I can't make strat's sing!

[blueman335]

Re: I can't make strat's sing!

unless you're like me and really are suicidally curious as to why Blueman thinks that Gibson innovated in 1958 more than Fender has since its inception.

Since you must know (and remember, you started it this time by asking, so just wait until dad, or Erik, gets home!):

Besides the world's most valuable guitars (outside of those owned by certain players), 1958-1960 Sunburst LP's are going for $300,000+ these days, which is 5 or 10 times as much as almost anything other electric made in the 1950's, there's:

- the 335, one of the most innovative designs ever, part solid, part hollow body, that has been copied by almost all manufacturers, including Fender.

- The Flying V, a rock/blues/metal favorite, also inspired no end of copies.

- The Explorer, another one that's inspired plenty of copies.

Who else came up with this many completely different original designs, that are still in production today and have had significant sales for decades? Gibson did all this in one year. Too bad they ran out of steam before the next decade was up.

And please Dangly, don't even joke about being "suicidally curious", we need you on this forum man.

 

[ErikH]

Re: I can't make strat's sing!

Since you must know (and remember, you started it this time by asking, so just wait until dad, or Erik, gets home!):

Ha ha, funny. My point is, and it was missed apparently, is that the designs from both manufacturers are so different from each other that it doesn't really matter. They are guitars and many players love both plus many more.

For me, a Fender style guitar, Strats specifically, work better for me. I love Les Pauls and appreciate them for what they are, as well as other Gibson designs, but they don't fit me right. I've owned 2 Les Pauls and an SG in the past so I know how they feel.

I could care less how much a guitar made in the 50's costs today. I'm not going to buy one. I buy them to play, not because of resale value. That's not a concern of mine.

It's like a pair of shoes. Everyone is different. It's all personal preference.

 

[uOpt]

Re: I can't make strat's sing!

Gibson is more innovative, having released more new designs than Fender.

True.

However, Fender had difficulties introducing new designs because people like Tele and Strat as they are. Heck, people didn't even buy the "Lead" and other Strat derivates.

Most of Gibson's new designs were forced by their customers just not accepting their existing design:

• first they make the Les Paul as a response to the Fenders, which turns out to be too conservative and awkwards (fret access and weight) and sounds too old-fashioned for that decade's sound.
• Gibson has been unable to demostrate the obvious advantages of their design, which is sound as in "singing". More players can make more Les Pauls "sing" than Fenders. As we move to the end of the fifties we approach a time when they could use that sound.
• Some idiot suit at Gibson HQ decides that it is all about fashion and forms and thinks that the problems can be corrected by introducing two designs that have non-purpose shapes, one can't be played sitting down, one repositions the arm to where guitar players aren't used to. Great guitars but not mass-appeal "pratical", plain and simple. (58 V and Explorer)
• Having realized it's not just about shape and looks, some other idiot suit comes in and wants to radically "fix" the actual problems: weight and fret access. They design something too thin that breaks by even looking at it sharply and they got a head heavy guitar that now is often difficult to play standing. The SG. The sound is great for some things but thin for some upcoming music and not bright as required by past "surf" music.
• To ensure a complete mess they drop the Les Paul, which would have gotten them the tonal advantage in that decade's changes.

So I can hardly think that Gibson deserves extra credit for introducing these models, although of course now it's great we have these extra designs.

 

[blueman335]

Re: I can't make strat's sing!

Ha ha, funny. My point is, and it was missed apparently, is that the designs from both manufacturers are so different from each other that it doesn't really matter. They are guitars and many players love both plus many more.

Like PU's, amps, strings, picks, & most of all tone, our personal preferences for guitars will come up & get tossed around from time to time (oh no!). If you've heard it all before, plug your ears (or cover your eyes). If it was all the same membership for the last 10 years, good God it would be boring, like an old married couple that rarely talks to each other.

New guys on the forum make us revisit old subjects, give us something to talk about, more viewpoints get aired, and occasionally we start to look at things in a different way. Everyone benefits. Even Dangly thinks I'm mellowing with old age. Now that's progress.

And when it all gets down to it, music is in our fingers & our heads, and if need be, we could adapt to whatever tools are at hand. So all this talk of PU's, guitars, and equipment is really done with that ever-present in the background. We're obsessed with gear, which is neat, clean, and quantifiable, but it's not music without human hands.

 

[Stratman]

Re: I can't make strat's sing!

Keep it away from the mike then... utahere:

 

[jerryjg]

Re: I can't make strat's sing!

And when it all gets down to it, music is in our fingers & our heads, and if need be, we could adapt to whatever tools are at hand. .

I couldnt disagree more. Why do you think weare all so intenesivly into this deal?
The music is right there in the wood..the pickups.
WE can only take it so far as what it is..Its true, that once given the best artists tools, the possibilites are limiltless, but Im so sick and tired of this belief that the skilled musician could take a 400.00 Harmony guitar just as far as he could a 1961 Gibson 335 because its all in his head and hands. I call BS!!!!