Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

[PoorMan]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I'm primarily trying to get decent boosted Marshall hard rock tone to thrash metal at bedroom levels.

After much research it looked like the Peavey 6505mh was going to be the head for me. Drove a bit to a store that had one I could play--not going to work. The tones at low volume were awful. Even at mid volume (which was louder than I am looking for) it was weak. I have to question if the amp was broken. Flubby, loose, fizzy and weak. At similar volumes my 100w JCM800 sounds 10,000% better.

I plugged in a EVHiii 15w and it sounded MUCH better than the 6505mh at low volumes. It's not a versatile amp. It has absolutely no cleans, but it does what it does well. Much fuller and more articulate. Goes from super hot to nuclear. I was hoping for something a little more versatile, but it's a contender.

Going to try to find a Dark Terror to try out. Anything else I should consider?

 

[misterwhizzy]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I'm primarily trying to get decent boosted Marshall hard rock tone to thrash metal at bedroom levels.

Anything else I should consider?

Not the Jet City stuff. It only starts to sound good when it's pretty loud.

 

[PoorMan]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

How is Orange's small amp lineup at low volume (OR15, Dark Terror, Jim Root)? Do you need to get loud to get good tones?

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Even a 5-watt amp on 10 can be difficult to talk over.

I think some of the lunchbox amps are toy-like, but some of the others sound really good.

Many are just single channel, stripped down amps...but then you have the Mesa line which have professional features. The TA-15 was one that I looked at hard, but I decided that I wanted reverb, or at least a loop, so I set my sights higher. The TA-30 head was still small, but had more power AND reverb AND a loop. Shame they discontinued these. The Mini-Recto head had way more gain than I use, but was flexible enough for blues and pretty solid cleans.

But just when I was about to pop for the Mini-Recto, I lucked in a deal on a three-month old Mark V:25 stack with the head, slant, and straight Mini-Recto 112 V30 cabs...for dirt cheap...just a fantastic deal. Showroom new. And I have just fallen in love with it. It's not quite as flexible as my big Mark V combo, but amazing what it can do. Incredible features. With my old Seattle band, I probably could have used this amp on about 70% of the gigs we did, and probably 90% of the gigs I've done over the last 15 years with my current band.

So, it really just depends on what you have to spend and the level of features you want.

But all this aside, what you might want to consider is getting a good attenuator for your current amp. These can allow you to drive your amp so that the tubes are working good; inserted between the amp and speaker...it keeps the over-all volume to a minimum.

Might not be as much fun as a new little amp, but it could be a better solution to playing quietly at home.

Bill

 

[PoorMan]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Even a 5-watt amp on 10 can be difficult to talk over.

I think some of the lunchbox amps are toy-like, but some of the others sound really good.

Many are just single channel, stripped down amps...but then you have the Mesa line which have professional features. The TA-15 was one that I looked at hard, but I decided that I wanted reverb, or at least a loop, so I set my sights higher. The TA-30 head was still small, but had more power AND reverb AND a loop. Shame they discontinued these. The Mini-Recto head had way more gain than I use, but was flexible enough for blues and pretty solid cleans.

But just when I was about to pop for the Mini-Recto, I lucked in a deal on a three-month old Mark V:25 stack with the head, slant, and straight Mini-Recto 112 V30 cabs...for dirt cheap...just a fantastic deal. Showroom new. And I have just fallen in love with it. It's not quite as flexible as my big Mark V combo, but amazing what it can do. Incredible features. With my old Seattle band, I probably could have used this amp on about 70% of the gigs we did, and probably 90% of the gigs I've done over the last 15 years with my current band.

So, it really just depends on what you have to spend and the level of features you want.

But all this aside, what you might want to consider is getting a good attenuator for your current amp. These can allow you to drive your amp so that the tubes are working good; inserted between the amp and speaker...it keeps the over-all volume to a minimum.

Might not be as much fun as a new little amp, but it could be a better solution to playing quietly at home.

Bill

Most of the low watt amps I've played sounded awful at low volumes. I haven't played that many but so far only the 5150 LBX has sounded good. Want to try Orange, but no shops around me have them.

Yeah...I probably should look into an attenuator. Don't really know anything about them. Any recommendations?

You're also right about the "fun new little amp" thing--I want a new toy!

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I haven't investigated attenuators for years, but when I did know about them the THD Hot Plate was the one to get. I'm sure the other guys with have a host of recommendations.

And new toys are always fun!

Bill

 

[Ascension]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Not the Jet City stuff. It only starts to sound good when it's pretty loud.

Guess you must have never played with one much cause both of mine sounded great at low volumes!! Much better than 90% of the tube amps I have ever worked with and that is one reason like these so much. The volume controls are tapered in a way they have a LOT more control on the lower side than most. Most amps have a big initial jump in volume but the Jet City's i have owned would both fool you into thinking they didn't have much volume. Reason was they really didn't get rolling until you got the volume over 5 or so. Most rigs are pretty much done by 5 on the volume but both Jet City's i have owned had good control all the way up.

 

[Ascension]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

How is Orange's small amp lineup at low volume (OR15, Dark Terror, Jim Root)? Do you need to get loud to get good tones?

I have never been able to get good low volume tone out of those Orange Terror series amps in particular. All of my smaller amps can do solid low volume tones. It's the reason I own what I do in my Boogie Subway the Zinky Velvet and the new Jet City.
Here is the Zinky in a super tiny room unmiced with just a delay running at a super low volume.

 

[Jacew]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I have never been able to get good low volume tone out of those Orange Terror series amps in particular. All of my smaller amps can do solid low volume tones. It's the reason I own what I do in my Boogie Subway the Zinky Velvet and the new Jet City.
Here is the Zinky in a super tiny room unmiced with just a delay running at a super low volume.

I don't know about these "metal-series" terrors, not my thing really, but I really like the way Tiny Terror sounds at low volumes. It just needs enough preamp gain start working well then: Between 2-3 o'clock it sounds brilliant for normal home-playing levels. At higher volumes you need to dial gain back, or it gets fizzy.

 

[dystrust]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I haven't investigated attenuators for years, but when I did know about them the THD Hot Plate was the one to get. I'm sure the other guys with have a host of recommendations.

And new toys are always fun!

Bill

I have a Hot Plate and it's decent for 4-8db of attenuation but you wouldn't want to go more than that. It can drop my cranked Jubilee 2555 to bedroom volume, but it sounds worse than a cheap solid state combo as a result.

 

[Red_Label]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

The Friedman Dirty Shirley Mini is no toy, I can assure you. It's amazing. And my incoming Wildwood Pink Taco is supposed to be a Mini version of my BE100. No toys there.

Also, the Bogner Atma that I played is no toy.

 

[some_dude]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

5w is all I need... provided it's mic'd into 10,000w of PA and I have 1000w of monitor in my face so I can hear it.

 

[guitfiddle]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I have never been able to get good low volume tone out of those Orange Terror series amps in particular. All of my smaller amps can do solid low volume tones. It's the reason I own what I do in my Boogie Subway the Zinky Velvet and the new Jet City.
Here is the Zinky in a super tiny room unmiced with just a delay running at a super low volume.

I don't know about these "metal-series" terrors, not my thing really, but I really like the way Tiny Terror sounds at low volumes. It just needs enough preamp gain start working well then: Between 2-3 o'clock it sounds brilliant for normal home-playing levels. At higher volumes you need to dial gain back, or it gets fizzy.

Yeah, the Tiny Terror in particular wasn't designed to sound good low. The reason it was created was to have an amp that you can crank WAY up onstage, without excess volume, that does the amp-about-to-freak-out thing...really well.

With the gain and volume both under noon, it gets wimpy very quickly, but with both controls over noon, it starts to breathe fire.

 

[Jacew]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Yeah, the Tiny Terror in particular wasn't designed to sound good low. The reason it was created was to have an amp that you can crank WAY up onstage, without excess volume, that does the amp-about-to-freak-out thing...really well.

With the gain and volume both under noon, it gets wimpy very quickly, but with both controls over noon, it starts to breathe fire.

That pretty much says why I had to upgrade. It does sound good at low volumes through bass heavy eminences I had, for very tight and controlled distortion tone. It sounded awful through Celestions until around noon at volume.

But then it gets a bit too uncontrolled and unbalanced to my taste. I hate feedback.

 

[James Rock]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Depends what you are talking when you mean Lunchbox amp, if you espect the 15w mesa dual rec to sound like the 100w it just wont does it sound worse...no its just different cos of different tubes. TBH 15 watt amps are never good at bedroom volumes they sound sweet with the volume fairly loud. Plenty of small wattage amps are awesome though, take a look at the clips of the Ceriatone Son of Yeti and 2203 both marshall types but with 6v6s so only 20 watts, which does not equate bedroom volumes though it is still kicking through a 412. Id say you would better getting an attuenator or something like the torpedo live if you need bedroom volumes. On the other hand if you want a slightly different rock tone through to cranked el34s/6l6s then the small 6v6 or el84 powered amp is cool. From what I can tell the Peavey mh isnt just a 6505 with a smaller power section it cuts other things as well because it only has 3 12ax7s where a 6505 has 5 and the 6505 plus has 6.

 

[Jacew]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Depends what you are talking when you mean Lunchbox amp, if you espect the 15w mesa dual rec to sound like the 100w it just wont does it sound worse...no its just different cos of different tubes. TBH 15 watt amps are never good at bedroom volumes they sound sweet with the volume fairly loud. Plenty of small wattage amps are awesome though, take a look at the clips of the Ceriatone Son of Yeti and 2203 both marshall types but with 6v6s so only 20 watts, which does not equate bedroom volumes though it is still kicking through a 412. Id say you would better getting an attuenator or something like the torpedo live if you need bedroom volumes. On the other hand if you want a slightly different rock tone through to cranked el34s/6l6s then the small 6v6 or el84 powered amp is cool. From what I can tell the Peavey mh isnt just a 6505 with a smaller power section it cuts other things as well because it only has 3 12ax7s where a 6505 has 5 and the 6505 plus has 6.

Have you played much with attenuators?

I'd say smaller wattage amp with working master volume is much better tonewise than big amp, throttled with attenuator.

 

[James Rock]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Have you played much with attenuators?

I'd say smaller wattage amp with working master volume is much better tonewise than big amp, throttled with attenuator.

I agree as a small amp user, but a cranked 20w amp is still above 100db it's loud and turning the master volume on a 20watt amp sounds bad, I'd say get a small amp plus a torpedo live and use can Sims but that's an investment. For bedroom volumes a joyo bantamp or something is a good option but won't sound anything like a real Jcm800. Some modern high gain amps sound better quieter than some 15w amps because all the tone is in the preamp not the power amp.

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk

 

[Jacew]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

I agree as a small amp user, but a cranked 20w amp is still above 100db it's loud and turning the master volume on a 20watt amp sounds bad, I'd say get a small amp plus a torpedo live and use can Sims but that's an investment. For bedroom volumes a joyo bantamp or something is a good option but won't sound anything like a real Jcm800. Some modern high gain amps sound better quieter than some 15w amps because all the tone is in the preamp not the power amp.

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk

Well, that depends how they're designed and your rig. Many amps don't sound good volume down and some do, regardless of wattage.

Most of distortion in TT, for intance, is from PI before master volume. Works fine with low volume, if you can get that single knob tone stack to work with your rig.

I just yesterday wrote review here about my new Egnater Rebel 20w, which really sounds just as good with master volume at home practice levels as at noon.

I don't believe in digital cab sims etc... They might sound good, but I don't like them.

 

[James Rock]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Well, that depends how they're designed and your rig. Many amps don't sound good volume down and some do, regardless of wattage.

Most of distortion in TT, for intance, is from PI before master volume. Works fine with low volume, if you can get that single knob tone stack to work with your rig.

I just yesterday wrote review here about my new Egnater Rebel 20w, which really sounds just as good with master volume at home practice levels as at noon.

I don't believe in digital cab sims etc... They might sound good, but I don't like them.

Yeah some are great and some aren't, regardless of wattage, good to know about the rebel never tried one or the tweaker but but they have me intrigued! Everything I've heard of the tiny terror hasnt really sold me as a replacement for a 'serious amp' not bad but doesn't sound like a jcm800 or hot rodded plexi on 10 I'd rather a dlx reverb or an ac15 and some pedals ,the Jim root and the dark terror however seem to sound great at low volumes, think that higher gains sound just works in its design (preamp and pi distortion). Yeah that's fair I don't like digital amp emulations but have found cabinet impulses pretty good but really that's more recording or headphones because only you have a good pa it isn't close to a real cab in the room (in some cases you can do better then any hobbyist can record their cab however).

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk

 

[Jacew]

Re: Lunchbox Amps - Legit or Toys?

Yeah some are great and some aren't, regardless of wattage, good to know about the rebel never tried one or the tweaker but but they have me intrigued! Everything I've heard of the tiny terror hasnt really sold me as a replacement for a 'serious amp' not bad but doesn't sound like a jcm800 or hot rodded plexi on 10 I'd rather a dlx reverb or an ac15 and some pedals ,the Jim root and the dark terror however seem to sound great at low volumes, think that higher gains sound just works in its design (preamp and pi distortion). Yeah that's fair I don't like digital amp emulations but have found cabinet impulses pretty good but really that's more recording or headphones because only you have a good pa it isn't close to a real cab in the room (in some cases you can do better then any hobbyist can record their cab however).

Sent from my SM-G955F using Tapatalk

Yep. It's not a replacement for "serious amp", unless your style is that dry all out rock'n'roll ala Status Quo. That it does perfectly.