Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

jerryjg

PinkElephantologist
So whats the deal with Matchless ?. They are supposed to be the ultimate in well built amps. They are purported to be the finest sounding amps. I would say that my first prmeium amp if I ever had a choice now would a matchless, just based on what little Ive heard about them.
Ive also heard great things about Bad Cat. What about Bad cat? I want to start gearing up for my first "botique" non-Fender clone/non High Gain purchase.
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Mark sampson (who tarted both Matchless and BadCat) was one of the first high end/handmade/big dollar amp makes out there however his amps are not for everybody...I STRONGLY urge you to try ANY Matchless or BadCat you think you want BEFORE you buy one...

Im not at all saying that they are bad but just keep in mind they are not foreverybody.
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

They definitely have a unique tone. Matchless is legendary. I wish I could say the same about Bad Cat - I've heard horror story after horror story about their reliability (or lack thereof).
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

I suggest you work backwards when looking for a high-end amp. Try and approach it like this:

"This is the tone I love. What's the best amp I can buy for that tone?"

Think of a tone you want to go after and narrow it down from there. For example, it's fairly safe to say that you have to be into Vox-style amps to really suit most of what matchless and badcat make. Mark Sampson basically started out attempting to build an AC30 that wouldn't break down. From that, the DC30 was born, and the rest is history...

Some very general guidelines based on what I've played/heard:

Do you want a tweed fender sound: Victoria
Do you like Blackface: Swart, Carr, Bogner Duende
Is vox your thing?: Matchless, Bad Cat, 65
How about marshall?: Germino, Bogner, Roccaforte, Metroamp
Need channel switching/high gain?: Bogner, Egnater, Diezel, Mesa, Rivera, Soldano

...then there's some makers that do a little of everything depending on model: /13, 65, Top Hat, Bogner...
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

I suggest you work backwards when looking for a high-end amp. Try and approach it like this:

"This is the tone I love. What's the best amp I can buy for that tone?"

Think of a tone you want to go after and narrow it down from there. For example, it's fairly safe to say that you have to be into Vox-style amps to really suit most of what matchless and badcat make. Mark Sampson basically started out attempting to build an AC30 that wouldn't break down. From that, the DC30 was born, and the rest is history...

Some very general guidelines based on what I've played/heard:

Do you want a tweed fender sound: Victoria
Do you like Blackface: Swart, Carr, Bogner Duende
Is vox your thing?: Matchless, Bad Cat, 65
How about marshall?: Germino, Bogner, Roccaforte, Metroamp
Need channel switching/high gain?: Bogner, Egnater, Diezel, Mesa, Rivera, Soldano

...then there's some makers that do a little of everything depending on model: /13, 65, Top Hat, Bogner...


Great post!

I think sometimes it helps to just not even think about what it is a amp is supposed to do, just plug in and really feel what it's all about. Sometimes I can dismiss an amp based on its power tubes or brand, but when I give it a chance I find there are tones that blow me away. A person can miss a lot by not giving other amp types a try. Just play stuff for the sake of playing stuff.

If you find a link between the amps that you really like then you know what to focus on from that point on.
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Or, like me, you discover that you like all kinds of amps!

-If you can try everything you can get your hands on. If nothing else, it's fun...
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Sometimes, I almost feel embarrassed popping up in all these amp threads like Bogner/Matchless etc, but they're 2 California companies, and I was pretty deep in the music and gear scene out here. So here's a story from uncle GJ!

In the early 90's, I was playing in LA rock and blues bands, but also had a girlfriend that played stuff like Stevie Nicks. Her guitar player was an early partner in the Matchless Co. and I played bass in the band just to stay busy.

So, I had access to all the early Matchless amps, because the guitarist would bring a different one to practice every night. Awesome for me!!! I was using a Marshall/Mesa rack in my own band at the time, but was intrigued by these new $3000 amps, which had a lit up logo.

Like others said, Matchless was born by Mark Sampson, Rick Perrotta, and Phil Jamison's desire to build a roadworthy GREAT sounding Vox. Then, they branched out with other models loosely based on Bassman/JTM45 like the Chieftain and Clubman.

Being a rocker, I wasn't sure it was my sound back then, but kept my mind and ears open when the boutique craze hit. I learned what different amp models excelled at, and Matchless/Badcat is for the player that wants clean breakup at a normal stage volume.
The sound is more akin to Petty, Toad the Wet Sprocket, REM etc. If that's not your vibe, you don't need a Matchless or Badcat.

The main thing with boutique amps is to find ones that suit your exact style, and just because it has a high price tag doesn't mean you'll like it.

Early on, I realized how much better boutique amps were than even the old vintage amps. It's arguable, but I think I'm right. You just have to find the right one, and invest in it. You'll save money over time. Years ago, I determined that for ME, the Bogner was my dream gainy amp and the Matchless Chieftain was my dream clean amp.
I did everything I could, and sold all my stuff to get them, so I wouldn't have to keep going through subpar gear.

Overall, I think I did the right thing, because I haven't bought new amps in almost 10 years, because quite frankly, nothing can beat the Ecstasy or Chieftain....nothing. nada.
On the used market, I bought the Ecstasy head for $2175, 4-12 for $700, 212 for $375, and the Matchless for $2000. A lot of money upfront, but that was the end of the spending, so I actually saved money NOT going through more amps to nail the sound.
I even had other Matchless amps, which I sold. The Chieftain won. It even killed all the Fenders and Fender PtoP clones I owned.

So, for all those wondering about a guy who's owned exactly 89 guitar amps.....that's the end for me. Bogner Ecstasy and Matchless Chieftain. And to be honest, the Bogner's clean channel is every bit as good as the Chieftain's clean. I've even thought about doing the impossible and selling the Chieftain for a Bogner Duende Seca Mojado.
 
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Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Sometimes, I almost feel embarrassed popping up in all these amp threads like Bogner/Matchless etc, but they're 2 California companies, and I was pretty deep in the music and gear scene out here. So here's a story from uncle GJ!

In the early 90's, I was playing in LA rock and blues bands, but also had a girlfriend that played stuff like Stevie Nicks. Her guitar player was an early partner in the Matchless Co. and I played bass in the band just to stay busy.

So, I had access to all the early Matchless amps, because the guitarist would bring a different one to practice every night. Awesome for me!!! I was using a Marshall/Mesa rack in my own band at the time, but was intrigued by these new $3000 amps, which had a lit up logo.

Like others said, Matchless was born by Mark Sampson and Phil Jamison's desire to build a roadworthy GREAT sounding Vox. Then, they branched out with other models loosely based on Bassman/JTM45 like the Chieftain and Clubman.

Being a rocker, I wasn't sure it was my sound back then, but kept my mind and ears open when the boutique craze hit. I learned what different amp models excelled at, and Matchless/Badcat is for the player that wants clean breakup at a normal stage volume.
The sound is more akin to Petty, Toad the Wet Sprocket, REM etc. If that's not your vibe, you don't need a Matchless or Badcat.

The main thing with boutique amps is to find ones that suit your exact style, and just because it has a high price tag doesn't mean you'll like it.

Early on, I realized how much better boutique amps were than even the old vintage amps. It's arguable, but I think I'm right. You just have to find the right one, and invest in it. You'll save money over time. Years ago, I determined that for ME, the Bogner was my dream gainy amp and the Matchless Chieftain was my dream clean amp.
I did everything I could, and sold all my stuff to get them, so I wouldn't have to keep going through subpar gear.

Overall, I think I did the right thing, because I haven't bought new amps in almost 10 years, because quite frankly, nothing can beat the Ecstasy or Chieftain....nothing. nada.
On the used market, I bought the Ecstasy head for $2175, 4-12 for $700, 212 for $375, and the Matchless for $2000. A lot of money upfront, but that was the end of the spending, so I actually saved money NOT going through more amps to nail the sound.
I even had other Matchless amps, which I sold. The Chieftain won. It even killed all the Fenders and Fender PtoP clones I owned.

So, for all those wondering about a guy who's owned exactly 89 guitar amps.....that's the end for me. Bogner Ecstasy and Matchless Chieftain. And to be honest, the Bogner's clean channel is every bit as good as the Chieftain's clean. I've even thought about doing the impossible and selling the Chieftain for a Bogner Duende Sola Mojado.

Thats pricless info.& much appreciated.
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

But....here's the thing. Boutique amps just get better and better.

Events like the NAMM show and Amp Show remind me of that. I don't feel a big need to chase it, but there's some great stuff coming out.

In my last post I stated that the Chieftain was my favorite clean amp, but since clean/edgy clean comes in a lot of flavors, there's some new stuff that's amazing.

Phil Jamison bought out Mark Sampson's share in Matchless, and Phil is doing more progressive things with Matchless. The newest Matchless amps are nothing short of tonal miracles.
The King Cobra and Independence are so awesome.

Also, the 65 Amps are the greatest Marshall/Vox blend. Divided by 13 and Tone King are creating the best Fender style amps I've ever heard.

I really don't want to sell anything I own, but amps like these are tempting me to move things around, in order to aquire them. I simply can't toss out thousands for new amps, but a 65 Amps London head, Matchless King Cobra, and Tone King Meteor II are 3 amps I'd love to have.
I've tried a few Divided by 13 amps, but need to pinpoint the model I like most before I even comment on them. The ones I've tried are great, but not totally what I want.

Here's a cool Matchless thread on the Gear page.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=336848
 
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Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Sometimes, I almost feel embarrassed popping up in all these amp threads like Bogner/Matchless etc, but

But nuttin!

Your an experienced cat... good posts with competent first hand information & opinions other then "rwaks mang" are invaluable.

they branched out with other models loosely based on Bassman/JTM45 like the Chieftain and Clubman.

Being a rocker, I wasn't sure it was my sound back then, but kept my mind and ears open when the boutique craze hit. I learned what different amp models excelled at, and Matchless/Badcat is for the player that wants clean breakup at a normal stage volume.
The sound is more akin to Petty, Toad the Wet Sprocket, REM etc. If that's not your vibe, you don't need a Matchless or Badcat.

The first players I dug that showed up on the radar w/those early Matchless Clubmans & DC30's were Rich Robinson & Marc Ford... Black Crowes circa '94-95? It was such an unreal tone... especially live & being close enough to hear it coming off the stage... my friends and I would leave the shows & wonder what those backlit amps were!


Early on, I realized how much better boutique amps were than even the old vintage amps. It's arguable, but I think I'm right. You just have to find the right one, and invest in it. You'll save money over time.

I'll agree but also argue it... How many of the boutique amps are direct copies or just "deeply inspired" by the grail amps of yesteryear? Why spend serious coin on a Victoria when you could buy the old Fender it's a copy of for roughly the same?

That's where it gets weird and personal... investments and all that.

I prefer investing in the stock market when I can! My '62 blonde/brown Bandmaster came to me in a Scam Cash parking lot deal for $125. I'm not that well off...

But some of the boutiques, they take those old designs and go a step beyond. That's wicked kool and the whole point IMO.
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Was never much into them...they are like PRS to me...overpriced, and I think they are messy amps on the inside as well....but that is irrelevant, just never got the price and what sounds you get for that price!
I have a way better time understanding something like Mojave and Tophat....those are extraordinary wellmade and sounding amps:)
To me most Matchless sounds like tubecooking thingies....lol just different taste!
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Was never much into them...they are like PRS to me...overpriced, and I think they are messy amps on the inside as well....but that is irrelevant, just never got the price and what sounds you get for that price!
I have a way better time understanding something like Mojave and Tophat....those are extraordinary wellmade and sounding amps:)
To me most Matchless sounds like tubecooking thingies....lol just different taste!

played most of the current Top Hat range recently, and I gotta say that they were the least impressive boutique amps I've tried over the last two years. Far from terrible, but nothing special, apart from the sweet 16, which was very nice.
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

I'll agree but also argue it... How many of the boutique amps are direct copies or just "deeply inspired" by the grail amps of yesteryear? Why spend serious coin on a Victoria when you could buy the old Fender it's a copy of for roughly the same?

Well, in my case, Leo didn't build a 5E3 tweed deluxe that puts out 30-50W into two 12s. And at the time I ordered mine there were only three 4x6V6 amps out there: Victoria, /13 FTR, and Orange Rockerverb. Now there's the 65 Monterey, the Swart SST and Rivera have one as well. Sofar I love every 4x6V6 amp I've tried, but the Vic is still top of the heap for me.

But say you wanted a direct tweed clone, well, have you spotted a bandmaster recently? how about an original bassman in good working condition? if you could afford one, would you drop the vintage value to make it gigable? would you gig it? -that's where Vics start to become value for money.

I'm a bit like GJ in his instance: I bought the Vic on special order, and have tried a bunch of similarly priced amps since. A lot of nice stuff that I'd like to own for other uses and tones, but nothing that has made me want to move the Vic on and buy something else.
 
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Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

^Then again...you are a difficult person;)

haha, you don't know the half of it. I'm screwed forever when it comes to amps. Hanging out every week in a room with Victorias, Swarts, Splawns, 65s, Matamps and assorted other high end gear has made it very difficult for me to enjoy a trip to the local chain store...

And being screwed for cheap amps has a by-product: I'm really not interested in any gain-related pedals unless they are super transparent, or radically different.

BTW, TopHat outsource their build. What you're actually getting is an amp built by Mojotone.
 
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Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

haha, you don't know the half of it. I'm screwed forever when it comes to amps. Hanging out every week in a room with Victorias, Swarts, Splawns, 65s, Matamps and assorted other high end gear has made it very difficult for me to enjoy a trip to the local chain store...

It's for that reason that our destiny is to someday own boutique amp/pedal stores!

I'd open it in Vegas next door to Ed Roman, since he doesn't sell amps! LOL
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

It's for that reason that our destiny is to someday own boutique amp/pedal stores!

I'd open it in Vegas next door to Ed Roman, since he doesn't sell amps! LOL

haha, if someone comes in asking for a guitar you could say "go see the Leprechaun. One door down..."
 
Re: Matchless and Bad Cat Amps Thread

Haha
Well I am spoiled as well...got myself a dude who had been building this stuff since the 60s......got a 15 watts AC-30 like amp, it build on a POS chassis...as it was just a reference amp for a project!
But the sound is way beyond most Vox amps I have tried...and that is quite a few:D
He also made this 50 watts EL-34 amp now....a mix of a Hiwatt and Marshall.....arrgh lol
And I also tried one of his DC coupled amps once.....gaargh...lol that thing was very carefully made....but the sound was so clear and fat at the same time...marvelous!
 
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