Had my new Mustang modded with Hot Rails at the bridge and I have to say I'm not sure I'm liking it. Originally wanted full size JB, but Hot Rails were suggested, less routing. Also saw a video with my guitar where they used Rails and it sounded good. Our music is like The New Pornographers and Wilco, with a sprinkle of Nirvana. Rails bridge tone seems too thin, although nice clarity. Now I'm thinking of changing to the JB, but the cost of the mod was already a lot. Am I right I'll get more warmth out of a JB in the bridge?
JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
- Thread starter joho1701
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9unslin9er
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
If you don't route your guitar, you'll neither get the power of a JB nor the fullness. It's physics. Nature of the beast I'm afraid.
But if low mids and bass response are what you desire without major routing, I would highly suggest this guy:
http://www.dimarzio.com/pickups/strat/hum-canceling-strat/super-distortion-s
*BTW I've never heard of The New Pornographers, and I think you just introduced me to my next favorite band. They sound like a bigger version of the Pixies.
If you don't route your guitar, you'll neither get the power of a JB nor the fullness. It's physics. Nature of the beast I'm afraid.
But if low mids and bass response are what you desire without major routing, I would highly suggest this guy:
http://www.dimarzio.com/pickups/strat/hum-canceling-strat/super-distortion-s
*BTW I've never heard of The New Pornographers, and I think you just introduced me to my next favorite band. They sound like a bigger version of the Pixies.
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Falloffthebonetone
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
Check to see if it is wired truly correctly. Sounds like it might be in parallel or something. As Alex said, the last thing I would describe them as is "thin"
Check to see if it is wired truly correctly. Sounds like it might be in parallel or something. As Alex said, the last thing I would describe them as is "thin"
L
Little Pigbacon
Guest
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
Parallel wiring could make them sound thin. It's a step in the direction of sounding like a single coil.
Parallel wiring could make them sound thin. It's a step in the direction of sounding like a single coil.
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
The New Pornos are amazing. Neko Case is from that band. Mass Romantic and Twin Cinema are great records. Their latest, "Brill Bruisers" is really something special. When you are done checking them out check out our cover of one of their songs, we know a member of the band and she helped us get it right: https://youtu.be/JUJjye_04pk
The New Pornos are amazing. Neko Case is from that band. Mass Romantic and Twin Cinema are great records. Their latest, "Brill Bruisers" is really something special. When you are done checking them out check out our cover of one of their songs, we know a member of the band and she helped us get it right: https://youtu.be/JUJjye_04pk
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
"Thin" was a bad description. I meant a little too "harsh", or not "round" enough. I think it's that subtle difference between a double coil and a single. It's all in the context of my band, though. It sounded great on it's own, but I'm not sold on how it sits in our mix.
"Thin" was a bad description. I meant a little too "harsh", or not "round" enough. I think it's that subtle difference between a double coil and a single. It's all in the context of my band, though. It sounded great on it's own, but I'm not sold on how it sits in our mix.
9unslin9er
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
I'll give the bands you listed a listen. I've been in a new music rut lately.
BTW make sure you do some research on what potentiometers you want to run.
A JB might sound okay in a full scale Strat with 250k pots, but on a 24" scale Mustang, it might be too muddy. But changing your pots to 500k might make your neck single coil too bright.
I'm not sure what Fender uses on the Kurt Cobain Mustang and haven't been lucky enough to try one.
Cheers.
Hey, thank you all for responding. Since I posted this thread I have made arrangement to get my mustang routed for the full-size JB. I have a feeling it's closer in tone to what I want/need
I'll give the bands you listed a listen. I've been in a new music rut lately.
BTW make sure you do some research on what potentiometers you want to run.
A JB might sound okay in a full scale Strat with 250k pots, but on a 24" scale Mustang, it might be too muddy. But changing your pots to 500k might make your neck single coil too bright.
I'm not sure what Fender uses on the Kurt Cobain Mustang and haven't been lucky enough to try one.
Cheers.
Falloffthebonetone
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
Yeah harsh still doesn't sound right to me. But if you made up your mind and you're sure the thing was wired right then godspeed.
Yeah harsh still doesn't sound right to me. But if you made up your mind and you're sure the thing was wired right then godspeed.
9unslin9er
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
Yes. JB in the Mustang. PAF 36th/Super Distortion in the Jaguar.
But I was referring to the pot values. Until recentlly, Fender used 250k pots on their HSS Stats (the new Shawbucker model has a hybrid switching system) and the bridge humbucker has been muddy as a result.
Don't know what they use for the KC Mustang.
Yes. JB in the Mustang. PAF 36th/Super Distortion in the Jaguar.
But I was referring to the pot values. Until recentlly, Fender used 250k pots on their HSS Stats (the new Shawbucker model has a hybrid switching system) and the bridge humbucker has been muddy as a result.
Don't know what they use for the KC Mustang.
Falloffthebonetone
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
I am glad I am not the only one that noticed this about the shawbucker.
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
Hey there you got me thinking about the muddiness issue of putting the JB in the Mustang. My main guitar for a long time was the Yamaha rgx-a2, a lightweight guitar with an unusual air-hole design that gave it a resonant tone. Had two of them. I put soapbar DiMarzio SDs on their bridges. Always had a problem with definition of chords cutting through in the band. Our bass player would often remark on that. I play mostly bar and 1st position open chords, not a lot of power chords. Also play some well thought out solos, not so many loose distortion based ones like Kurt. Those Yammies were 25.5 scale length. The reason for using the SDs were Nirvana inspired.
Now I have the Mustang. My first impulse was to go with the JB. I have a Peavy Classic 50 4x10. The first time I played the Rails-modded Mustang on the amp I thought it sounded pretty good. Second time I felt it a little less warmth. Had to bring the amp in to get the handle repaired and am temporarily using my Orange 30 1x12. This is where I felt the Rails sounded really harsh. I also have a pedalboard where I use a compressor, a Klon, Z-vex Box of Metal and a Suhr Riot. I use a Zen Drive for soloing. We are not like Nirvana where there was basically the one sound. If you start listening to The New Pornos and Wilco you'll know what I mean. And btw yes I love Pixies! I am a little concerned about routing for the full size pick up. If the tone is muddy I'd be stuck with that big hole in the guitar. I realize I should probably wait to get my Peavy back and work on shaping my tone with my board as our songs run a range of tone and complexity before changing to the JB.
Hey there you got me thinking about the muddiness issue of putting the JB in the Mustang. My main guitar for a long time was the Yamaha rgx-a2, a lightweight guitar with an unusual air-hole design that gave it a resonant tone. Had two of them. I put soapbar DiMarzio SDs on their bridges. Always had a problem with definition of chords cutting through in the band. Our bass player would often remark on that. I play mostly bar and 1st position open chords, not a lot of power chords. Also play some well thought out solos, not so many loose distortion based ones like Kurt. Those Yammies were 25.5 scale length. The reason for using the SDs were Nirvana inspired.
Now I have the Mustang. My first impulse was to go with the JB. I have a Peavy Classic 50 4x10. The first time I played the Rails-modded Mustang on the amp I thought it sounded pretty good. Second time I felt it a little less warmth. Had to bring the amp in to get the handle repaired and am temporarily using my Orange 30 1x12. This is where I felt the Rails sounded really harsh. I also have a pedalboard where I use a compressor, a Klon, Z-vex Box of Metal and a Suhr Riot. I use a Zen Drive for soloing. We are not like Nirvana where there was basically the one sound. If you start listening to The New Pornos and Wilco you'll know what I mean. And btw yes I love Pixies! I am a little concerned about routing for the full size pick up. If the tone is muddy I'd be stuck with that big hole in the guitar. I realize I should probably wait to get my Peavy back and work on shaping my tone with my board as our songs run a range of tone and complexity before changing to the JB.
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9unslin9er
New member
Re: JB vs Hot Rails-- warm vs bright?
Man that's some pricey gear you got there. Yeah, I've run 4xWhatever cabs exclusively for the very reason they push more air, and this translates to better bass response. I have a Tech 21 4x10 and a Blackstar 4x8 and they both murder their 1x12 brethren. I could understand why the Orange doesn't punch you in the gut.
I'm not much of an effects guy. I run Compression and Overdrive only to counteract the Noise Gates I use.
I personally LOVE the single coils in the Fender Mustang. They are very unique sounding and can dirty up very well.
I think you should take everyone's advice in consideration BUT:
What I would do:
Rip out the Hot Rails.
Install a DiMarzio SDS-1 model: DP111
It is a single coil sized P-90. It will balance great with the Mustang neck pickup, and you'll gain tons of low end and midrange in the bridge position. I have one in my Strat right now with a 250k volume pot. One of the best pickups I've ever used. It pushes the amp really hard, but you maintain clarity.
Man that's some pricey gear you got there. Yeah, I've run 4xWhatever cabs exclusively for the very reason they push more air, and this translates to better bass response. I have a Tech 21 4x10 and a Blackstar 4x8 and they both murder their 1x12 brethren. I could understand why the Orange doesn't punch you in the gut.
I'm not much of an effects guy. I run Compression and Overdrive only to counteract the Noise Gates I use.
I personally LOVE the single coils in the Fender Mustang. They are very unique sounding and can dirty up very well.
I think you should take everyone's advice in consideration BUT:
What I would do:
Rip out the Hot Rails.
Install a DiMarzio SDS-1 model: DP111
It is a single coil sized P-90. It will balance great with the Mustang neck pickup, and you'll gain tons of low end and midrange in the bridge position. I have one in my Strat right now with a 250k volume pot. One of the best pickups I've ever used. It pushes the amp really hard, but you maintain clarity.
