Making my Les Paul Sound Better

ExplorersRock

ExplorersRock

X-Files Duckbucker
Here's what I got going on. I have an EPI LP. I put in a Custom in the bridge and a Slash in the Neck. Not quite there. I wanted some smoother sounds for the neck and top quality grit for the bridge. I started with all 500k pots and .022 caps. No go. Swapped the caps to .047. Better, thicker. Then, trying to get a little more warmth from both pickups, 300ks to replace the 500k volumes (tones stayed 500k). WAY TOO MUDDY! I was thinking maybe trying to just swap the .022 caps back in but doubt the impact will be specific enough to matter. Thinking of going back to 500k volumes, maybe 250k on the tones? What thoughts do you have?

My issues are I think the custom's eq is too level and the slash is a little thick in the bottom end and not smooth enough (the highs are a touch bright). Maybe lower the pickups? Maybe different pickups?:?:
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

I'd adjust PU and pole piece height first. You can change volumes and to some extent EQ's that way. Pole pieces should be down to the cover for warmth, and raised for a bit of brightness. To me, neck HB's need 500K's, otherwise you're muffled and muddy. The other thing would a roughcast A2 in neck, that's the only mag warmer than a polished A2; it's not a big difference, but between that and lowering the PU, that may give you enough smoothness for that slot. If not, I think PG's are smoother (less high end) than A2P's, so that may be a Plan B.

Customs are bright on top; I much prefer an A8 in them, which will fill in some mids and take off some treble. You won't lose any output and it should balance better with the neck, which then makes it easier to get an amp EQ setting that both PU's like.
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

blueman335 said:
I'd adjust PU and pole piece height first. You can change volumes and to some extent EQ's that way. Pole pieces should be down to the cover for warmth, and raised for a bit of brightness. To me, neck HB's need 500K's, otherwise you're muffled and muddy. The other thing would a roughcast A2 in neck, that's the only mag warmer than a polished A2; it's not a big difference, but between that and lowering the PU, that may give you enough smoothness for that slot. If not, I think PG's are smoother (less high end) than A2P's, so that may be a Plan B.

Customs are bright on top; I much prefer an A8 in them, which will fill in some mids and take off some treble. You won't lose any output and it should balance better with the neck, which then makes it easier to get an amp EQ setting that both PU's like.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I think I'm gonna put the 500k volumes back in and screw around with the height and pole pieces. If all else fails, I'll look into the rough cast A2. On the A8, I do have a C8 in another guitar and it definitely is better balanced. I may buy a new mag there. Ever try a Distortion in an LP? Or maybe a C/59 hybrid?
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

I'm surprised that changing a single pot made that much difference to you.
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

ExplorersRock said:
Here's what I got going on. I have an EPI LP. I put in a Custom in the bridge and a Slash in the Neck. Not quite there. I wanted some smoother sounds for the neck and top quality grit for the bridge. I started with all 500k pots and .022 caps. No go. Swapped the caps to .047. Better, thicker. Then, trying to get a little more warmth from both pickups, 300ks to replace the 500k volumes (tones stayed 500k). WAY TOO MUDDY! I was thinking maybe trying to just swap the .022 caps back in but doubt the impact will be specific enough to matter. Thinking of going back to 500k volumes, maybe 250k on the tones? What thoughts do you have?

My issues are I think the custom's eq is too level and the slash is a little thick in the bottom end and not smooth enough (the highs are a touch bright). Maybe lower the pickups? Maybe different pickups?:?:
Click to expand...

I'd sure go back to all 500K if it was my guitar. My hearing is shot and I can still hear and feel a big difference in the tone of Gibsons with a 300K pot vs. all 500K.

300K allows some treble to leak out of the circuit even when the pot is turned all the way up. Makes for a duller tone. Not a bad thing with ice pick bright Strat pickups but not so desirable with humbuckers. IMO, of course.

What surprised me was the comment that .047 mfd caps made the tone thicker. No offense but that's hard to believe. What should have happened is that some of the upper midrange disappeared when the tone control is turned down.

Maybe that translates as a thicker tone to you? :cool2:

What I notice when I go from .047 to .022 is a little more upper mids left in the signal with .022 when I turn the tone pot down. That's with 250K or 500K pots, because I use .022 in my Strats too.

YMMV though...
 
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Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

uOpt said:
I'm surprised that changing a single pot made that much difference to you.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't call the difference profound, but it was noticeable. Muddier. More so on the neck pickup. I never hear much of a difference with tone pots, but volumes do sound different to me.

Lewguitar said:
I'd sure go back to all 500K if it was my guitar. My hearing is shot and I can still hear and feel a big difference in the tone of Gibsons with a 300K pot vs. all 500K.

300K allows some treble to leak out of the circuit even when the pot is turned all the way up. Makes for a duller tone. Not a bad thing with ice pick bright Strat pickups but not so desirable with humbuckers. IMO, of course.

What surprised me was the comment that .047 mfd caps made the tone thicker. No offense but that's hard to believe. What should have happened is that some of the upper midrange disappeared when the tone control is turned down.

Maybe that translates as a thicker tone to you? :cool2:

What I notice when I go from .047 to .022 is a little more upper mids left in the signal with .022 when I turn the tone pot down. That's with 250K or 500K pots, because I use .022 in my Strats too.

YMMV though...
Click to expand...

2 thoughts. First, I think you and Blueman are right. Back to 500k. Second, you're description of the difference between the caps is a much better articulation of what I am hearing. I think that must be why I think "thicker." Because the upper mid-range has been clipped, I'm interpreting it that way. To me the upper mid-range of the JB has always made it sound sharp and somewhat thin to me. I get why the JB is popular, but it's never suited me. Now I do almost always roll my tone knobs back to at least a 9 or 8 in the bridge position, so this makes sense. I interpreted what I was hearing with the .022s as bright and thin. When I swapped to the .047, the tone seemed to get "thicker" but perhaps a better term might be "darker." Less highs, which I believe is the expected result of the cap switch. Very helpful Lew, thank you.
 
Making my Les Paul Sound Better

The slash pickups are known to be very bright, almost to bright for a lot of people.

You may want to try a regular A2pro or jazz neck if your looking for something less piercing and more balanced.

Personally I like the full shred neck for a bit more clarity and articulation.while still being warm and balanced. Gonna be hard to mag swap the bright edge out of an A2 pickup.
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

The first thing I might try is swapping the two pickups you mentioned. You have them there already, and who knows; it might give you just what you want, even though each is technically wound for the other position.
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

ItsaBass said:
The first thing I might try is swapping the two pickups you mentioned. You have them there already, and who knows; it might give you just what you want, even though each is technically wound for the other position.
Click to expand...

This never occurred to in any way but now I am earnestly considering it. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

ItsaBass said:
The first thing I might try is swapping the two pickups you mentioned. You have them there already, and who knows; it might give you just what you want, even though each is technically wound for the other position.
Click to expand...

While usually a good idea, I´d refrain from using the custom in the neck. It DOES sound absolutely huge, but like in a king kong on steroids, meth, crack and bath salts kind of way. Just waaay too big to be of any meaningful use. IMO, but then again as one of the resident "JBs work just fine in the neck" guys, maybe that opinion actually matters for something... :laugh2:

Side note: that guitar actually has a Custom at the bridge, and the outputs match up just fine. Just as a bit of a guage of how hot it would actually be at the neck and why that might not be such a great idea.

But it might work out just fine for you, that´s the nature of the beast. But I´m fairly sure the Custom at the neck will eat a Slash bridge alive. Or any other pickup for that matter short of a DD, Invader, Dirty Fingers or similar scorcher...

I agree with blueman, try fiddlilng with the pole and PU height, esp on the custom. Also, consider trying a 1 meg volume pot on the custom if you´ve already got 500k on both vol and tone.
 
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Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

Just my 2 cents as the advice you have so far is great! If you dont get things dialed in with the pots caps and adjusting, then I would also say to try making the custom to a C8. You mentioned a distortion. Yeah, those sound great in LPs too, but so do customs. It may be that your particular guitar is alil brighter and needs tamed down alittle. The C8 would warm it up. If you cant find anything that works with the combo you have, then try a PG neck and bridge. I resisted for a long time with those cuz I didnt think the PG would have enough ballz for me, but they deliver in spades.. good luck!! and let us know what ends up working for you!!
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

I say Put a Pearly in the neck you can either keep the A2 thats in there or swap it out for a3 or a4 but I think you will like it with the stock a2. For the bridge the C8 might just be the trick I just did that swap yesterday and when I went to play I liked it better then when I had the UOA5 in it. The C8 is darker an thicker then the CC but I have a Alder body maple top super strat with a brass big block on my floyd so I dont mind the low mids and a lil darkness. And the C8 and my PGn with a3 match up way better now in out put and EQ although the C8 may be a lil bit louder it still matches up well. Best part for me was the cleans from the C8 way better then most medium output pups ive heard that was a big plus with me a big surprise to. I heard some people say its not very dynamic or organic sounding and no character but I dont think that but Ive only played with it for a couple hours but my thoughts are its not as dynamic as a2 or UOa5 but it still has great dynamics I will say I do miss a lil bit of that openness that the UOA5 had. It is definitely modern sounding because of the mid presence but for what I do I dont mind it honestly and both the C8 and PGn with the a3 work well in my guitar. Neck is smooth bass is tight not boomy an not to loose. C8 not as smooth as the PG but not sharp this was wat i loved about the CC, great bass just thick enough not super tight but not to loose I would like more of a growl in the low mids but overall im happy so far with the set. They match up so well that when im playing if im not paying attention to which PUP I have switched to I almost cant tell the diff some might not like that but they still have their differences especially when your vol is on ten you will really notice.
 
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Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

Zerberus said:
While usually a good idea, I´d refrain from using the custom in the neck. It DOES sound absolutely huge, but like in a king kong on steroids, meth, crack and bath salts kind of way. Just waaay too big to be of any meaningful use. IMO, but then again as one of the resident "JBs work just fine in the neck" guys, maybe that opinion actually matters for something... :laugh2:

Side note: that guitar actually has a Custom at the bridge, and the outputs match up just fine. Just as a bit of a guage of how hot it would actually be at the neck and why that might not be such a great idea.

But it might work out just fine for you, that´s the nature of the beast. But I´m fairly sure the Custom at the neck will eat a Slash bridge alive. Or any other pickup for that matter short of a DD, Invader, Dirty Fingers or similar scorcher...

I agree with blueman, try fiddlilng with the pole and PU height, esp on the custom. Also, consider trying a 1 meg volume pot on the custom if you´ve already got 500k on both vol and tone.
Click to expand...

Set low, and with the Slash set high, I think a bridge Custom might do all right. As for a volume mismatch, I actually prefer my neck to be a bit hotter. Brings out the smooth creaminess of the lower tones. Worth a shot, anyhow, based on what the OP has in hand and what he said he wanted. Setup is everything, though.
 
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Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

I'm a Hamer fan. And at one time I owned two Hamer Monoco Super Pros. They came with a Custom in the neck and Custom Custom in the bridge. Loved the guitars but hated that pickup configuration.

Hated the Custom in the neck. Changed it to a Seth Lover in one and an Antiquity in the other.

Much better.

I hadn't discovered the Pearly Gates neck yet.

That would have been even better.
 
Re: Making my Les Paul Sound Better

Call me old fashioned...I pretty much just use 250k for single coils and 500k for humbuckers...One time I did try using a 250k with a bright humbucker in the bridge,but I still went back to the 500k there..

I ended up just ditching that bright bridge pickup..
 
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