High Gain Discussion Thread

[some_dude]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

AFAIK Slash used SIR #39 (modded '70 SuperTrem) on the demos that became Live Like a Suicide. He wanted the same amp for Appetite for Destruction but it wasn't available, so SIR sent out #36 instead (modded metal panel SuperLead). Slash liked the amp so much that he stole it and it wasn't recovered for nearly a year. I have no idea what he used on Lies. When it was time to record Use Your Illusion, he went back to SIR and rented #39 again. That time it was available, but he wasn't happy with it and ended up using one of his Jubilees instead. Both Snakepit records are also supposed to be mostly Jubilee.

I don't know how familiar you are with Marshall Jubilees, but they really don't sound all that close to a JCM800. They're both classic Marshalls, but the Jubilee has quite a bit more gain and a VERY different frequency response and tone stack. I've owned a 2555 since 2001 and I had access to a JMP 2203 for several of those years, so I'm very familiar with both.


Slash played stock JCM800s during G'NR's early days, but recorded with a modded metal panel and switched to Silver Jubilees sometime in 1988. I haven't heard of him recording with an 800 (modded or otherwise) until Velvet Revolver.

I didn't think Slash was known for JCM800s, but I figured the information dr0 pulled off that website would've been somewhat accurate and didn't dig any deeper.

Thanks for the correction.

 

[Ben1962]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

Hate to say, never was the Biggest EVH fan( because of Dave), but lil Dreamer is one great riff and song

 

[Ben1962]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

I dont find that gain to be excessive at all.

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

For me, my first gain pedal was the afore-mentioned EH LPB-1 into my BF Bandmaster. (Parents hated it! )

Then came a Fender Blender. (Parents REALLY hated it!)

But for a high-gain AMP, it really starts with Randy Smith and the cascading-gain Boogie. He tells a great story about his circuit's patent application...."But...but...Mr. Smith...it will distort!"

You can really hear the amazing shift in tone and sustain on the early Santana records when he shifted from his Twins and G-K amps to the Boogie. Fender and Marshall were pretty slow to the channel-switching party. Many others followed, but very few came even close to capturing the smooth overdrive of the Boogie...and many still don't.

I love great BF Fenders, and the JCM 800, don't get me wrong. But the Boogie Mark III, IV and V are easier for me to work with, and I get the best of all worlds.

Bill

 

[dave74]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

Part 2 really gets into the company origins and the Santana connection.
Part 3 gets into the birth of high gain and cascading multi-gain stages.

 

[misterwhizzy]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

How did this thread get to page 3 without any mention of Dimebag or solid-state heaviness?

 

[Thundermtn]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

Yeah that is weird.

Seems like after he was murdered a lot of people backed off on trying to sound like him, maybe out of respect. You're not gonna sound like him anyway though. Plus that sound is so distinctive that most guitar dudes will bag on you for ripping off Pantera.

Didn't he run Triple Rec's and Century 200's for his live tone? I got to watch him from 8 ft away back in '96, dude was amazing!

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

Didn't he run Triple Rec's and Century 200's for his live tone? I got to watch him from 8 ft away back in '96, dude was amazing!

Definitely not Triple Rectifiers.

 

[Thundermtn]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

This was the stage gear he had when I saw him, live tone was killer.

 

[6stringerguy]

High Gain Discussion Thread

As far as I know with Dimebag used
Randall rg100,Randall century 200,Randall warhead,Randall x2, Krank krankenstein (live use in damageplan)
The only pickups he used in the bridge I believe were the Lawrence pickups especially the xl500l and then the dimebucker towards the end, not in the studio I believe
Neck pickups were all over the place, super distortion dimarzio, Lawrence stuff, flipped 59 bridge pickup
I have always loved dimes tone especially since he triple/quad tracked like a beast
He also used mxr EQ in front of the amp to saturate the amp even more then the PQ-3 to scoop the mids out, his tech Grady said they was so much gain that the amps would just feedback like crazy without the rocktron gates he used
But most of all his tone was in his fingers, he was one of the greatest players
However I believe that people don’t copy his tone since his just so associated with him, it’s so recognisable, the ultra scooped, thick and heavy rhythm tone with the super sharp and cutting hi end
The new Randall RGs are very similar to the old ones in tone too, the Korean dean dime models sound good too but damn I wish I saw Pantera live
I do have issue with dean and his estate shilling his name recognition to sell crap he never used like the cheap Chinese deans with bolt on neck with pickups he had no involvement in and the dime amp that was developed long after dime passed.
For me Dime defines a generation of metal alongside Metallica with that ultra scooped tone and air tight rhythm playing, he had it all for me, the riff chops, the attitude and the the technique among the best all without being overly smug about it, he managed to write both mellow and crushing songs while famously being one of the friendliest guys in the metal community.
RIP Dime

 

[6stringerguy]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

I’m not a fan of Dime’s tone.

To me a lot of my favourite guitarists don’t have the most appreciated tone,
Randy Rhoads (at least recorded) had awful tone, Dimebag (has awesome tone IMO) but a lot of people don’t like it, 90% of all black metal bands have deliberately bad tone but I still love it

 

[Gtrjunior]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

I’m not a fan of Dime’s tone.

To me a lot of my favourite guitarists don’t have the most appreciated tone,
Randy Rhoads (at least recorded) had awful tone, Dimebag (has awesome tone IMO) but a lot of people don’t like it, 90% of all black metal bands have deliberately bad tone but I still love it

I love Dime’s tone....for HIM.
It’s not anything I want coming out of my amp. But for him, it’s ridiculous tone.

 

[Thundermtn]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

For modern tone I think Mastodon has their stuff together. Thick and heavy with gobs of distortion, but it's still sort of open sounding with harmonic content and clarity.

 

[6stringerguy]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

For modern tone I think Mastodon has their stuff together. Thick and heavy with gobs of distortion, but it's still sort of open sounding with harmonic content and clarity.

Yeah mastodon and gojira for me are bastions of awesome thick heavy as balls tone

 

[evan47]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

I have the 20watt combo. Seems to be a vastly underrated series of amps. And it has the cascading gain stage thing, with two separate preamp gain sections. Doesn't sound very "hi-gain" to me, but i use a strat and the pickups are not exactly set high so that might have something to do with it. Still it seems a bit too saggy and creamy for the tight, djent sound. Not that i'm very interested in that sound.

The only guitar I had to play through it was one of the first MIM strats which I fitted a seymour duncan hot rails bridge pickup to the same week I bought it.
I remember it well, it was black with a rosewood board and white scratchplate.
I bought it intending to mod it from the onset.
I fitted a chrome finish scratch plate, hot rails bridge pickup, removed the covers from the middle and neck pickups and removed the tone pot while moving the remaining two pots into the lower of the two holes in the scratchplate so they did not get in my way, fitted black knobs and switch tip then finally blocked the trem discarding the arm.
I t looked a million dollars and played as well as any strat while sounding pure evil through the Laney aor. Oh the memories of blasting my rendition of sweet child of mine, heart breaker, aint talking bout love, et all from my bedroom in my folks house.

 

[Undone]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

Love this high-gain tone.

Thank you for that. Seriously. .....

 

[Securb]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

I’m not a fan of Dime’s tone.

Which one? He sounded vastly different in early Pantera, post-Cowboys, and Damageplan.

 

[mantis]

Re: High Gain Discussion Thread

High gain is Metal bro. Any Metal amp is High gain. Marshall basically was the first High gain amps on the market. Then many more followed.
I'm not exactly sure what your getting at with Mesa Boogie is what I understood what you don't like, which by the way everyone has their opinion of what good tone is but honestly if you hate on Mesa Boogie tone you kinda hate on High gain and metal. Mesa is a high end incredibly well built American High Gain amp company that has put out some of the best overall sounding amps on the planet. Not many amps in the world as as good or better at High gain them Mesa.
Peavey Put out some killer crazy sounding American High Gain amps like the loved 5150, Tripple XXX and the JSX which are amazing amps for anyone who like Metal music.
I don't see any need in a high gain amp if your not a Metal music player. The attack and tightness of high gain amps really don't make much sense for other kinds of music. Sure that's my opinion but If I was into Jazz,, country, Alternative or whatever I probably would be checking out more of a Rock style amp if I needed some gain for things like a Mesa LoneStar.

Sloppy playing is sloppy playing man, I don't care what kind of amp and setup you have, most of us guitar players and musicians will be able to point it out. You can't hide behind gain.