP200 in about 30 minutes. If you want to spend more time - cool. Go ahead and do that. Maybe that extra 1 repeat in analog missing will just ruin the entire vibe, but I doubt it. But if you think over ten gigs where you play my RP200 vs your amazeballs tubular set that it won't be a flip of the coin which rig anyone though sounded better, you are fooling yourself.

I have been through three phases of playing out in my life and between the venue, the sound guy, and random acts of chaos, I maintain (and will to my grave) that the only person all wrapped up in this is YOU. All the little crap that you worry about is a wash of bouncing sound, sound guy whim, changing monitors, and audience noise that even you can't here when music hits. There may be a quiet little jazz gig or chill blues exception...but overall.

Whoever said the guy he knows who is the best player has one guitar and one AXfx....there you go. we have a guy like that here too. Two guitars and Boss Multifx. Same with Mincer who is better than 99% of us.

How many pro artists whose sound you idolize have to tell you "On my worst tone night the audience said I was on fire." And you have seen their boards - a few Boss pedals and an Ibanez/MXR or two...

I realize this is a guitar gear board, so we are going to roll that way. I just get so cheesed at guys who have lost all sensibility on what a good sound is vs 'I need that 99.99997% perfect sound'. And think it is because of tube amp vs digital. All you are doing is rambling to yourself and doing what is called confirmation bias.

And that's ok - just stop fooling yourself.


*This has been a general difference of opinion and not directed at the OP or any individual in this thread.

 

[Silver]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

You're right about the audience, Ace. I know a local covers band where the guitarist plugs into some 1990's piece of **** Zoom multi-effects and then into the clean channel of a Marshall solid state amp... and personally (as a guitarist) I think his tone sucks ass, but the locals seem to love the band and they get a lot of paying gigs.

However,

Part of the enjoyment of gigging, for me, is playing in that band situation and hearing the live sound. For that, I need to sound good... just for me, I know the audience doesn't give a damn.

I've not gigged in a loooooooooong time, but if I did again I'd want to do it with nice gear because I like how it sounds.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Yeah, the audience doesn't care. But I have to be inspired to play (the audience doesn't really do that for me)...a good sound does that. Also the Fractal/Kemper stuff is wonderful for recording, too.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Yeah, the audience doesn't care. But I have to be inspired to play (the audience doesn't really do that for me)...a good sound does that. Also the Fractal/Kemper stuff is wonderful for recording, too.

So Dave - if your sound isn't Uber....you play crappy, or not at all? See my point here?


Who DOESN'T like great sound?

 

[Mincer]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Well, if the sound isn't good...I don't want to play. I have to be happy, first.

 

[Silver]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

I don't know of many gear hounds that obsess over gear for the sake of the audience, either... Is that a thing?

I thought it was a given that we do this for ourselves?

Even in the marketing material for signature gear, the artists are always "I like" this and "I want" that... Never, "I have this amp/guitar/pickups/pedal because my audience likes it more than this other product...".

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Yeah, the audience doesn't care. But I have to be inspired to play (the audience doesn't really do that for me)...a good sound does that. Also the Fractal/Kemper stuff is wonderful for recording, too.

That's right.

I'm not sure the audience cares about anything other than having an enjoyable time.

I'm sure they don't care if my tone matches the tone on a recording and I don't care either.

I'm always going to sound like me...not some other guy. That's kid stuff trying to sound like someone other than yourself.

But the audience does care if their ears hurt or if the music is just too loud.

So I play with a comfortable tone that inspires me to play well, and the audience seems to have the enjoyable time that they came out for.

I have been gigging with a modeling amp for the last year or two.

It would be very limiting to go back to my old tube amps now.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

The only people that care about guitar tone are guitarists. Some artists have a much higher percentage of guitarists as fans... People like Bonamassa, Vai, some metal bands and post rock bands have audiences that are packed with guitar players who nit pick every piece of the tone. The majority of big touring acts and small bar bands have audiences that don't care at all.

Tying off the Gibson Custom thread, if I was in a big touring act (not my own thing and making enough money), I'd probably have a Kemper rig built up for touring. Either on stage cabs for monitoring or in-ears, depending on the type of show it is.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

The only people that care about guitar tone are guitarists. Some artists have a much higher percentage of guitarists as fans... People like Bonamassa, Vai, some metal bands and post rock bands have audiences that are packed with guitar players who nit pick every piece of the tone. The majority of big touring acts and small bar bands have audiences that don't care at all.

Tying off the Gibson Custom thread, if I was in a big touring act (not my own thing and making enough money), I'd probably have a Kemper rig built up for touring. Either on stage cabs for monitoring or in-ears, depending on the type of show it is.

Right.

But just because a typical audience doesn't care what pickups, amp or speakers you use, that doesn't mean that you, as an artist, shouldn't care.

I don't know what brand of paint or brushes Picasso or Van Gogh used...but I'm sure they did.

And I'm sure they chose their paints and brushes very carefully.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Right.

But just because a typical audience doesn't care what pickups, amp or speakers you use, that doesn't mean that you, as an artist, shouldn't care.

I don't know what brand of paint or brushes Picasso or Van Gogh used...but I'm sure they did.

And I'm sure they chose their paints and brushes very carefully.

Of course! And that's why I have tube amps, nice analog and digital pedals and nicely playing guitars with true single coils on the Fender style guitars. I love my tones, but even the other guitar player in my band thinks he sounds almost as good with a Line 6 Spyder.

The outlier is my Martin. Everyone who hears it (guitar player or not, musician or not) thinks it sounds amazing.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

To be clear - I am always at war with the gear hound who is more concerned with his sound than the audience experience. And they are out there. I know Dave puts on a stellar performance regardless of the situation. There are those that don't.

To the audience, PF, that Spyder MIGHT sound as good....

I'm saying if you haven't been out there and had to play without hearing yourself, you haven't played out. Fortunately I'm currently in a band where people come to see the spandex pants and the stupid t-shirts as much as the music...

But yeah - those night when your sound is on, those are awesome.

 

[Kruspe]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

Yeah, the audience doesn't care. But I have to be inspired to play (the audience doesn't really do that for me)...a good sound does that. Also the Fractal/Kemper stuff is wonderful for recording, too.

dont forget that other guitarist are always checking the gear and the tone live, if i go to gig to see some band i want to see what they use and how it sounds, so your argument is good, but not for the whole audience, there will be guys that are there just to check out the gear trust me.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

To the audience, PF, that Spyder MIGHT sound as good....

After owning one and playing in two bands with guitarists that had one, I'll say probably not. When the first guy's valvestate blew up, he bought the Spyder. After one show we all missed the Valvestate. Second band, the amp's bass blended perfectly with the bass guitar and bass drum and fuzzy highs melded with the cymbals perfectly.... So my 12W tube amp and TS sat perfectly in the mix occupying all the mids.

It sounds better now that the gain and bass has been turned down, mids turned way up and a ban on the Insane channel.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

dont forget that other guitarist are always checking the gear and the tone live, if i go to gig to see some band i want to see what they use and how it sounds, so your argument is good, but not for the whole audience, there will be guys that are there just to check out the gear trust me.

Oh certainly. I would imagine it is the same for a chef that goes out to eat. You'd be saying 'oh that is interesting', and 'oh, I would never put those ingredients together'. But I am used to most guitarists checking out what I do and walking away shaking their head....haha.

 

[Progbusters]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

I just got a Mackie Thump 12 for my digital unit - and now I enjoy the uncolored tones of the cab sim as opposed to using my guitar cab which changed the tone. Plus it has more spl and doesn't sound strained.

 

[Lazarus1140]

Re: Going digital Axe Fx/Kemper

I don't know ... I pass out notarized affidavits to my audience members (you know, die-hard fans) stating that I am using real tube amps with NOS tones that faithfully recreate the vintage tones they are accustomed to hearing in their walkman earbuds. I wish I could use my AX8 with it's almost limitless access to tones and effects for gigging but, alas, I am bound by legal documents.

Additionally, there is the matter of my ears which I trust more than those of the adult beverage dulled ears of the masses. My AX8, besides being convenient, sounds excellent and responds just like an amp (or at least close enough to suit me). I mean I really love it. But there is something magical about a tube amp that I don't expect anyone else to care about even if they had the ability to notice. I have used the AX8 for festival stages and will use it if I ever do any more worship stuff, but for small clubs, I'll take a combo and pedalboard until I'm too frail to lift 40#s.