Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

The Norton is a clearer pickup if you want to go Dimarzio. Much cooler overall pickup...better balance, nicer top end.

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Yea, saying that the CC has less "headroom" than the Custom was figurative and not to be taken literally.

When I had the CC in the same guitar that had a Custom (and C5 and JB), the same amp was MUCH harder to get a clean sound out of.

The Alnico ll mag with the extra windings of the Custom series added up to a very distorted pickup for my taste.

The C5 on the other hand with the alnico V had no body and a shrill top end. The regular ol' Custom sounded the most balanced despite the ceramic magnet. I see why Seymour originally went with the ceramic mag in the Custom (the CC was added later and the C5 MUCH later).

In the same guitar my early 80's JB was noticabley more full bodied, with a thicker (more midrangey) and less trebly sound than any of the custom pickups.

Just my 2 cents! Peace.

Depends on the setup and the guitar also. The JB has a lot more high end than any of the customs.

 

[smauk43]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

The Norton is a clearer pickup if you want to go Dimarzio. Much cooler overall pickup...better balance, nicer top end.

Got a Norton in the neck with the Super Distortion. Tone Zone/Hum from Hell in the other. Time to try out some Duncans.

 

[Mac-P]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Oh yea, I agree, the Tone Zone is WAAAY over rated. But I hate the same thing about the CC. They both are too distorted all the time. No full bodied clean tones.

The Air Zone is a much better take on the same idea. One of the best buckers DiMarzio makes for my taste. That and the Breed are sort of similar to the JB.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

First of all, "Hair Metal" = Boss Metal Zone on 10 w/ mid scooped, chorus with delay adjust set fairly long, and generic reverb set on about 1/3. Instant Talk Dirty to Me, Round and Round, or anything off of Whitesnake. Add a straight delay for a few repeats and it's instant Def Lep Hysteria. Any pup in a two by four through that over-effected setup will get the tone you seek.

I've been using a ToneZone through a solid state amp a my Frehley setup-du-jour. The T-zone compresses nicely for that Marshall to the wall tone.

And I love the CC in a Paul. My epi is not as dark as the typical real Paul, but I find it to be the pup equivelent of crunchy peanut butter - smooth an creamy on top, with a nice crunchy surprise in the middle. I think it's got more of a fat/smooth thing on the top - not "dark" at all. And putting the top couple of screws up a notch or so gives it a nice treble boost (That would be a volume boost to the fat sound) - Isn't that Theodies rec? Or maybe Lew? Either way it's a good thing.

 

[Mac-P]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

The JB has a lot more high end than any of the customs.

I disagree. Not in my experience. But hey, if you play with different amps and with different amounts of gain then different pickups respond differently.

I play with a lot of clean and semi-clean sounds. That may be different than your rig/perspective/ears.

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Oh yea, I agree, the Tone Zone is WAAAY over rated. But I hate the same thing about the CC. They both are too distorted all the time. No full bodied clean tones.

The Air Zone is a much better take on the same idea. One of the best buckers DiMarzio makes for my taste. That and the Breed are sort of similar to the JB.

You can make your own 'air' pickups. n

Here is how you do it (but keep it secret....shhhhh) :smack: insert a piece of hard rubber or a like material (plastic is what Dimarzio uses) between the magnet and the back of the coils. Thats right folks, Air technology is a piece of plastic.


Not really all that technical....

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

I disagree. Not in my experience. But hey, if you play with different amps and with different amounts of gain then different pickups respond differently.

I play with a lot of clean and semi-clean sounds. That may be different than your rig/perspective/ears.

I spend most of my time on a Mathless Lightnin....straight up clean. Most of my other time is on a Harry Joyce...also very clean.

The Custom are a pretty common alternative for people that do not like hte JB's shrill tendencies. Do a search on this site, its the place to look up lots of JB related problems.

 

[smauk43]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Oh I should have said thanks for all the input, learning something with nearly every post. Much appreciated. :beerchug:

 

[Mac-P]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

I spend most of my time on a Mathless Lightnin....straight up clean. Most of my other time is on a Harry Joyce...also very clean.

The Custom are a pretty common alternative for people that do not like hte JB's shrill tendencies. Do a search on this site, its the place to look up lots of JB related problems.

Hey bro, I appreciate the conversation.

I don;t really "need" to do a search man, but thanks. I've been a member of the Duncan forum since it started on the old board. I had over 1500 posts there (not the hugest number by todays standards, but high for back then - I don't have that much time to devote to being on the board so much). They wiped our counts clean when this board started.

Have owned TOO many pickups, including all the ones mentioned ones here. Currently play in a bunch of bands, teach guitar full time. Huge gear head. Big fan of clear guitar sounds. Know plenty of people here for years, and have had may great conversaions and have learned a lot from many players. I'd like to think people have learned from me as well.

I don't mean any more by that than to say that although you may mean well, your advice that I "Do a search on this site" for information that I've known about for almost 20 years can be considered a bit condescending, even if you don't mean it that way.

If your ears hear things differently than mine, fine. Say that. But don't say it is a fact.

Myself (and many others on this board) think that a C5 is MUCH brighter than a JB. As a matter of fact I had one of the first C5's back in 2002 custom wound by MJ herself. It was MUCH brighter (and thinner) than either of my two JB's (one an early 80's and one a mid 90's) in the same '91 Gibson SG standard, clean. The Custom was less bright than the C5, but the JB is warmer than both (including a CC which like I said distorted too easy).

The lack of mids in a C5 makes the high end the dominating frequency in the mix with a band (again, in MY experience). And the ceramic magnet in the regular custom adds a certain "hardness" in the upper frequencies that sounds more shrill to my ears.

The JB has more audible mid content so that is the voicing of that pickup more than the highs. Tons of people hear it the way I do. Some hear it your way. People often confuse upper mids with treble. Not saying you do, just saying that people do that.

Obviously you've had different experiences. That's fine. But please resist the temptation to be condescending and state things as FACT.

I mean no disrespect by any of this. All the best bro. Peace.

 

[ranalli]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Hey bro, I appreciate the conversation.

I don;t really "need" to do a search man, but thanks. I've been a member of the Duncan forum since it started on the old board. I had over 1500 posts there (not the hugest number by todays standards, but high for back then - I don't have that much time to devote to being on the board so much). They wiped our counts clean when this board started.

Have owned TOO many pickups, including all the ones mentioned ones here. Currently play in a bunch of bands, teach guitar full time. Huge gear head. Big fan of clear guitar sounds. Know plenty of people here for years, and have had may great conversaions and have learned a lot from many players. I'd like to think people have learned from me as well.

I don't mean any more by that than to say that although you may mean well, your advice that I "Do a search on this site" for information that I've known about for almost 20 years can be considered a bit condescending, even if you don't mean it that way.

If your ears hear things differently than mine, fine. Say that. But don't say it is a fact.

Myself (and many others on this board) think that a C5 is MUCH brighter than a JB. As a matter of fact I had one of the first C5's back in 2002 custom wound by MJ herself. It was MUCH brighter (and thinner) than either of my two JB's (one an early 80's and one a mid 90's) in the same '91 Gibson SG standard, clean. The Custom was less bright than the C5, but the JB is warmer than both (including a CC which like I said distorted too easy).

The lack of mids in a C5 makes the high end the dominating frequency in the mix with a band (again, in MY experience). And the ceramic magnet in the regular custom adds a certain "hardness" in the upper frequencies that sounds more shrill to my ears.

The JB has more audible mid content so that is the voicing of that pickup more than the highs. Tons of people hear it the way I do. Some hear it your way. People often confuse upper mids with treble. Not saying you do, just saying that people do that.

Obviously you've had different experiences. That's fine. But please resist the temptation to be condescending and state things as FACT.

I mean no disrespect by any of this. All the best bro. Peace.

Man, I hear the same thing regarding those two pickups. Many people seem to confuse upper mids on the JB with treble harshness.....I thought the Custom had more treble harsness than the JB.


That's why I always shake my head when I see people recommending the Custom or C5 when someone says the JB is too bright. I think those pickups have a much brighter top end.

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Hey bro, I appreciate the conversation.

I don;t really "need" to do a search man, but thanks. I've been a member of the Duncan forum since it started on the old board.

Have owned TOO many pickups, including all the ones mentioned ones here. Currently play in a bunch of bands, teach guitar full time. Huge gear head. Big fan of clear guitar sounds. Know plenty of people here for years, and have had may great conversaions and have learned a lot from many players. I'd like to think people have learned from me as well.

I don't mean any more by that than to say that although you may mean well, your advice that I "Do a search on this site" for information that I've known about for almost 20 years can be considered a bit condescending, even if you don't mean it that way.

If your ears hear things differently than mine, fine. Say that. But don't say it is a fact.

Myself (and many others on this board) think that a C5 is MUCH brighter than a JB. As a matter of fact I had one of the first C5's back in 2002 custom wound by MJ herself. It was MUCH brighter (and thinner) than either of my two JB's (one an early 80's and one a mid 90's) in the same '91 Gibson SG standard, clean. The Custom was less bright than the C5, but the JB is warmer than both (including a CC which like I said distorted too easy).

The lack of mids in a C5 makes the high end the dominating frequency in the mix with a band (again, in MY experience). And the ceramic magnet in the regular custom adds a certain "hardness" in the upper frequencies that sounds more shrill to my ears.

The JB has more audible mid content so that is the voicing of that pickup more than the highs. Tons of people hear it the way I do. Some hear it your way. People often confuse upper mids with treble. Not saying you do, just saying that people do that.

Obviously you've had different experiences. That's fine. But please resist the temptation to be condescending and state things as FACT.

I mean no disrespect by any of this. All the best bro. Peace.

None taken, but you arent th eonly guy that has owned a lot of pickups. I often think that people probably put a little to much time into pickup swapping and not enough into other elements of their tone chain (not saying you are in that group.....I used to be) I've been around for ages also, not near 1000 posts but pretty high.

Looking up the old posts was another way of saying that there are plenty of ppl that find the JB overly bright....and they are right in what they think if thats their result. I like the JB clean a lot, one of the nicest clean sounding humbuckers anywhere....its under some gain that I'm not a big fan.

As for pickups.....I actually really like treble. Upper range mids?? not so much. I do agree that the JB has 2 camps most of the time. I actually DO like hte JB in a Les Paul or other type guitar. You have to fit the pickup to the guitar and bring in a different EQ mindset when doing swaps. Not enough people do that...they just swap and go 'I dont like this' it takes time to experiment with pickup heights to get things REALLY sorted out.

I kinda like Fralins all around lately.....different topic entirely.

 

[papersoul]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

The Custom is fuller. More mids and more of a grainy sizzle to the highs when played with overdrive. Slightly louder, thicker and fuller with more mids and more punch is how I'd describe the Custom compared to the C5. Lew

The Rio Grande BBQ is like that Lew only it has a better clean than the Custom to my ears.

 

[Mac-P]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

None taken, but you arent th eonly guy that has owned a lot of pickups. I often think that people probably put a little to much time into pickup swapping and not enough into other elements of their tone chain (not saying you are in that group.....I used to be)

I did not and would never profess to being the only guy who has owned (still owns) many pickups. Obviously that would be silly. Many guys on here have tons more equipment than I will ever have.

But I am absolutely not one of the people who neglects "other elements of their tone chain". Check my signature. I have spent countless hours fine tuning every aspect of my tone, from picks & strings to speaker wire & speakers (I have about 30 unused tubes lying around here that I tried out and never used/returned, etc). And I'm talking at real drummer volume at gigs and band practices mind you, not just in a bedroom.

All I'm saying is that you should resist the temptation to state things as fact, especially when someone on here adamantly disagrees with you. Younger players who are looking for advice can mistake those opinions for fact and possibly make a wrong decision.

All the best bro.

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

I did not and would never profess to being the only guy who has owned (still owns) many pickups. Obviously that would be silly. Many guys on here have tons more equipment than I will ever have.

But I am absolutely not one of the people who neglects "other elements of their tone chain". Check my signature. I have spent countless hours fine tuning every aspect of my tone, from picks & strings to speaker wire & speakers (I have about 30 unused tubes lying around here that I tried out and never used/returned, etc). And I'm talking at real drummer volume at gigs and band practices mind you, not just in a bedroom.

All I'm saying is that you should resist the temptation to state things as fact, especially when someone on here adamantly disagrees with you. Younger players who are looking for advice can mistake those opinions for fact and possibly make a wrong decision.

All the best bro.

I agree with you, youglings can easily be led astray. But hopefully they can access ALL the varying opinions on the board and see that pickup opinions are HUGELY varied.

One guys tonal nirvana is anothers tonal purgatory.

For what its worth, I'm not talking bedroom volumes and (as you can see from my sig) I've put some thought and time into my gear also.

 

[Mac-P]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Never suggested you didn't my brother! Peace.

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Never suggested you didn't my brother! Peace.

cheers mate :beerchug:

 

[Imp]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

Custom 5 = '59x2
Custom = '59²

soo..

√custom = '59

since custom 5 = 2('59),

(custom 5)/2 = √custom?

i get it! :laugh2:

 

[Archer_of_Fish]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

soo..

√custom = '59

since custom 5 = 2('59),

(custom 5)/2 = √custom?

i get it! :laugh2:

You should get an A for that post.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Is C5 really that much different than Custom?

My favorite Duncans are C-5, 59, Seth, CC, and Jazz's. I just choose which one I think will sound best in a particular guitar. I like the C-5 a lot because it's a bigger tighter 59, which sounds great in my goldtop LP and solid mahogany LP Custom. I'm also playing through midheavy EL-34 amps, so the mahogany and EL-34's give me all the mids I need. Plus I like a snappy and clear highend, so pickups like the 59 and Jazz aren't too bright for me, since I use my right hand fingers a lot.

The best advise I can offer is to NOT solely base your decisions on what works for others, but take FULL advantage of Duncan's exchange policy, or dealer's exchange policy. Make a wise assumption about what you want, then if it's not nailed, move your next choice in a different direction. After a few pickup swaps, you'll start to see what YOU really want to hear, much like the guy's who've commented in this thread. For all you know, your choice could differ anywhere between an Antiquity and an Invader. It's not till you hear a bunch that you'll pinpoint the exact color you want to paint your tone with.