I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

[zionstrat]

So I'm a complete tube snob when I can be- Studio always, bedroom always and live when I can.

But I've had multiple modeling rigs for years (Roland GT100 in the early 90s), because you can't always take everything with you, and in the mix, it's pretty impossible to tell the difference (if you don't believe me, the next time you're tubeing with a great FOH engineer, get him to solo your track- to get guitar sitting in the mix, they usually have to thin out most of the tube thickness).

Anyway, I got creative (read lazy) recently when I didn't want to take pedals and tube out for a little gig, so I combined my Boss GT10 with a Fender Mustang and my mind was blown...

I had planned to use the GT for FX only, but started with a complex patch that fades from a blackface to a plexi with all the beautiful in between tones-

It turns out that as I drove the GT10 from clean to crunch, it 'naturally' overloaded the blackface model in the Mustang and I had an entirely new pallet of in between sounds to play with! And when I switched over to my Mustang's hyper crunch setting (SuperSonic model), it did the same thing- lots more chewy harmonic goodness...

In retrospect, it makes sense, the Mustang is a smart enough model to respond to input gain changes, but I had always imagined that modle + model wasn't necessarily good.

In retrospect, in the studio we stack up modeled plug ins by the dozen and that works great, so clearly the old dog wasn't getting the new trick.

 

[Gtrjunior]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

I’ve never had much luck with modelers.
I’ve never tied the newest generation though, the axe Fx and kempers etc.
I did have a GT10 but I just could never get what I wanted out of it.
Glad you are able to make it work for you!

 

[justFred]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

have tried: Mustang; Amplifi; CODE; GT-001...never got close...spent a week with a friends Fractal Axe-FX II and have ordered one...side by side with my PRRI it was near impossible to tell the difference...going thru a few cabs the Fractal sounded better in some cases...wouldn't recommend a buy to anyone else at this point...after spending six months with it may be able to give thumbs up or down...

 

[Mincer]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

I never could get on with the Mustang I had, and sold it. I couldn't get a Line 6 amp to sound right, either. However, I love the Peavey VIP series, and the Fractal..and the new HX effects is sounding really good.

 

[IM4Tone]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

This phase will pass.
Tried a modeler and tried a multi-effect pedal modeler. The amp modeler was just OK, but the pedal....not.
The amp modeler (a Vypyr) is gone, and the digitech RP355 has been collecting dust for a couple of years. JMO

 

[Silence Kid]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

For lower apartment-level volume my cheap GarageBand/PA rig sounds better than 'holding back' on any amp.

 

[orangecountycarl]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Modelers are meh. This is why my Kemper is the only thing that sounds as good as my amps.

 

[Mincer]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

EEh, my Fractal does the modeling thing really well. It is a far cry from most Line 6 and Digitech boxes.

 

[zionstrat]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Modelers are meh. This is why my Kemper is the only thing that sounds as good as my amps.

OK, I thought Fractal and Kemper were the kings of modeling., so what am I missing?

 

[jeremy]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

i think they are great but they dont feel the same as a good tube amp, and since i already have a collection of great tube amps ill keep using em.

 

[devastone]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Just upgraded from a GT-100 to a GT-1000, mostly because I got a great deal through Prymaxe. The difference in tone and feel is amazing, can't compare it to the Helix, Headrush, or Fractal, but it sounds great and I could tell a big difference through the PA and in my in-ears yesterday.

Comparing the old GTs and RPs to today's modeling in like comparing this:

To this:

 

[Gtrjunior]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

i think they are great but they dont feel the same as a good tube amp, and since i already have a collection of great tube amps ill keep using em.

I was going to ask about that.
I’ve never played a Kemper or Axe Fx. There is a local AC/DC cover band that uses them and they sound great. But I’ve often wondered if they have the same feel.

 

[Jacew]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Just upgraded from a GT-100 to a GT-1000, mostly because I got a great deal through Prymaxe. The difference in tone and feel is amazing, can't compare it to the Helix, Headrush, or Fractal, but it sounds great and I could tell a big difference through the PA and in my in-ears yesterday.

Comparing the old GTs and RPs to today's modeling in like comparing this:

To this:

Well, I greatly prefer the first pictures example...

 

[devastone]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Not sure I follow, but yes, the tone was much better on the original suitcase cell phones.

 

[Mincer]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Yeah, the 'feel' is different. Not worse, just different. I understand hanging on to tube amps- I love mine. But my back doesn't at the end of the night, and I can't get the same range of tones.

 

[DKSEARS]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

i think they are great but they dont feel the same as a good tube amp, and since i already have a collection of great tube amps ill keep using em.

That’s kind of the way I feel at this point. I just turned 50 and can finally afford some of the amps that I always wanted. So I’m going to enjoy them while I can.


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[Gtrjunior]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Yeah, the 'feel' is different. Not worse, just different. I understand hanging on to tube amps- I love mine. But my back doesn't at the end of the night, and I can't get the same range of tones.

Is there any kind of latency with these amps or are they pretty responsive?

 

[Demanic]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

i think they are great but they dont feel the same as a good tube amp, and since i already have a collection of great tube amps ill keep using em.

I know that I've mentioned this before, but this thread gives me a chance to say it again. I know that there's plenty of great tube amps out there that I'd never be able to afford. And that even if I could, that I couldn't justify to myself spending thousands of dollars on for what to me is now pretty much just a hobby. So when I found what was at one time a top of the line modeler combined with a power amp designed by Bogner, for less than $400, I took it. Flexibility of a modeler, tube amp "feel". Spidervalve HDII. They can be had fairly cheap now and I'm surprised that no one seems to still be using them.

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[justFred]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

trying the Fractal many because even little 12W 5E3 is too loud for around the house playing...magnificent tone is between 7 and 10...that will rattle windows...attenuating ruins the tone...don't know why...
secondly, like Mincer said...the ability to seek out new sounds...love 10" speakers for their responsiveness....how about a 5E3 with a 4 X 10 extension cab or, or ,or...that is where Fractal comes in...really hope it works out...
keeping my tube amps...

 

[Mincer]

Re: I love tubes, but can't get over how flexible modeling has become

Is there any kind of latency with these amps or are they pretty responsive?

They are indeed as responsive, but you get out of them what you put in them. They aren't devices if you don't obsess about the tone, since you can go into all sorts of detail.