MetalManiac
Li'l Junior Member
Where does the JCM/JMP w/ Screamer end, the Hot Rod marshall begin, and the Super High Output High gain amp end?
is it a Gray area?
is it a Gray area?
Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
- Thread starter MetalManiac
- Start date
woemoejack
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
Splawn?
Splawn?
MetalManiac
Li'l Junior Member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
does that like , encompass all of them?
does that like , encompass all of them?
JeffB
Let it B
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
For my own purposes- Hot Rod Marshall means any older NMV or MV marshall that has been modified to produce more gain in some way other than a tube swap, or pedals. IOW- added gain stages, cascading circuits, etc.
As for Splawn, Bray, Rivera, etc. those are Marshall inspired AFAIC. While they sound amazing there are significant tonal and feel differences in those amps compared to the originals.
For my own purposes- Hot Rod Marshall means any older NMV or MV marshall that has been modified to produce more gain in some way other than a tube swap, or pedals. IOW- added gain stages, cascading circuits, etc.
As for Splawn, Bray, Rivera, etc. those are Marshall inspired AFAIC. While they sound amazing there are significant tonal and feel differences in those amps compared to the originals.
ErikH
Well-known member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
Then there is the hot rodded Marshall that Marshall made themselves but didn't catch on as they hoped, for whatever reason.... the MkIII Hi Gain Master Volume. The SL-X did really good though and is a good amp in it's own right.
Then there is the hot rodded Marshall that Marshall made themselves but didn't catch on as they hoped, for whatever reason.... the MkIII Hi Gain Master Volume. The SL-X did really good though and is a good amp in it's own right.
Christopher Caruana
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
For me, a "hot rodded" Marshall is as JeffB said. An older NMV or early MV marshall (a la plexi, JMP, 800) that has been modified for extra gain with out pedals/effects by adding a tube gain stage, cascading......
I have an '83 JCM800 2204 that is 100% stock, and I use a high quality OD pedal and I can get an awesome "hotrodded" tone out of it. The good thing about finding a good OD pedal that you like (and your amp likes) is that its the best of both worlds. With the OD pedal on, I get 80's, 90's and modern high gain.......but with the OD off I can cover plexi territory and still have a stock 800 sound.
For me, a "hot rodded" Marshall is as JeffB said. An older NMV or early MV marshall (a la plexi, JMP, 800) that has been modified for extra gain with out pedals/effects by adding a tube gain stage, cascading......
I have an '83 JCM800 2204 that is 100% stock, and I use a high quality OD pedal and I can get an awesome "hotrodded" tone out of it. The good thing about finding a good OD pedal that you like (and your amp likes) is that its the best of both worlds. With the OD pedal on, I get 80's, 90's and modern high gain.......but with the OD off I can cover plexi territory and still have a stock 800 sound.
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
Any Marshall that has gain that leans toward heavy tight chunk.....any one that's high gain plug in and play.
When it comes to mods, "modified or modded" Marshall would be my description.
Any Marshall that has gain that leans toward heavy tight chunk.....any one that's high gain plug in and play.
When it comes to mods, "modified or modded" Marshall would be my description.
JCM900MkIII
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
<---- :cool2:
<---- :cool2:
SirJackdeFuzz
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
This is how I see it . . . others might see it very diff.
* Anything before a JCM800 is a 'low gain' Marshall.
* The JCM is theee "standard Marshall tone".
* Anything from a JCM900 & DSL/TSL is a HOT Marshall tone.
This is how I see it . . . others might see it very diff.
* Anything before a JCM800 is a 'low gain' Marshall.
* The JCM is theee "standard Marshall tone".
* Anything from a JCM900 & DSL/TSL is a HOT Marshall tone.
Red_Label
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
Yup.
Splawn, Bogner, Soldano, Mojave, Bray, Friedman, Fortin, and others come to mind.
Yup.
Splawn, Bogner, Soldano, Mojave, Bray, Friedman, Fortin, and others come to mind.
Brown Note
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
Because there were very little high gain amps in the early 80's, most high gain tones required some modification to the amplifier. These modified amps were usually fenders(like what randall smith from mesa did) or marshalls. Hotrodding simply ment changing the circuit in order to produce more distortion.
There were a *lot* of companies that did just that. Take those basic circuits, modified them to produce more audible distortion and these to me are hotrodded marshall tones. Things like Lee Jackson, kittyhawk, peavey butcher, Laney and Bogner were all producing their hotrodded marshall amps. Of course, when the circuit is tampered with, the end result is much likely sounding nothing like the original, so unless the amp is actually marshall that's been hotrodded it will be very hard to define.
Bogner ecstasy is close to 800 and they sound quite far from each other, metaltronics has multiple 800 second stages cascaded and those two also sound nothing alike. Mesa mark series were originally modified fenders and they are *definetly* a world apart and mesa rectos were a carbon copy of soldano slo (which also started as a modified fender preamp) and even they are very different animals.
So unless your tone is not coming from a marshall that's been hotrodded, then a hotrodded marshall tone can be basically whatever you desire. To me the hotrodded marshall tones are the early 80's thrash metal tones which were mainly produced with marshalls that were hotrodded.
Because there were very little high gain amps in the early 80's, most high gain tones required some modification to the amplifier. These modified amps were usually fenders(like what randall smith from mesa did) or marshalls. Hotrodding simply ment changing the circuit in order to produce more distortion.
There were a *lot* of companies that did just that. Take those basic circuits, modified them to produce more audible distortion and these to me are hotrodded marshall tones. Things like Lee Jackson, kittyhawk, peavey butcher, Laney and Bogner were all producing their hotrodded marshall amps. Of course, when the circuit is tampered with, the end result is much likely sounding nothing like the original, so unless the amp is actually marshall that's been hotrodded it will be very hard to define.
Bogner ecstasy is close to 800 and they sound quite far from each other, metaltronics has multiple 800 second stages cascaded and those two also sound nothing alike. Mesa mark series were originally modified fenders and they are *definetly* a world apart and mesa rectos were a carbon copy of soldano slo (which also started as a modified fender preamp) and even they are very different animals.
So unless your tone is not coming from a marshall that's been hotrodded, then a hotrodded marshall tone can be basically whatever you desire. To me the hotrodded marshall tones are the early 80's thrash metal tones which were mainly produced with marshalls that were hotrodded.
Chickenwings
Alnico 6/8
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
I reckon to be a "hot rodded" marshall, it needs to have been modified.
I reckon the classic could be something with variacs or extra tube gain stages added like EVH's plexis, or a jcm800 with and extra gain stage.
The 800s twin channel, the 900s and all the later ones are really designed to replicate the sound of the "hot rodded" marshall by using clipping diodes. Clipping the diodes gives the extra crunch and sustain that a hot rodded tube circuit gets, but with a lot more stability and predicatability.
But seeing as they are stock - they cant actually be "hot rodded" marshalls until someone mods then right? And seeing as they already have the extra gain stages in them, they give a "hot rodded" sound out of a production amp.
I reckon to be a "hot rodded" marshall, it needs to have been modified.
I reckon the classic could be something with variacs or extra tube gain stages added like EVH's plexis, or a jcm800 with and extra gain stage.
The 800s twin channel, the 900s and all the later ones are really designed to replicate the sound of the "hot rodded" marshall by using clipping diodes. Clipping the diodes gives the extra crunch and sustain that a hot rodded tube circuit gets, but with a lot more stability and predicatability.
But seeing as they are stock - they cant actually be "hot rodded" marshalls until someone mods then right? And seeing as they already have the extra gain stages in them, they give a "hot rodded" sound out of a production amp.
JCM900MkIII
New member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
They have a service department at Marshall that worked on modified 800's.
So they wanted an amp that didn't need those modifications because it is a pain in the A if you have to find out which mods were done on the amp.
So basically you have 2203/2204 design and they added the most popular mods.
People with a JCM 800 mostly want:
A boost for solo's (that is why they made it with 2 footswitchable MV's)
You want more distortion (add a distortion pedal??? no, we will add those diodes for you!)
You want an effects loop
You want a recording out
You want seperate fuses for both sets of power tubes
You want to go louder then Nigel Tufnel (so it goes to 20... that is 9 more, innit?)
JCM 900: most underrated Marshall. And you don't need to use the diodes, you can turn them off as well.
Anyway, it is factory standard but at the same time it is a hotrodded 800.
They have a service department at Marshall that worked on modified 800's.
So they wanted an amp that didn't need those modifications because it is a pain in the A if you have to find out which mods were done on the amp.
So basically you have 2203/2204 design and they added the most popular mods.
People with a JCM 800 mostly want:
A boost for solo's (that is why they made it with 2 footswitchable MV's)
You want more distortion (add a distortion pedal??? no, we will add those diodes for you!)
You want an effects loop
You want a recording out
You want seperate fuses for both sets of power tubes
You want to go louder then Nigel Tufnel (so it goes to 20... that is 9 more, innit?)
JCM 900: most underrated Marshall. And you don't need to use the diodes, you can turn them off as well.
Anyway, it is factory standard but at the same time it is a hotrodded 800.
JeffB
Let it B
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
The MKIII Master volume was OK, but I think as a series they are entirely overrated, especially the Dual Reverb versions. I traded in a 2203 on a DR head and it was THE worst amp buying mistake I ever made in my life. That DR was complete garbage, especially the early ones with 5881s. A Tube screamer in front of an actual 800 sounds far better, IMO than the built in diodes of the 900s or with them off via the gain controls. Even the 2205/2210 with diodes still had the balls of previous Marshall designs that the 900s lost. The 900 was amp of the the times built for weedly weedly shredding/legato and hair metal players who needed a amp sympathetic to that style of playing. It was more mid centric, and tightly focused with less roar and 3D depth of the previous amps- and the typical Celestion speakers of the day, the 75s, and the recently introduced (at the time) V30s made it worse.
The 30th Anniversary was a far, far better amp, and IMO they should have used that basic design with less bells and whistles or refined the Jooby. The 900 was not loved very much and thus we got the JTM and 600 series not long after with more vintage Marshall appeal in the clean channel, and a lead channel much more similar to an 2205/2210. Unfortunately they were both extremely unreliable.
The MKIII Master volume was OK, but I think as a series they are entirely overrated, especially the Dual Reverb versions. I traded in a 2203 on a DR head and it was THE worst amp buying mistake I ever made in my life. That DR was complete garbage, especially the early ones with 5881s. A Tube screamer in front of an actual 800 sounds far better, IMO than the built in diodes of the 900s or with them off via the gain controls. Even the 2205/2210 with diodes still had the balls of previous Marshall designs that the 900s lost. The 900 was amp of the the times built for weedly weedly shredding/legato and hair metal players who needed a amp sympathetic to that style of playing. It was more mid centric, and tightly focused with less roar and 3D depth of the previous amps- and the typical Celestion speakers of the day, the 75s, and the recently introduced (at the time) V30s made it worse.
The 30th Anniversary was a far, far better amp, and IMO they should have used that basic design with less bells and whistles or refined the Jooby. The 900 was not loved very much and thus we got the JTM and 600 series not long after with more vintage Marshall appeal in the clean channel, and a lead channel much more similar to an 2205/2210. Unfortunately they were both extremely unreliable.
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
I enjoyed the JCM900 more so than the JCM800, but I'm partial to 6L6's.
Also, 30th anniversary = oldschool JVM.
I find it kinda messed that they brought back a multi channel midi amp, that they had already done before, but now its their flagship.
I enjoyed the JCM900 more so than the JCM800, but I'm partial to 6L6's.
Also, 30th anniversary = oldschool JVM.
I find it kinda messed that they brought back a multi channel midi amp, that they had already done before, but now its their flagship.
ErikH
Well-known member
Re: Just What is your definition of a 'Hot Rod Marshall'?
When specifying 900's, one has to be specific as to which model because there are 3: The MkIII Master Volume, the SL-X (MkIV Master Volume), and the Dual Reverbs. When "JCM 900" is mentioned, it is more often than not "assumed" to be the Dual Reverbs, hence the reason to be specific.
I like the DR's with EL34's, the way they came the first 3-4 years they were made. Once the 5881's came in to play, I lost all interest. Same with the SL-X; the very first ones with EL34's (and there's not many) sound amazing.
When specifying 900's, one has to be specific as to which model because there are 3: The MkIII Master Volume, the SL-X (MkIV Master Volume), and the Dual Reverbs. When "JCM 900" is mentioned, it is more often than not "assumed" to be the Dual Reverbs, hence the reason to be specific.
I like the DR's with EL34's, the way they came the first 3-4 years they were made. Once the 5881's came in to play, I lost all interest. Same with the SL-X; the very first ones with EL34's (and there's not many) sound amazing.
Similar threads
