Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

S

SF audio

New member
I have this idea about a CC and pearly gates hybrid, which would be the big midrange/soft top end of the CC and the bite of the PG (might sound counter intuitive, I know). I had a conversation with the custom shop today and they said the CC would dominate the sound about 60/40 as it higher output, and they would combine to make an output of 11K. And the fact that one coil is quite a bit hotter than the other, their might be slight 60mz hum issues.

Anyways, its still $160, and while the pickup won't sound bad, you never know if its what you want and how it would work in your specific guitar. Quite possibly a $160 mistake...

Has anyone done a hybrid pickup from the custom shop and liked what you got? Or didn't?

Or, is it easy enough to make a hybrid yourself?
 
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Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

I have a PGn/Antiquity hybrid from the custom shop. Sounds great. Very clean and complex. Both of the coils in my pickup are pretty evenly matched in output, though.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

The matched coils found in almost all humbuckers reduce noise, treble, and clarity, & add midrange and output. With hybrid humbuckers, part of the 'humbucker effect' is negated, because of the unmatched coils. Some degree of the unmatched sound is single coil. That means you're losing some midrange and adding some high end. The more unbalanced they are, the greater the loss of mids and addition of highs. It's not like the sound of the two coils are blended, because you're introducing a third dynamic: you're changing the factor that makes them sound like humbuckers in the first place.

When creating a humbucker, a good winder carefully crafts it's tone based on years of experience. When you combine two coils that were never meant to be together, then add in the partial loss of the humbucker effect, it becomes hard for anyone to predict just what the results will be. How similar (or how different) are the two coils in wind patterns and tensions? What effect will that have? How much of the humbucker effect is lost? A lot of variables at play.

The big difference between coils in the '59/Custom (7K vs 4.2K) makes it a bright pickup; some players think they need a warmer magnet to offset that. Because of the reduction of the humbucker effect, an 8K hybrid (4.5 + 3.5) can be brighter than a 7.5K humbucker with balanced coils. That's exactly what I'm going for in most of my hybrids: a neck PU with more treble and clarity, and less mids.

You can experiment with your own hybrids. Look for deals on some used humbuckers. You can make your own CC/PG or '59/Custom hybrid and save money.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

There are several threads on here about making your own hybrids, and I am guessing that a couple of used pickups would come in less than a Custom Shop piece. But those wires are very tiny. How are your electronics skills?
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

It is very easy to make a hybrid yourself, if you understand how humbuckers are put together.

I would recommend looking up basic humbucker construction, reading one or two of the threads on making hybrids, and then experimenting on a few cheap-o pickups before diving in to a Duncan.

FWIW, the pickup you are envisioning is only about 100 screw coil windings and an A2 magnet away from being an A2 '59/C Hybrid. IIRC, the PGb has only about 100 fewer windings per coil than the '59b. It's so close, especially when you consider that it's the weaker coil in the hybrid that has the 100 wind difference, that I would just go for an A2 '59/C Hybrid.

The hybrid I'd really love to try out is JB screw coil with a Seth neck stud coil, wired to be splittable to the JB screw coil.
 
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Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

ESP is putting out a bunch of customs or something with JB/59 hybrids in the bridge (yes it's one pickup not a JB+59 set), and that's about as different as 2 humbucker coils can get, and it works pretty well in the youtube demos

Guitars they're in are like $5k + tax and don't seem to be gimmicks, either...

https://espguitars.co.jp/original/amorous/amorous_nt.html
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

blueman335 said:
The matched coils found in almost all humbuckers reduce noise, treble, and clarity, & add midrange and output. With hybrid humbuckers, part of the 'humbucker effect' is negated, because of the unmatched coils. Some degree of the unmatched sound is single coil. That means you're losing some midrange and adding some high end. The more unbalanced they are, the greater the loss of mids and addition of highs. It's not like the sound of the two coils are blended, because you're introducing a third dynamic: you're changing the factor that makes them sound like humbuckers in the first place.

When creating a humbucker, a good winder carefully crafts it's tone based on years of experience. When you combine two coils that were never meant to be together, then add in the partial loss of the humbucker effect, it becomes hard for anyone to predict just what the results will be. How similar (or how different) are the two coils in wind patterns and tensions? What effect will that have? How much of the humbucker effect is lost? A lot of variables at play.

The big difference between coils in the '59/Custom (7K vs 4.2K) makes it a bright pickup; some players think they need a warmer magnet to offset that. Because of the reduction of the humbucker effect, an 8K hybrid (4.5 + 3.5) can be brighter than a 7.5K humbucker with balanced coils. That's exactly what I'm going for in most of my hybrids: a neck PU with more treble and clarity, and less mids.

You can experiment with your own hybrids. Look for deals on some used humbuckers. You can make your own CC/PG or '59/Custom hybrid and save money.
Click to expand...

Seems that the CC and PG coils would be too unbalanced and not work out as well. The question is what difference in output per coil is acceptable. The difference between the CC and PG is quite a bit, probably too much?
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

not much different than a custom and 59 id think so not sure what the issue would be
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

Has anyone done a custom/59 hybrid with an A2 mag?

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

Picture a 59/C with more mids to counter the comb filtering effect of the mismatched coils, and with a softer spongier attack. The A2 also moves it closer to the vintage end of the spectrum.

It can also be described as a less "lethargic" Custom Custom with a 3D quality to it as well.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

So their is a comb filtering effect that is noticeable? Even with more mids from the A2 mag?

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

There are noticeably less mids than with a Custom Custom, but it is still a very middy pickup.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

SF audio said:
Has anyone done a custom/59 hybrid with an A2 mag?

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I think the guy who started the original thread re the 59/Custom, Bach2Rock, said that the A2 ended up being his preference. I don't remember why he preferred the A2.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

ItsaBass said:
FWIW, the pickup you are envisioning is only about 100 screw coil windings and an A2 magnet away from being an A2 '59/C Hybrid.
Click to expand...

It isn't only the wire material, thickness, and number of turns which determines the tone. If it were, Duncan would have like 10 identical pickups with a different name.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

Clint 55 said:
It isn't only the wire material, thickness, and number of turns which determines the tone. If it were, Duncan would have like 10 identical pickups with a different name.
Click to expand...

How does that statement follow what you quoted?

My point was that the pickup he is talking about spending perhaps $200 on is only 100 turns [on the weaker of the two coils] away from one that he can get with a simple mag swap on an $80 pickup (or however much '59/C Hybrids retail for).

FWIW, this is a point that was originally made to me by Frank Falbo, and he wasn't even talking about the hybrid. He was talking about '59 vs. PG. He said you might as well just put an A2 in your '59, rather than buying a PG, because the results will be the same in the real world. Again, that's in a pickup with near equal coils. The difference in a hybrid with one dominant coil would be even less.
 
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Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

I dunno. I don't see the point in saying the 59 and PG are the same and then making up bs about the only difference between them is 100 turns. Lmao. They sound extremely different. And even a layman such as me knows that the pattern and tension also differentiate the wind.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

Clint 55 said:
I dunno. I don't see the point in saying the 59 and PG are the same and then making up bs about the only difference between them is 100 turns. Lmao. They sound extremely different. And even a layman such as me knows that the pattern and tension also differentiate the wind.
Click to expand...

You don't see the point in trying to save a forum bro a hundred bucks for the same result, then.

I didn't make up b.s. Nor did I say the only difference between a '59b and a PGb is 100 turns; I said it was 100 turns and a mag swap. I said I was told by Frank Falbo that this wind difference, and the A2 magnet are easily within an amp's e.q. range of being the same pickup.
 
Re: Hybrid coil pickups from the customshop

ive tried an a2 59n, seth neck and pgn. they are all pretty close dcr and use the same wire as far as i can tell, and are wound on the same machine but the pgn sounds different to me. 100 turns isnt all that much, most people probably couldnt hear the difference.

that said, if i wanted a hybrid, id just buy two used pups and do it myself rather than going cs
 
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