Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

[teleblooz]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

A RockBox Boiling Point will get you where you want to go and more! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGdirQfZ2jU&feature=youtube_gdata

 

[Dave Locher]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Yes, that is an option, lots of info on TS mods on the interwebz.

The OD-3 is great, I have one and as EDX said, it is a totally different beast from a TS/SD type OD. Very crunchy, I'm not sure if I would call it creamy, but others might. As with any of these, it depends on the basic tone of the amp you are running it into.

I haven't tried the Xotic compressor, but the thing to be aware of with compressors in high gain situations is that they can and usually do add a lot of noise.

Speakers might also be something to consider, they can drastically change the sound of an amp.

In reverse order:
I just replaced the worn out/shot speakers with new Tonkers from Eminence, which is partly what is driving this quest. They give me a great rhythm tone but less mids when playing single notes. I play rhythm 99% of the time, though, so I'm not willing to change them out.

I know about the noise issue, which is what drove me away from compressors in the first place. It just seems logical, though. But I did watch a clip just now where a guy ran the SP into a gainy amp and it boosted sustain like crazy but it also elevated the fret noise level with his note. Not what I had in mind.

I've been thinking about an OD-3 anyway, so I suppose that is the easiest next step since they are easy to find and the least expensive of options presented so far. Will try it.

 

[Matt42]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

You could also try a TS pedal with a low end knob like the Green Rhino or the MXR Custom Badass OD. My MXR with the 100Hz knob turned up is very creamy.

And seriously look into the EHX Crayon. The bass and treble knobs are active, so you can boost or cut either range and get a ton of different tones from it.

 

[Hank-]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Have you tried jj ecc83s tubes in the preamp yet? Or even the mullard ri? I found those tend to smooth things up a bit, the jj's being bit darker though can muffle things up.

The od3 doesn't have a lot of midrange boost like a ts9 though. I wonder if stacking the two would do it. On the more cheaper side of things, there is the caline orange burst that is somewhat a clone of the bbe preamp but with different opamps, it make work for you too.

 

[Dave Locher]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Have you tried jj ecc83s tubes in the preamp yet? Or even the mullard ri? I found those tend to smooth things up a bit, the jj's being bit darker though can muffle things up.

The od3 doesn't have a lot of midrange boost like a ts9 though. I wonder if stacking the two would do it. On the more cheaper side of things, there is the caline orange burst that is somewhat a clone of the bbe preamp but with different opamps, it make work for you too.

No tubes. The Randall is all solid state. And more importantly, I don't want to mess with my crunchy rhythm tone. I will try the Caline along with the Boss and see where that gets me.

Thanks to all so far for creating a list of things for me to try.

 

[Dave Locher]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

One last question before I started clicking "Buy":
Is the ODB-3 basically an OD-3 with a clean blend knob, or not at all?
They are cheaper, and I'm positive it's because it says "Bass" on it, but I don't know if this is like the MXR "Bass" Compressor (aka their "Studio" compressor, same exact effect with a different name on the case) or if it really does not work well with guitars?

 

[devastone]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

I have an OD-3 for sale in the trading post, not because I don't like it, but I need to clean out and for now I'm using my GT-100 for everything. I also have a very modded SD-1 if you want to check it out we could figure something out (it's not in the FS post).

Sorry, not trying to spam, wasn't going to mention it, but if you are about to click on one... I'll probably regret selling some of these individual pedals, but I really need to clean out and put some $ in the back right now.

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/sho...edals-(verb-delay-volume-OD-phase-flange-NS2)

 

[Jeff5]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

I guess I forgot to mention that I don't want to pay hundreds of dollars. $100 or less is my goal. There are some Katanas for less than $100 on eBay, and OD-3s seem to go for about $65. That is more my speed.

Okay gotcha. Used, Koko's go for anywhere between $120 and $150, so it may be a bit out of your range.

 

[Rich_S]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Used Xotic BB Preamp. The original orange one.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

devastone it has to do with the nature of the amp, the tubescreamer pushes the mids and high mids, with that amp it will never give it a creamy sound, no matter how you set it, that's why i suggested the od-3 as straight in a clean channel it sounds very smooth and liquid, pushing a gain channel you can turn it into a creamy sound very easily, as the overdrive pushes the low end hard without turning so easily into a massive muddy mush

Yeah, in this case, the Palladium would just go into a clean channel, and use the overdrive from the pedal. Then you have the distortion already in the amp as another channel.

 

[EDX]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

also i think the duncan 805 should do the trick, i haven't tried it, but it's active eq should allow to cut some high end and boost the right amount of lows and mids for a creamy sound

 

[devastone]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

I just replaced the worn out/shot speakers with new Tonkers from Eminence, which is partly what is driving this quest. They give me a great rhythm tone but less mids when playing single notes. I play rhythm 99% of the time, though, so I'm not willing to change them out.

Your speakers may need to break in some too, new speakers can be a little stiff.

 

[Dave Locher]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Can I just say how much I love this forum? Good, solid, helpful, down-to-earth advice. (Unlike some "other" forums.)

 

[HiFiRebel]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Which TS pedals did you try? I have used a TS9 in the past but I finding that the TS Mini (TS808 specs I hear) does better in that regard.

 

[EDX]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

no tube screamer type pedal, at least none with only a tone knob, will ever turn a randall rg100es into a smooth sounding lead amp, it doesn't even matter if the tubescreamer you suggest can do it to a marshall jcm800, with the randall it will only make it tighter and more aggressive, thanks to the nature of the tubescreamer of cutting low end and boosting mids, high mids and high end, he would be way better with a modded rangemaster, like the naga drive, or with a dark, flat or liquid overdrive, like the od-3, or something with a 3 bands eq, so he can cut highs, boost lows, and boost or cut mids (duncan 805)

 

[some_dude]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

I'll mention the Way Huge Green Rhino again.

Most Tubescreamers cut low end. The GH's 100Hz knob will let you dial some of that back in, which will fatten the signal.

Also worth mentioning again, try rolling down your guitar's tone knob. It cuts top end sizzle and brings out the midrange, which makes things sound smoother. Stack with a Tubescreamer for compression and try rolling the tubescreamers tone knob down too.

 

[EDX]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

I'll mention the Way Huge Green Rhino again.

Most Tubescreamers cut low end. The GH's 100Hz knob will let you dial some of that back in, which will fatten the signal.

okey, now that sounds like a tubescreamer pedal that could bring the smooth into a crunchy solid state beast like the rg100es

 

[frankfalbo]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

Wampler's Euphoria is more expensive than $100, but I believe it would do it.

 

[some_dude]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

okey, now that sounds like a tubescreamer pedal that could bring the smooth into a crunchy solid state beast like the rg100es

Didn't realize we were talking about solid state. Not sure how well a tubescreamer will work. They were meant to drive tubes into clipping. Solid state behaves different... typically gets harsher when driven hard.

 

[Southbound Suarez]

Re: Help me find smooth, creamy sustaining notes with a crunchy amp

No tubes. The Randall is all solid state. And more importantly, I don't want to mess with my crunchy rhythm tone. I will try the Caline along with the Boss and see where that gets me.

Thanks to all so far for creating a list of things for me to try.

It all starts with 1) Your guitar 2) Your amp 3) Your speakers 4) Your effects. I would suggest you start by getting "creaminess and sustain" from your guitar and then running into a decent tube amp with the proper speakers and then the effects. All the pedal recommendations given here are what we call "putting the cart before the horse" and not addressing the primary issue. Even Johnny Winter (as good as he was) when playing through Randall solid state amps sounded absolutely horrid. I should know, as I saw him live up close and personal.