Intonating a tune o matic bridge

[Sleeping Martyr]

Iwas just wondering, I've been fine tuning the intonation on my SG and Les paul and on BOTh of them the low E string is a bit flat at the 12th fret yet the saddle is adjusted right to the front?? I can't adjust it anymore?? so whats the solution here guys?? The Truss rods are fine, the necks are straight and the action is good with little buzz. . . . how do I fix the intonation?? thanks

One little side note, I have some buzz on the open d string near the nut that was not there before adjusting the truss rod. All the other strings are fine just the D. Do I need a new nut with a higher slot for the D or is there some other solution, sorry to cram a whole bunch of questions into one thread, thanks again

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

Sometimes just giving the string a good tug or two right at the 12th fret or so snaps it back into shape. Then sometimes the string is just bad, or was good and then goes bad and just won't intonate right no matter what. If tugging doesn't work, just replace the string.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

Towards the nut until fretted matches the harmonic. See soundoff for caveat on this statement.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

The front? The low E is supposed to be almost at the butt end of the guitar, definitely not toward the neck. If the Low E is toward the neck, go the other direction, and your intonation should probably fall into place. If you really need more travel, sometimes you can flip the saddle around, so you've got an extra few millimeters.

Go on Ebay, and look at closeup pictures of Les Pauls, and you'll see the pattern yours should look like.

 

[big_black]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

The front? The low E is supposed to be almost at the butt end of the guitar, definitely not toward the neck. If the Low E is toward the neck, go the other direction, and your intonation should probably fall into place. If you really need more travel, sometimes you can flip the saddle around, so you've got an extra few millimeters.

My SG intonates at the 12th and 17th when the saddles are pretty much in the middle of the bridge.

I think I've noticed more than one intonation point when I've adjusted. Is that possible?

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

My SG intonates at the 12th and 17th when the saddles are pretty much in the middle of the bridge.

I think I've noticed more than one intonation point when I've adjusted. Is that possible?

No. There's only one exact point in the saddle's travel where all the notes on the neck read as close to dead center on the tuner as possible. I like using a real sensitive digital tuner, and I start fretting notes from about the 8th fret to the 20th, and try to make the tuner stay centered on all of them. Once all the strings are intonated as close as mathematically possible (since it's never 100%), the guitar should stay in tune perfectly, and all the chords across the fretboard should ring like a bell. The only thing that can ruin that is when the nut slots aren't cut low or wide enough. In the Vault, I posted that thread about nutwork using no files.....check that out. I do that on all my guitars, and the nut slots are always seated perfectly, and don't pinch the strings anymore. It's a great technique if you don't want to invest in costly files.

 

[big_black]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

No. There's only one exact point in the saddle's travel where all the notes on the neck read as close to dead center on the tuner as possible.

That's what I thought. This was before I bothered to go past the 12th fret.

In the Vault, I posted that thread about nutwork using no files.....check that out. I do that on all my guitars, and the nut slots are always seated perfectly, and don't pinch the strings anymore. It's a great technique if you don't want to invest in costly files.

Yeah, I saw that when you first posted it, just haven't go around to doing it yet.

 

[Dirtyking]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

The only thing that can ruin that is when the nut slots aren't cut low or wide enough. In the Vault, I posted that thread about nutwork using no files.....check that out. I do that on all my guitars, and the nut slots are always seated perfectly, and don't pinch the strings anymore.

Totally....I had problems when I switched to 11-52 strings. I replaced the nut with a graphite nut with wider slots and problem solved. And good strings are a must.

 

[neosadist]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

Iwas just wondering, I've been fine tuning the intonation on my SG and Les paul and on BOTh of them the low E string is a bit flat at the 12th fret yet the saddle is adjusted right to the front?? I can't adjust it anymore?? so whats the solution here guys?? The Truss rods are fine, the necks are straight and the action is good with little buzz. . . . how do I fix the intonation?? thanks One little side note, I have some buzz on the open d string near the nut that was not there before adjusting the truss rod. All the other strings are fine just the D. Do I need a new nut with a higher slot for the D or is there some other solution, sorry to cram a whole bunch of questions into one thread, thanks again

I use the ESP Owner's Manual (available at their website as a PDF file) to remember how to do it. Mine says tune 12th fret harmonic, then fret on 12th and if it's sharp, move saddle AWAY from string (makes string longer), and if flat do the opposite.

 

[The Golden Boy]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

Is the saddle turned so that the slanted edge is facing the bridge? You can get the equivalent of a few thread turns of traverse by turning the saddle around.

Otherwise, try replacing the string. I had an issue with a bad string on one of my basses. Out of 20+ years I'd never had a "bad" string, and this wacky intonation issue drove me nuts. It turned out that the winds on the string were goofed and it moved the intonation point just behind the bridge pickup on my Jazz bass.

 

[neosadist]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

Is the saddle turned so that the slanted edge is facing the bridge? You can get the equivalent of a few thread turns of traverse by turning the saddle around. Otherwise, try replacing the string. I had an issue with a bad string on one of my basses. Out of 20+ years I'd never had a "bad" string, and this wacky intonation issue drove me nuts. It turned out that the winds on the string were goofed and it moved the intonation point just behind the bridge pickup on my Jazz bass.

It looks like this:

NECK -----------------------|\---|| BRIDGE

Er, oops, thought that was a question. But for what it's worth, for the dude who was needing the intonation help, it looks like that above....

 

[Aceman]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

The bottom line here is that the harmonic and the 12th fret fretted note need to be the same. Every guitar/string-string guage/neck bow/plus other little things makes the intoned spot unique. Turn the screw whichever way gets the harmonic and the fretted note correct.

Also- If you know you play heavy handed, you may want to intone slightly flat to compensate for your palying style. That's an advanced move though...

And I was loaded last night Jonser! I can't be held responsible for getting my directions, among otherthings crossed!!!!

 

[neosadist]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

The bottom line here is that the harmonic and the 12th fret fretted note need to be the same. Every guitar/string-string guage/neck bow/plus other little things makes the intoned spot unique. Turn the screw whichever way gets the harmonic and the fretted note correct. Also- If you know you play heavy handed, you may want to intone slightly flat to compensate for your palying style. That's an advanced move though... And I was loaded last night Jonser! I can't be held responsible for getting my directions, among otherthings crossed!!!!

I do have a question though. For some reason when I set the action on my electric at just slightly above the ESP minimum action, then set the pickups just a little farther away from the strings than Seymour Duncan recommends, then intonate, the fretted note is still sharper than the harmonic. I tune the entire guitar on the harmonic before I begin, and often, to make sure. Should I try messing with the truss rod? If so, which direction should I crank it? I don't have a long enough straight edge to work with it, but when I fret at the first and last fret on both sides, the strings seem to have enough space between the 12th fret and the string itself. I can't really tell how much bow there is. Also, mine's a bolt-on neck. Should the fretboard and the neck be perfectly parallel, or should they be slightly different in angle? (and if so, which direction?) Thanks.

 

[Scott_F]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

I had an Epi les paul that wouldn't intonate that string for all the tea in china. I sold it pretty quickly. also, be sure you're using a good tuner.

Looking back with the knowledge I've gained, I'm sure I was just screwing something up on that Epi.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Intonating a tune o matic bridge

The easiest way to tell how much bow is in the neck is to hold the big E string down at the first fret and the fret where the neck hits the body (12-15th or so) should be a slight gap in the middle frets of a millimeter or 2. This assumes that the neck isn't warped/twisted etc.