New A Cab Day!

[80's_Thrash_Metal]

I finally got the cab full of the speakers I wanted
Eminence: 2 Manowars and 2 Swamp Thangs.
They are very similarly voiced, dark, heavy, tight, punchy ... and this thing rocks very hard.

I sprayed the entire inside with black Flex-seal to see if it got tighter or just duller. So far I'm thinking tighter!

 

[80's_Thrash_Metal]

This may be a dumb question, but what does the Flex Seal do for the cabs? Like insulation? Does it tighten up the sound and projection?

I’ve owned a 4x12 before and am looking for one at the right price again, but have never heard of doing this.

I'm hoping it makes it tighter without ruining the woody resonance too much.
also it helps seal up any gaps inside there.

I got the idea from my 2x12 cabinets that were filled with some kind of synthetic gauze fabric almost.... they sound really good.

so far I'm very happy with it.

 

[beaubrummels]

I would agree to some extent that certain people don't "need" a 4x12 to gig with..... I've been to some gigs where they don't even use amplifiers.... and in fact at practice I use a 2x12. It's loud enough to keep up with the other guitarist, drummer, and bassist and PA with my vocals... and it's a lot smaller.

FWIW 4x12 aren't really about volume, it's about distance projection. It's basically a line array, just like a P.A. A 1x12 cabinet pushes 1 cubic foot of air out radially. The problem is the high end will dissipate and get absorbed within the first 5-6 feet in front of the cab, largely due to chairs, people, upholstery in the room. A 4x12 cabinet pushes a column air of 4 cubic feet thick, which means the treble frequencies will survive a longer distance so that the people in the back row hear the same sound the people in the front row did. People perceive it as loud just because they heard it clearly in the back, so they 'think' it must be cranked, but you could have it low enough to talk over it and everyone in the room would hear the same sound and could talk over it.

This may be a dumb question, but what does the Flex Seal do for the cabs? Like insulation? Does it tighten up the sound and projection?

I’ve owned a 4x12 before and am looking for one at the right price again, but have never heard of doing this.

On the interior, if it's an irregular surface, it would defeat reflections a very small amount. The bigger effect is sealing every gap where air could escape. By trapping the air inside the cabinet, it produces back pressure on the cone of the speaker, which shortens the settling time of the voice coil, which makes it tighter and able to reproduce more detail. You sacrifice a little low end, however.

 

[Demanic]

FWIW 4x12 aren't really about volume, it's about distance projection. It's basically a line array, just like a P.A. A 1x12 cabinet pushes 1 cubic foot of air out radially. The problem is the high end will dissipate and get absorbed within the first 5-6 feet in front of the cab, largely due to chairs, people, upholstery in the room. A 4x12 cabinet pushes a column air of 4 cubic feet thick, which means the treble frequencies will survive a longer distance so that the people in the back row hear the same sound the people in the front row did. People perceive it as loud just because they heard it clearly in the back, so they 'think' it must be cranked, but you could have it low enough to talk over it and everyone in the room would hear the same sound and could talk over it.



On the interior, if it's an irregular surface, it would defeat reflections a very small amount. The bigger effect is sealing every gap where air could escape. By trapping the air inside the cabinet, it produces back pressure on the cone of the speaker, which shortens the settling time of the voice coil, which makes it tighter and able to reproduce more detail. You sacrifice a little low end, however.

Aren't the air gaps sealed pretty well if you just torque the speaker tight to the baffle? I mean, the air that escapes would be at such a high frequency, and such a low level, as to be negligible.

 

[80's_Thrash_Metal]

So far this cabinet is everything I wanted it to be.
it is tight and nasty!

 

[Seashore]

So far this cabinet is everything I wanted it to be.
it is tight and nasty!

I like my cabinets like I like my women!








...that is to say, clear, crisp, and loud, with a supportive bottom end, covered in black tolex.

 

[beaubrummels]

Aren't the air gaps sealed pretty well if you just torque the speaker tight to the baffle? I mean, the air that escapes would be at such a high frequency, and such a low level, as to be negligible.

Yeah, speakers seat pretty well without needing to torque it down tight in all closed back cabs I have experience with. If it were a ported cab, that would change everything.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I was looking into caulking the inside of my Marshall cab at some point, but I've come to the realization part of the Marshall cab sound is they're so ratty and underbuilt, LOL. So I just forgot about it. My 1960A mics up beautifully. I've had like 504804804380 speakers in it as well, LOL. Stock T-75's, V30's, Relic 30's, Creamback H-75's, EVH's, and now a mix of Chinese and UK Greenbacks. I love Greenbacks, but I guess it's speakers were we both disagree, LOL.

I don't like Emis, but they sound good in your clip, tho!

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Personally I've never played a gig through anything but a 4x12 (or two). I'm sure a smaller cab would do the trick just fine mic'd up but who wants to play doom on stage through anything but a 4x12???

I'm happy with 1x12's/2x12's for noodling at home though..

The Emi's sound great!

 

[Demanic]

Yeah, speakers seat pretty well without needing to torque it down tight in all closed back cabs I have experience with. If it were a ported cab, that would change everything.

Wouldn't a ported cab require less torque? After all, it's bleeding bass frequencies out of the port instead of just trapping them in the box.

 

[NegativeEase]

Wouldn't a ported cab require less torque? After all, it's bleeding bass frequencies out of the port instead of just trapping them in the box.

Agree, I would expect the rigidity of the seating of speaker in a closed back is much more important

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Always wondered too if ports in the cab make much of a difference when close mic'ing a speaker or is it just an in-the-room thing?

 

[80's_Thrash_Metal]

In my experiences, open backed or ported cabinets just make the room more boomy.

It ​​​​​doesn't make a huge difference with a close mic. But I think a closed back can make the speaker a smidge tighter, if that's what you're looking for.

 

[Demanic]

Ported cabs are designed for a live setting to push as much bass as possible into a room.

Recording is best done micing an open back 1x12 cab. Closed if you want more mids.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Recording is best done micing an open back 1x12 cab. Closed if you want more mids.

Not really. If you like Heartwork, they gaffer-taped two 4x12's together for extra internal volume.

But it did work for Cantrel on Dirt.

I prefer Carcass by a long shot, tho.

 

[Aceman]

Played both cabs for the wife.
-Played the 1960 first.
-Then I played the MX212. She made a nasty face and said "That's harsh!"

Always good to get the understanding for the purchase. It's good when the wife gets it.:biglaugh:


So Impedence Gurus....I assume I can run one line out the 4ohm into the 1960 and another out the 8ohm in to the MX212.

And I'm thinking with the "harsh" label I will be getting some new speakers for the 212!

 

[beaubrummels]

Wouldn't a ported cab require less torque? After all, it's bleeding bass frequencies out of the port instead of just trapping them in the box.

I just meant that having it ported, because it would release air freely, tightening the speakers wouldn't really matter at all, other than avoiding rattling in the cabinet.

 

[Demanic]

If your speakers are loose enough to actually rattle the cages against the baffle, you have done something wrong. I suggest bolts into T-nuts with washer/locking washer and double nut on the end.

 

[beaubrummels]

If your speakers are loose enough to actually rattle the cages against the baffle, you have done something wrong. I suggest bolts into T-nuts with washer/locking washer and double nut on the end.

I've never had that problem. Only once, in 40+ years of playing, have I witnessed a cabinet rattling because of a loose speaker, and it wasn't mine.

 

[Demanic]

I've had to tighten the screws on the speakers in a few cabs over the years. Not by much, usually 1/4 of a turn. But in a low humidity environment the wood of the baffle can shrink just a bit over time.