Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
- Thread starter Kommerzbassist
- Start date
MikeS
Bengalsologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
The DSL is definatly cheaper than the TSL. I think the DSL is made in a combo. Head wise, the cheapest would be the DSL50. Only 50 watts, but when are you ever going to need 100 watts? (the DSL50 runs ~50-100 bucks cheaper than the DSL100). The TSLs run about $200 more than the DSLs if memory serves. You can always look them up on musiciansfriend just to get an idea of the prices for new amps.
The DSL is definatly cheaper than the TSL. I think the DSL is made in a combo. Head wise, the cheapest would be the DSL50. Only 50 watts, but when are you ever going to need 100 watts? (the DSL50 runs ~50-100 bucks cheaper than the DSL100). The TSLs run about $200 more than the DSLs if memory serves. You can always look them up on musiciansfriend just to get an idea of the prices for new amps.
stevie_bees
Cat In The Hatministrator
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
I love the diversity of sound I can get from my TSL, even more now I'm using SD pickups.
I love the diversity of sound I can get from my TSL, even more now I'm using SD pickups.
benjaturner
New member
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
Wow, what a really cool thread. I've learnt loads just flicking through this now. Thanks to everyone who contributed.
Wow, what a really cool thread. I've learnt loads just flicking through this now. Thanks to everyone who contributed.
guitarsrock5
New member
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
yah me too thanks for the advice!
yah me too thanks for the advice!
JeffB
Let it B
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
heh..jes a marshall freak here..but YW...
I had to mention though. The amp in your sig? IMO thats a better sounding amp than any of the 2000 series (in the general sense at least). I had a JTM60 combo, and it was similar to my 800 series channel switcher when compared gain channel to gain channel (stock), and the clean channel on the JTM was better than the 800. Got really good tones out of it. Unfortunately I had one of the POS ones that fried, but by the time it did I had already purchased my 1987X..and after that there was no looking back... NMV's RAWK
benjaturner said:
heh..jes a marshall freak here..but YW...
I had to mention though. The amp in your sig? IMO thats a better sounding amp than any of the 2000 series (in the general sense at least). I had a JTM60 combo, and it was similar to my 800 series channel switcher when compared gain channel to gain channel (stock), and the clean channel on the JTM was better than the 800. Got really good tones out of it. Unfortunately I had one of the POS ones that fried, but by the time it did I had already purchased my 1987X..and after that there was no looking back... NMV's RAWK
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
I'm a big fan of Marshalls, and have owned all of the ones mentioned in the thread, and have tried all the ones I never owned. I won't say that certain ones are better or worse, expecially if they were designed completely different. They all suit a particular Marshall flavor perfectly....you just have to pick the one that is closest to what you want.
Plexi ZZ Top, Free, Hendrix, Page type of sound. Levant, no corner caps, small logo.
JMP Metalfront cleaner with sweeter OD than 800's...think Yngwie, Blackmore, early Aerosmith tones, most early 70's rock. Levant, no corner caps, small logo
Late 70's Mastervolumes. black levant front panel, big logo, plastic cornercaps. Think Indie Rock, Punk, Garage Rock. Ramones and Monster Magnet.
JCM 800. Think Kiss, Motley, Judas Priest, Ozzy, etc 80's metal that's not superhighgain. black cloth front, big logo, corner caps.
87 Silver Jubilee, 88 Black Jubilee, Slash Model. Cloth front, corner caps, channel switching between clean JCM 800 tone and super hot rodded 800 tone. It's basically an 800 with a diode clipping Tube Screamer circuit built into it's gain stage. Tonally, it'll give you everything between Slash's tone and Zakk Wylde's tone. Enough gain for liquid sustain and tight palm muted chunk. Sounds sweeter and slightly more vintage than DSL's, but has the same kind of gain. The prices for all these models is climbing quickly, so buy soon!
JCM 900. Their second stab at putting 6L6's in an amp, but without the tone the JTM 45's had.
They added reverb to both channels. Kind of a cold sterile sounding tube amp with crappy reverb. Still has the JCM 800 sound, but doesn't sound quite as good on either channel. The EL-34 versions are better, but still not as good as most Marshalls. Tubed and biased right, they can sound decent, but I'd only buy at rock bottom prices for these......and that's about all they fetch.
DSL. The Drake tranny versions (early DSL's) were the better ones, although the Axiom tranny ones are pretty good too. These are the most versatile 2 channel Marshalls to date, and cover all the bases very well. Well worth buying for highgain Marshall fans. If you want a highgain tube Marshall, the DSL and Jubilee are the ones to get.
TSL. A few too many bells and whistles made them sound a bit lesser than DSL's.
They have 3 channels, but the tone is just......OK. Known to have channel switching problems that need warrantee service, from what I've heard from owners. Still, a good versatile 3 ch. all tube amp, so it's worth buying used at a decent price.
I won't even mention solid state Marshalls. Different strokes for different folks. :13:
I'm a big fan of Marshalls, and have owned all of the ones mentioned in the thread, and have tried all the ones I never owned. I won't say that certain ones are better or worse, expecially if they were designed completely different. They all suit a particular Marshall flavor perfectly....you just have to pick the one that is closest to what you want.
Plexi ZZ Top, Free, Hendrix, Page type of sound. Levant, no corner caps, small logo.
JMP Metalfront cleaner with sweeter OD than 800's...think Yngwie, Blackmore, early Aerosmith tones, most early 70's rock. Levant, no corner caps, small logo
Late 70's Mastervolumes. black levant front panel, big logo, plastic cornercaps. Think Indie Rock, Punk, Garage Rock. Ramones and Monster Magnet.
JCM 800. Think Kiss, Motley, Judas Priest, Ozzy, etc 80's metal that's not superhighgain. black cloth front, big logo, corner caps.
87 Silver Jubilee, 88 Black Jubilee, Slash Model. Cloth front, corner caps, channel switching between clean JCM 800 tone and super hot rodded 800 tone. It's basically an 800 with a diode clipping Tube Screamer circuit built into it's gain stage. Tonally, it'll give you everything between Slash's tone and Zakk Wylde's tone. Enough gain for liquid sustain and tight palm muted chunk. Sounds sweeter and slightly more vintage than DSL's, but has the same kind of gain. The prices for all these models is climbing quickly, so buy soon!
JCM 900. Their second stab at putting 6L6's in an amp, but without the tone the JTM 45's had.
They added reverb to both channels. Kind of a cold sterile sounding tube amp with crappy reverb. Still has the JCM 800 sound, but doesn't sound quite as good on either channel. The EL-34 versions are better, but still not as good as most Marshalls. Tubed and biased right, they can sound decent, but I'd only buy at rock bottom prices for these......and that's about all they fetch.DSL. The Drake tranny versions (early DSL's) were the better ones, although the Axiom tranny ones are pretty good too. These are the most versatile 2 channel Marshalls to date, and cover all the bases very well. Well worth buying for highgain Marshall fans. If you want a highgain tube Marshall, the DSL and Jubilee are the ones to get.
TSL. A few too many bells and whistles made them sound a bit lesser than DSL's.
They have 3 channels, but the tone is just......OK. Known to have channel switching problems that need warrantee service, from what I've heard from owners. Still, a good versatile 3 ch. all tube amp, so it's worth buying used at a decent price.
I won't even mention solid state Marshalls. Different strokes for different folks. :13:
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Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
bump
bump
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
The JCM800 is a great rip roaring monster for just about any tone I can dream of. (That is, anything 80's rock)
The JCM2000 sounds like something off the alt rock station that we have programed out of our stereo's and blocked on our digital TV.
Thats the impression I got from the one at the local guitar store.
The JCM800 is a great rip roaring monster for just about any tone I can dream of. (That is, anything 80's rock)
The JCM2000 sounds like something off the alt rock station that we have programed out of our stereo's and blocked on our digital TV.
Thats the impression I got from the one at the local guitar store.
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pinto79
New member
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
The beauty of the JCM800 is that is has the best base tone you could ask for (I know, I've owned 6 of them...)
Almost any OD/distortion pedal works with them to push them into any range you want. When dialed in right, they cut through ANYTHING.
I really miss mine... (*snif*)
I had one that had been previously owned by Bob Rock (Metallica producer) and it was positively the best amp I have EVER owned. I never should have loaned it out...
The beauty of the JCM800 is that is has the best base tone you could ask for (I know, I've owned 6 of them...)
Almost any OD/distortion pedal works with them to push them into any range you want. When dialed in right, they cut through ANYTHING.
I really miss mine... (*snif*)
I had one that had been previously owned by Bob Rock (Metallica producer) and it was positively the best amp I have EVER owned. I never should have loaned it out...
Reckless Abandon
New member
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
I had a dsl and now I have a modded jcm 800. Out of the box the 800 is not going to have the amount of gain for metal unless you can crank it up even then it does not have a lot of gain but a nice growl. BUt modded the 800 is the most awesome thing ever. The added gain did not take the personality out of the 800. I suggest getting an 800 and having it modded. the clean is not perfect but i can roll down the volume even on my jb and get a decent clean.
I had a dsl and now I have a modded jcm 800. Out of the box the 800 is not going to have the amount of gain for metal unless you can crank it up even then it does not have a lot of gain but a nice growl. BUt modded the 800 is the most awesome thing ever. The added gain did not take the personality out of the 800. I suggest getting an 800 and having it modded. the clean is not perfect but i can roll down the volume even on my jb and get a decent clean.
Kommerzbassist
Thunderbirdologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
Hey people... sorry to bump this old thread, but I've been away for a time and I still have questions:
What's the Plexi? Are those the Vintage Series?
How much must they be cranked to sound good? I mean it's going right into my new flat... it can be load but not too extreme... Are the 50W Versions generaly warmer sounding?
Another thing... how much difference in wall penetration does a 2x12 vs a 4x12 cab make?
thanks
Hey people... sorry to bump this old thread, but I've been away for a time and I still have questions:
What's the Plexi? Are those the Vintage Series?
How much must they be cranked to sound good? I mean it's going right into my new flat... it can be load but not too extreme... Are the 50W Versions generaly warmer sounding?
Another thing... how much difference in wall penetration does a 2x12 vs a 4x12 cab make?
thanks
Kommerzbassist
Thunderbirdologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
Ah yes and what are the tonal differences between the 1959SLP and the 1987X?
thanks
Ah yes and what are the tonal differences between the 1959SLP and the 1987X?
thanks
The Golden Boy
Fleecy Sweaterologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
Are 50w generally warmer? I personally think so, just because you're able to push the 50 watts. For many years I lugged around 100w amps "just in case" I needed that extra volume, and I passed up a lot of really cool amps because they were "only" 50w. The only time I ever came close to needing 100w was at an outdoor frat party- but I would have been better served with another cabinet than cranking the amp's volume more. Another 100w issue is they're only like 12% louder than a 50w.
I prefer the sound of a 4x12. I haven't found a 2x12 that gets the full depth and "my sound" out of it.
My old 77 non-MV JMP 100w had to be at 8 to sound "decent" but at that volume it was completely unusable for any practical application. The only way to use it in a "bedroom" setting is to go with an attenuator. I've heard the best attenuator for your amp is the Hotplate, it's a fully reactive load- from what I understand. While the JTM-45 reissues are supposed to be pretty cool, there's not a lot of volume (still louder than living room levels)- so you're getting a cool tone around 6, but there's not a lot of headroom between 6-10.Kommerzbassist said:
Are 50w generally warmer? I personally think so, just because you're able to push the 50 watts. For many years I lugged around 100w amps "just in case" I needed that extra volume, and I passed up a lot of really cool amps because they were "only" 50w. The only time I ever came close to needing 100w was at an outdoor frat party- but I would have been better served with another cabinet than cranking the amp's volume more. Another 100w issue is they're only like 12% louder than a 50w.
I prefer the sound of a 4x12. I haven't found a 2x12 that gets the full depth and "my sound" out of it.
MikeS
Bengalsologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
Try loading a 4x12 cab with 2 12s. Theoretically, the additional volume (assuming a closed back cab) will deepen the low end response of the cab. The trade off is a slight loss of what you might refer to as "tightness." I'm not positive it'll work yet, but I am planning on testing it out this weekend.
edit: forgot to add... you'll need to close the other two holes by leaving two dummy speakers.
The Golden Boy said:
Try loading a 4x12 cab with 2 12s. Theoretically, the additional volume (assuming a closed back cab) will deepen the low end response of the cab. The trade off is a slight loss of what you might refer to as "tightness." I'm not positive it'll work yet, but I am planning on testing it out this weekend.
edit: forgot to add... you'll need to close the other two holes by leaving two dummy speakers.
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The Golden Boy
Fleecy Sweaterologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
I'm not trying to be snotty, but what's the point in pulling 2 speakers out of a 4x12?
You still have a full size cab and 85+ per cent of the weight.
Since you edited to close the holes- you're not worrying about the empty holes working as ports or destroying the "infinite baffle" of the sealed cab. But if you're going to go with the same volume of air inside a 4x12, the only thing you're trading off is the weight of 2 speakers.
I was in a band with a guitarist that went with 2 speakers in a 4x12. Two were blown or had most of the paper removed or just removed the speakers. It sounded like crap. Of course, even if he would have had the nicest cab and amp in the world it would have sounded like crap. He was playing a Gibson Sonex.
I'm not trying to be snotty, but what's the point in pulling 2 speakers out of a 4x12?
You still have a full size cab and 85+ per cent of the weight.
Since you edited to close the holes- you're not worrying about the empty holes working as ports or destroying the "infinite baffle" of the sealed cab. But if you're going to go with the same volume of air inside a 4x12, the only thing you're trading off is the weight of 2 speakers.
I was in a band with a guitarist that went with 2 speakers in a 4x12. Two were blown or had most of the paper removed or just removed the speakers. It sounded like crap. Of course, even if he would have had the nicest cab and amp in the world it would have sounded like crap. He was playing a Gibson Sonex.
MikeS
Bengalsologist
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
I did say to close the holes... besides, the holes are much too large and not nearly long enough to act as ports. Instead, it's act like an open back cab. Additionally, sealed speaker enclosures are about as opposite as you can get from an infinite baffle (or free air). An open back cab would be an infinite baffle design. A sealed enclosure would only act as an infinite baffle if the volume of the cab (or in this case, half the volume) exceeded the VAS of the driver. It's possible that I could exceed the VAS of the driver. All that will do is effectively lower the power handling of the speaker, but not below the recommended rating (most peak and rms values are calculated for infinite baffle. As the ratio of volume/VAS decreases, the speaker's power handling capabilities actually increase). The resulting effect is that you double the volume to VAS when two speakers are cut out of the loop. Now, the reason your friend's cabinet sounded terrible likely has as mush to do with impedance mismatches as it does with volume. I should have added that I'm not disconnecting two speakers, but rather using (2) 8 ohm drivers in series for a 16 ohm load to match the output on the transformer.
In the end, you may very well be right that it won't sound the greatest. You'd be right, but not for the right reasons...
The Golden Boy said:
I did say to close the holes... besides, the holes are much too large and not nearly long enough to act as ports. Instead, it's act like an open back cab. Additionally, sealed speaker enclosures are about as opposite as you can get from an infinite baffle (or free air). An open back cab would be an infinite baffle design. A sealed enclosure would only act as an infinite baffle if the volume of the cab (or in this case, half the volume) exceeded the VAS of the driver. It's possible that I could exceed the VAS of the driver. All that will do is effectively lower the power handling of the speaker, but not below the recommended rating (most peak and rms values are calculated for infinite baffle. As the ratio of volume/VAS decreases, the speaker's power handling capabilities actually increase). The resulting effect is that you double the volume to VAS when two speakers are cut out of the loop. Now, the reason your friend's cabinet sounded terrible likely has as mush to do with impedance mismatches as it does with volume. I should have added that I'm not disconnecting two speakers, but rather using (2) 8 ohm drivers in series for a 16 ohm load to match the output on the transformer.
In the end, you may very well be right that it won't sound the greatest. You'd be right, but not for the right reasons...
Stevo
Tonus Maximus Pacificas
Re: Marshall JCM800 vs JCM2000 Series
I prefer the vintage Marshall tones but still think the DSL amps are pretty cool.
You can get nice nasty tone at low volume and very good clean tone. The tone is not as raw as the vintage Marshalls but not everyone wants those sounds.
I have had a Marshall 2203 JCM800, a JMP 2204 and now I have a 1987x plexi reissue. The plexi has the best clean tone of these 3 and I like the distortion when it's cranked. It is a little smoother than my 2204 when distorted. I use it with an attenuator, otherwise the volume would not be practical. You can buy a mini mass for $100.
With any Marshall, I highly recommend a 412 closed back cabinet with Celestion Greenbacks or similar speakers.
I prefer the vintage Marshall tones but still think the DSL amps are pretty cool.
You can get nice nasty tone at low volume and very good clean tone. The tone is not as raw as the vintage Marshalls but not everyone wants those sounds.
I have had a Marshall 2203 JCM800, a JMP 2204 and now I have a 1987x plexi reissue. The plexi has the best clean tone of these 3 and I like the distortion when it's cranked. It is a little smoother than my 2204 when distorted. I use it with an attenuator, otherwise the volume would not be practical. You can buy a mini mass for $100.
With any Marshall, I highly recommend a 412 closed back cabinet with Celestion Greenbacks or similar speakers.
