astrozombie
KatyPerryologist
What was that about? I look and I see vintage marshalls but hear modern day tones. How did he achieve that in 1973?
How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
- Thread starter astrozombie
- Start date
Vasshu the humanoid typhoon
Unseen
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Modern tones??
Like in dead overly dry and bassy stuff that is so tight it cannot even fart if it wanted to??
The guy I work for now and then, he was a roadie for LZ when they where in DK......could almost get a pencil under the 12th fret, and the strings where kinda worn and such...
Anyways......has everyone and their dead mums forgotten how loud these old bands where????
It is not hard to get an old Marshall to do what it does, making saturated tones.
And Page sounds like a mountain.
Modern tones??
Like in dead overly dry and bassy stuff that is so tight it cannot even fart if it wanted to??
The guy I work for now and then, he was a roadie for LZ when they where in DK......could almost get a pencil under the 12th fret, and the strings where kinda worn and such...
Anyways......has everyone and their dead mums forgotten how loud these old bands where????
It is not hard to get an old Marshall to do what it does, making saturated tones.
And Page sounds like a mountain.
Kamanda~SD
New member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
^ This. Volume is a huge factor.
^ This. Volume is a huge factor.
Vasshu the humanoid typhoon
Unseen
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Yeah and the moon showed up twice on the nightskies as well
They added a drive to the Hiwatt if I remember correctly....
Anyways forgot what the thing was with the Marshalls....but it did not stray much from what those usually sounds like!
Well louder than anyone do these days of in ear and all that sh!t
They usually just stuck a few mics elsewhere, if you look at the pictures from old concerts, almost never any closeup mics on amps!
Maybe one overhead for the drums and such....
Yeah and the moon showed up twice on the nightskies as well
They added a drive to the Hiwatt if I remember correctly....
Anyways forgot what the thing was with the Marshalls....but it did not stray much from what those usually sounds like!
Well louder than anyone do these days of in ear and all that sh!t
They usually just stuck a few mics elsewhere, if you look at the pictures from old concerts, almost never any closeup mics on amps!
Maybe one overhead for the drums and such....
dystrust
Well-known member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
The Hiwatt heads Page used from '69-'71 were SAP models which included a master volume and a foot-switchable boost function. His Marshalls did not have this, and I seriously doubt they were modded, at least not in '72-'73.
Has anyone here heard a fully cranked non-master Marshall? I still remember the first time I did, and I was blown away (almost literally). I was at a guitar shop after hours and an employee decided to test out a '73 100W metal panel that had come in used. He grabbed a historic LP, jumped the channels, cranked both to 6-8, and proceeded to play. Tone-wise it was very similar to JP on How the West Was Won, and words can hardly describe how skull-crushingly LOUD it was. The thing I remember most is looking around right after he quit playing, and seeing the guitars hanging on the wall behind me swaying.
The Hiwatt heads Page used from '69-'71 were SAP models which included a master volume and a foot-switchable boost function. His Marshalls did not have this, and I seriously doubt they were modded, at least not in '72-'73.
Has anyone here heard a fully cranked non-master Marshall? I still remember the first time I did, and I was blown away (almost literally). I was at a guitar shop after hours and an employee decided to test out a '73 100W metal panel that had come in used. He grabbed a historic LP, jumped the channels, cranked both to 6-8, and proceeded to play. Tone-wise it was very similar to JP on How the West Was Won, and words can hardly describe how skull-crushingly LOUD it was. The thing I remember most is looking around right after he quit playing, and seeing the guitars hanging on the wall behind me swaying.
Lake Placid Blues
New member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
From what I have been able to gather, his Marshalls were stock 69 Superleads with EL34 output tubes running through G12H30 speakers. EL34s and G12H30s pushed to their limits. Later on, in about 75, these amps were modified to use KT88 output tubes, which would have gave them greater head room and much greater wattage before they began to clip. His later live tone is cleaner to my ears.
However, he often used overdrives or fuzz boxes custom made and/or modified by Roger Mayer. According to some he also sometimes used an Echoplex as a preamp. Certainly an overdrive or a distortion was used to overdrive the Hiwatts when used.
I read in drum magazine article on John Bonham that he began using cranked Marshalls and Hiwatts live because Bohnam was such an unusually loud drummer. The drums would just bury the guitar amps in the mix otherwise.
From what I have been able to gather, his Marshalls were stock 69 Superleads with EL34 output tubes running through G12H30 speakers. EL34s and G12H30s pushed to their limits. Later on, in about 75, these amps were modified to use KT88 output tubes, which would have gave them greater head room and much greater wattage before they began to clip. His later live tone is cleaner to my ears.
However, he often used overdrives or fuzz boxes custom made and/or modified by Roger Mayer. According to some he also sometimes used an Echoplex as a preamp. Certainly an overdrive or a distortion was used to overdrive the Hiwatts when used.
I read in drum magazine article on John Bonham that he began using cranked Marshalls and Hiwatts live because Bohnam was such an unusually loud drummer. The drums would just bury the guitar amps in the mix otherwise.
Vasshu the humanoid typhoon
Unseen
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Well....yes have tried and played with it as well....
If you use a nice sounding cabinet, it is quite ok as well.
Fiddle around with few preamp tubes to find that sound that works.
Some Marshalls are sweet no matter the volume, some are stonehard no matter what.
Well....yes have tried and played with it as well....
If you use a nice sounding cabinet, it is quite ok as well.
Fiddle around with few preamp tubes to find that sound that works.
Some Marshalls are sweet no matter the volume, some are stonehard no matter what.
JeffB
Let it B
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Important....the g12h were 55hz..bass cones...old "100" logo 1982 cabs. By 73 some.experts say he was using a mix of 75 and 55hz cos he blew speaker
A killer t top and paf.. the t-top is key for his 72 onwards type tone..it's more nasal and tighter and clearer than the original double creme bridge..and it is almost always on with the neck pickup riding his volumes..
Extra mojo/eq/gain from an echoplex...
player skill and mojo beyond mortal comprehension
Important....the g12h were 55hz..bass cones...old "100" logo 1982 cabs. By 73 some.experts say he was using a mix of 75 and 55hz cos he blew speaker
A killer t top and paf.. the t-top is key for his 72 onwards type tone..it's more nasal and tighter and clearer than the original double creme bridge..and it is almost always on with the neck pickup riding his volumes..
Extra mojo/eq/gain from an echoplex...
player skill and mojo beyond mortal comprehension
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Depends how Clean/Straight the "Live" recording actually is.
Lots of knowledgeable points made already, and I will add one more.....A guitar amp, turned up to 7-8-9 (of 10) really beats the crap out of a pair (or however many) speakers. THAT is a sound unto itself as well.
Depends how Clean/Straight the "Live" recording actually is.
Lots of knowledgeable points made already, and I will add one more.....A guitar amp, turned up to 7-8-9 (of 10) really beats the crap out of a pair (or however many) speakers. THAT is a sound unto itself as well.
Brandenburg
New member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
after reading the topic of this thread.. all i can think of is "because he is jimmy 'f*ckin' Page..
after reading the topic of this thread.. all i can think of is "because he is jimmy 'f*ckin' Page..
vivanchenko
New member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Just record yourself playing through a Marshall amp and listen to the record - your tone will be a lot more saturated than what it seemed to be in real life. Also, keep your preamp low and power amp as high as possible and vu'a la - you get your jimmy page tone.
Just record yourself playing through a Marshall amp and listen to the record - your tone will be a lot more saturated than what it seemed to be in real life. Also, keep your preamp low and power amp as high as possible and vu'a la - you get your jimmy page tone.
beaubrummels
Well-known member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
I know little about Jimmy Page's actual rig used and all those anorek details, but I can offer one data point about how a vintage Marshall can make 'modern' saturated tones. In a recording studio in the 1990's I had a rare opportunity to play through what was Santana's 1968 Plexi with original straight back 4x12 cab. The studio engineer set it up, and plugged in the cable for me (wouldn't let me touch it, of course). There were no jumpers between the channels and no master volume. The first chord I hit sounded like the afterburner of a military jet howling away and it was ****ing loud. Sounded like the speakers were blown, but when I backed off and played clean they were clear. I guess just pushed to their limits without getting blown. But that 1968 Marshall amp and cab combo did sweet saturation way better than my fizzy ice pick JCM head/cab has ever been able to. The clip Jeff posted was pretty much it. The only other song off the top of my head I can think of that made that exact same sound I heard out of that 1968 Plexi/cab is Smashing Pumpkins Rhinoceros (starting at 3:04)
Edit: here's another clip from the same EP that really is what a vintage Plexi through a vintage cab sounds like when standing in front of it. (Listen to the rhythm guitar track)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90v2hrrijds
I know little about Jimmy Page's actual rig used and all those anorek details, but I can offer one data point about how a vintage Marshall can make 'modern' saturated tones. In a recording studio in the 1990's I had a rare opportunity to play through what was Santana's 1968 Plexi with original straight back 4x12 cab. The studio engineer set it up, and plugged in the cable for me (wouldn't let me touch it, of course). There were no jumpers between the channels and no master volume. The first chord I hit sounded like the afterburner of a military jet howling away and it was ****ing loud. Sounded like the speakers were blown, but when I backed off and played clean they were clear. I guess just pushed to their limits without getting blown. But that 1968 Marshall amp and cab combo did sweet saturation way better than my fizzy ice pick JCM head/cab has ever been able to. The clip Jeff posted was pretty much it. The only other song off the top of my head I can think of that made that exact same sound I heard out of that 1968 Plexi/cab is Smashing Pumpkins Rhinoceros (starting at 3:04)
Edit: here's another clip from the same EP that really is what a vintage Plexi through a vintage cab sounds like when standing in front of it. (Listen to the rhythm guitar track)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90v2hrrijds
Last edited:
Chickenwings
Alnico 6/8
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
Les Paul into a cranked marshall stack.
This stuff is not rocket science.
It's just the sound of rock music.
Les Paul into a cranked marshall stack.
This stuff is not rocket science.
dystrust
Well-known member
Re: How did Jimmy Page get his raw, saturated live sound?
The choice of example is a bit amusing, considering the different gear used. All of Gish was recorded with an ADA MP-1 into the low input of an early 80s JCM800 2203 loaded with KT-88s and run through a Marshall 4x12 of similar vintage. It's hard to say what speakers were in the cab, but they were probably G12-65s or G12M70s based on the age of the head (they were bought together). Guitars were a stock early/mid 70s Strat and late 70s / early 80s LP Custom. Slunk is an outtake from the same session, so it's likely that the same gear was used. I've always thought the tone on Gish was a bit bright and furry, and didn't sound anything like the NMV Marshalls I've heard. Then again the only vintage NMVs I've heard up close were early 70s metal panels and a '67 JTM50 with tube rectifier.
The choice of example is a bit amusing, considering the different gear used. All of Gish was recorded with an ADA MP-1 into the low input of an early 80s JCM800 2203 loaded with KT-88s and run through a Marshall 4x12 of similar vintage. It's hard to say what speakers were in the cab, but they were probably G12-65s or G12M70s based on the age of the head (they were bought together). Guitars were a stock early/mid 70s Strat and late 70s / early 80s LP Custom. Slunk is an outtake from the same session, so it's likely that the same gear was used. I've always thought the tone on Gish was a bit bright and furry, and didn't sound anything like the NMV Marshalls I've heard. Then again the only vintage NMVs I've heard up close were early 70s metal panels and a '67 JTM50 with tube rectifier.
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