Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

[marty_the_westie]

Does anybody hear play or use Korean (or Mexican etc.) guitars exclusively. Now I know that all of us, if $$ were no object, would use all the real deals. But in true life, for the majority of us, that is not practical. A perfect example would be the Epiphone line. Take a good Les Paul or Dot, put another $300-$400 worth of upgrades, and you'll have yourself one quality axe. Yet somehow, people , myself included sometimes, would look down on the guitar or even the player, just because of the name on the headstock. Yet think about it, most car companies are putting out cars that try to emulate a $50,000 BMW, yet most of drive Honda's, Toyota's, Chevy's, etc. without thinking twice about that. So why are we all so concerned about the name on the headstock? I've heard people on this forum tell other people to save their money for a Gibson Les Paul. However, with the money a person would spend on that, he could buy a Epiphone Les Paul, Dot, and SG, and have enough money to upgrade all 3, and have an army of excellent guitars. What is everybody else's thoughts on this. Am I in the minority?

 

[Benjy_26]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I use a Hot Rodded Sheraton and a MIJ Strat and can honestly say I wouldn't trade my Sheraton for a real 335. My MIJ also has blown a lot of MIA strats out of the water, and that was with the stock pickups. Now that it has the APS's, well, any more comparisons would be just wrong.

 

[BS123]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I think there's a genuine workmanship difference on most guitars. I own a Line 6 Variax 500 (Korean-made) and it took a bit of seting up do get it to be a great player. Now, I'd put it up against about anything. Soundwise, it's as good, and in some cases better than the real deals. Now, there is a good difference between Epis and Gibbys; but I agree that upgrades can help. Heck, I know some Nashville players that use Epiphones and love them. They don't care about the headstock. But there's a bigger difference or quality gap betwee USA to Korean guitars than in USA to Japanese guitars. Some Japanese-made guitars even surpass the USA's. I have played a lIne 6 Variax 700. It's the Japanese version of the V-500. It's a much much better quality guitar than the V-500 but I can't justify the $600-$700 difference because they sound the same.

My personal opinion kind of floats sometimes. On one hand, I would love to have Gisbsons, USA Fenders, and the like at my disposal. On the other hand, I have played USA-made dookey ands would love to go into a club with an EPI, Squier, or something really cheap; have everyone laugh then blow them away with tone and chops.

 

[Gamera]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I absolutely agree that any instrument, regardless of price, can deliver mucho mojo. I have a modded '85 Aria Pro II that I love and wouldn't trade for anything!

There was a similar topic on these boards recently regarding amps and how it's fashionable for tube guys to bash all solid state stuff. It gets to the point where even if I had the opportunity to acquire a premium tube amp I'd have to think twice. Am I getting it because it's the cool thing to do (like driving a SUV) or do I really need it?

 

[aleclee]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

A good guitar is a good guitar, regardless of whose name is on the headstock. Though I'm mainly a PRS player, here's what I bought when jonesing for a Strat:

I paid all of $80 for it used. Plays fine and sounds great.

You can find a damn fine MIM/J/K guitar if you're willing to run the racks. Depending on the brand, you can do a lot of running before finding "the one". I spent months trying dozens of import Strats before running across "Red".

That said, I'm not a big fan of buying a guitar and spending a lot on upgrades. In my experience, when you move on from an instrument with significant upgrades, you invariably take it in the shorts on resale. IMO, you're better off buying a nice used $800 guitar than dropping several hundred dollars into a $3-500 guitar.

If you want a "nice" guitar, buy a nice guitar 'cause upgrading is more expensive in the long run. If you buy the notional $800 used guitar I mention above and play it for a couple years, you can probably eBay it for $750-800. If you buy a $400 import and drop a few hundred into it replacing the pickups, hardware, and electronics, there's a good chance you won't get more than $400 or so out of it. While the initial investment was comparable, when moving on to your next guitar the "nice" guitar leaves you with a lot more money to spend.

That said, one "upgrade" I'd always recommend is a good setup. If you can't do it yourself, pay someone to do it --and then learn to DIY. That way, you're not shelling out $$$ to a tech every change of season.

My $0.02, IMHO, FWIW, YMMV, etc.

 

[Budweiser]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

My buddy plays a USA Strat & when I've jammed with him using my MIM Strat with Duncans in it, there's no difference IMO. In fact, I like mine better...gotta be the Duncans.

That being said, I just purchased a Gibson LP today at lunch. It's 7 years old & that's the only way I could afford one. For some reason, I'd rather buy a used Gibby than a new Epiphone. But that's just me.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

My MIJ Strats from the 80's are the ones I play...not my original '63. For one thing, my MIJ Strats have the pickups and mods I prefer and I wouldn't want to mod (and devalue) my '63. But to be honest, my MIJ Strats play just as well and sound just as good or better than my vintage guitars. If I don't love a guitar, I won't keep it. I've kept almost all of the MIJ Strats I've acquired over the years...tho a couple were sold because they weren't as resonant and lively as others. My very favorite Strat is a white 57 RI 80's MIJ Squire with Duncan Antiquitys! Paid under $200 for it. I've gigged with it almost as much as my old '63 that I've owned since about 1975. Lew

 

[marty_the_westie]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I agree with everything said so far. The only thing I thought about after I posted the thread, was that someone would mention re-sale value. That certaintly is a consideration, but I was really talking about getting a guitar to keep for a long time and not worry about selling in the future. Also, If you keep the old pups, tuners, bridge, whatever, you could always put the old parts back in, and keep your upgrades for something else.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I have to add that I've not yet played a Korean Strat that really did it for me. Neither have I played or worked on a Korean Epi Les Paul that I'd want to own myself. But I have worked on some very, very good ones. The Epi Les Paul Custom I put a Jazz neck and JB bridge and did some custom wiring in was an excellant guitar that really did sound as good as many real Gibsons...but it didn't play quite as nice or have the "vibe" of my 2000 Gibson '59 Les Paul Historic. With Duncans, it sounded just as good tho!

 

[midnite_man]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I have 4 Epi's, 2 electric and 2 acoustic, and I don't have a real problem with any of them. Sure, I had to do some upgrades to get the basics such as electronics and tuners up to snuff....but they are good-playing guitars and sound pretty nice. I have a MIJ Strat that I love just as much as my MIA Strat and can relate to what Benjy26 said....it plays great and those stock pickups are nice-sounding, aren't they? I replaced them but I'll never get rid of them.
I can hear a difference in tone between my Epi LP Standard and my Gibson LP Studio, the Gibby is a more solid sounding guitar but there may very well be better sounding Epiphone Paulys out there that I just haven't played and heard yet.
For the average avid hobbyist it probably doesn't matter as much what brand guitar you own and play as it's all relative to your own ears and hands. But the fact remains, as I've been told by several professional musicians, that those who hire bands to do gigs at their establishments many times will ask the band for an equipment-list to see what kind of instruments they use as a determining factor in whether they want to hire them or not. That and demo-songs....plus videos even!
I will say that I've spent more money upgrading my Epi than what I spent for my Gibson, including pickups....but it was a matter of available funds at the time when I bought the Epi.
....Bob

 

[marty_the_westie]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

There is another consideration to think about. Some musicians who own very valuable insturments, would never bring them to a gig, for fear of getting stolen, dropped, beer spilled on it, some drunken whino vomiting on it, whatever, so they buy inexpensive ones and fix them up to gig with, and leave the good ones home.

 

[ledzepp29]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I know a few kids that don't really play guitar but wish they could but they suck rediculously bad and what I've noticed is that they are so arrogant and think they are way too good for squier. Like this kid that sucks ass and can't even play saw this squier that had a really cool finish and he went to grab it and noticed it said squier so he started laughing and said nevermind. Then he runs over and grabs a $99 epiphone and says dude check out this sweet gibson les paul, I'm gonna get it! And this one kid that just started learning bought some $70 dollar crap strat to start out on and he asked me what I started out on and I said squier and he started laughing and making fun of me?!

 

[aleclee]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

There is another consideration to think about. Some musicians who own very valuable insturments, would never bring them to a gig, for fear of getting stolen, dropped, beer spilled on it, some drunken whino vomiting on it, whatever, so they buy inexpensive ones and fix them up to gig with, and leave the good ones home.

And there are other musicians that will bring whatever will bring out the best in their performance.

My position on that subject is that if I want it bad enough to own it, I should use it. What's the point of having a $X,000 guitar if you're just gonna dink around on it in your basement? If your stuff is insured (and you probably shouldn't be playing out if it's not) and replaceable, play it out. That's what it's for.

My $0.02, IMHO, FWIW, YMMV, etc.

 

[Hoss]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

when i first got into guitars...that's all that mattered...until i got out there and really played ALOT of stuff, from lots of manufacturers made in usa and not...i will admit...a USA model anything is "almost" always a high quality instrument...that being said...there are some guitars out there, that are up to par with the US and even better in some cases...

so...i would say...definitely not...don't get me wrong, i want a HIGH QUALITY instrument, no matter who makes it and where it's made, and you can find them, if you try..........example...

i1 Features
Comfort contoured body
Unique sculpted headstock
Neck thru construction
Kalantas Mahogany body and highly figured maple top
Matching figured headstock
Ivoroid binding
22 fret, 3 piece Kalantas Mahogany neck, Rosewood fingerboard
25.5" scale 15" radius
Seymour Duncan Pickups with coil tapping
Gold Hardware, Sperzel Locking Tuners
Vibrato
Innovative output jack location

and this baby was made in the good ol..............................















country of Korea.

 

[Quencho092]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

when i buy my guitars i do not think about reselling them. I really don't care about resale value, so i simply mod it and tweak it to my tastes. I own guitars to play them, not render them as real estate .My ibanez gax is a decent guitar, but im glad i bought the strat and modded it, eventhough it was so expensive.

It's nice to have the fender name on the headstock, but on the other hand it's far better than any other guitar I've played. I also worked hard hours to pay for it, so i appreciate its value and use it at gigs and practices with my band all the time. What annoys me is when some kids have their parents get them an MIA Fender, or an MIA Gibson as their first guitar, then see them stop playing the instrument altogether.

 

[LesStrat]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

In a word?

No.

 

[texasguitarslinger]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

Where do you think I stand on the issue?

 

[TwofacePimp]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

Well, I had an Epi Les Paul for years, and was very happy with it. I gigged with it, wrote songs with it, and even upgraded a lot of the parts. I really liked that guitar, and I was a happy camper.

But then I had a chance to grab a new Gibson LP Standard for pretty cheap, so I took it (I think it was about 4-5 years ago). Out of the box that guitar was more playable, higher quality, and had better tone. Strangely enough, I recently added tonepros hardware, buzz feiten tuning system, all new electronics, had the frets leveled, and JB/Jazz pups, and now the guitar is even better. It's kinda sad that even Gibsons need upgrades and setups to be their best, but now I have an absolutely awesome guitar.

The moral of the story? You can be happy with a lower-cost guitar. There's no question about that. But in most cases, the higher-cost alternative will be even better.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

I think that the most important thing is the wood used, the build quality, the fit & finish, and ultimately the tone. To find an instrument that truly "speaks to you", you've got to put some play time on a bunch, then pick the winners. That can be from anything from a Jay Turser to a Historic Gibson.

On the other hand, I'm not gonna lie....YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.....every step of the way. Don't think for a minute that a $300 guitar is as good as a $2000 guitar, no matter how good you think it sounds or plays. More often that not, you'll be corrected by putting the $300 guitar in a direct A/B comparison with the high end one.
That also means having them both setup equally, and even hearing them both in a live band mix. It's the less noticeable nuances that you're paying money for. A cheap guitar can sound good, especially upgraded, but I guarantee that if you bought it's highend equivalent, you'd know for yourself that the expensive one is better.
Do you want 3 $400 guitars, or do you want 1 $1200 guitar. It's your choice.
Personally, I've always taken my 'lesser' guitars, added money, and always moved upward into the quality that I REALLY want. The longer your hands and ears get accustomed to the quality of a $2000 guitar, the less you can even tolerate to hear a budget oriented guitar. This is not a knock on guys who use what they can afford, just my observations, after 20 years of playing in band situations, using everything from $250 guitars up to $4000 guitars. I'm careful with the expensive one's, but have no worries about rehearsing and gigging with them. If I damaged one, it wouldn't be covered, so I'm just careful.

 

[Norman_T]

Re: Is the name on the headstock all that matters?

Does the name on the headstock mean anything to me - check some of my guitars in the link in my signature and you will find that aside from having some very high quality gear I also have other gear - as far as I am concerned it does not matter to me. I have these guitars because they all serve a purpose. It is whatever you want/get of a guitar and whether you have paid thousands or peanuts for one is immaterial.

However to answer the last part of your question - when people asking for advice on whether they should get a Gibson LP or an Epiphone or one of the Japanese copies (Tokai, Burny etc) - more often than not what they really want is a Gibson LP and once you have found that out then why deny them that dream?

FWIW - I have told a number of people on this forum what great guitars US Hamers are - and a number of people have got them and are very pleased with them. However some people don't like them, but thats life, I think some of the Japanese guitar makers - Tokai, Edwards, Burny etc are far superior to some of the stuff that is put out by Gibson and Fender.