No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

[mantis]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

mythbuster: is a $200 Fender pro Junior combo and a fuzz pedal gonna sound awesome recorded, live, and loud enough for drums??? YES, AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE AN AWESOME PA SYSTEM TO BE HEARD IN A SMALL CLUB

mythbuster: do people need expensive fancy modelers or guitar amps just to practice? NO. for recording??? NO, lots of modeler software is free, and the ability to mix is crucial to a good recorded sound.

:banana:

after I have made hundreds of recordings with analog modelers, digital modelers, a line 6 toneport, and a small tube amp, I conclude saying the tube amp sounded best

Let me help you out on your point , the tube amp sounds best to you. Some may prefer the sound of a modeler or even a straight up solid state amp. I know a few guitarist who don't like the feel of a tube amp. I think they have hearing issues but it's what they like and who are we to judge.

 

[dominus]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

Solid state amps don't sound like a tube amp.

You haven't tried an ISP Theta or a Blackstar ID series. The Peavey Transtubes come pretty close too.

They don't have the saturation ,

Are you referring to gain? A number of solid state amps wipe the floor with tube amps when it comes to gain.

 

[dominus]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

What is this? I never heard of it. Better is strong statement. If someone can Model a amp and make it sound even better then the original then why would anyone ever spend any money on the real thing? I wouldn't , I'm a tone chaser , not a pride of ownership. I'm never married to the name on the front of the amp , guitar or Effects for that matter , it's all about the end product.
Tell me more please.

That is Peavey's Revalver software.

 

[dominus]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

Let me help you out on your point , the tube amp sounds best to you. Some may prefer the sound of a modeler or even a straight up solid state amp. I know a few guitarist who don't like the feel of a tube amp. I think they have hearing issues but it's what they like and who are we to judge.

http://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/artist-interview/dino-cazares-of-divine-heresy/

"I used a Marshall® Valvestate 100 watt head going through a model 1960A cabinet with Celestion® Vintage 30s in it, and that was killer. For effects, I used a Digitech® Whammy, an old Ibanez® chorus, and I also used a Line 6® Pod Pro for a lot of my effects as well because it has a wide variety of effects that I really like. I used the Pod for all of the clean parts with effects. The dirty stuff was straight Marshall with the chorus and Whammy."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Schuldiner

"The amp he used towards the end of his career was a Marshall Valvestate (Model 8100) amp head and Valvestate 4x12 speaker cabinets on Individual Thought Patterns as well as the ITP tour, and eventually started using Marshall 1960 cabs. Before that he used various equipment including Randall RG100ES heads and Randall cabinets, and on the (In)Human Tour of the World he used a small GK 250ML miked up, despite having hollow 4x12 stacks 'for show'."

Bands like Suffocation, Cannibal Corpse, Misery Index, and Dying Fetus used the Ampeg VH140C / Crate GX130C

http://www.crateamps.com/artists/index.php?artID=4

Al Jourgensen and Tommy Victor (also of Prong) use Crate amps.

and of course, Dimebag used solid state Randalls for most of his career.

 

[El Dunco]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

Treating modellers as just another instrument and not as though they're trying to be something they're not and keeping that in mind when tweaking a sound, I don't think there exists a piece of equipment I can't get a useable and enjoyable tone out of.

I have the adequate space, microphones, living arrangements and training to get a great recorded sound from a cabinet and will always use that for a final product but being able to quickly get a useable sound for a demo is something I appreciate about modelling technology.

Another aspect is that you can get sounds and configurations from modelling technology that wouldn't logistically be feasible from an analogue setup which is great when you're going really experimental.

 

[Johnny the Kid]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

Excellent reply , thank you for that.
It's where I find Modeling useful especially for cover bands. You can get mad a tube purist feeling the way that they do but I have to agree with them as I have tried modeling many times and have not found one that sounds as good as the real thing. If you never played a true tube amp , you should. It's a sound like no other. Solid state amps don't sound like a tube amp. They don't have the saturation , the style of punch and tube break up. They don't have that creamy clear clean like a real Fender Twin Reverb. Honestly I never heard a better sounding clean amp then a Fender Twin Reverb.
I will say this about modeling , I have a blast when I'm playing around in my basement trying out all the different tones I can get out of all those different modeled amps. But at the end of the day it's not a tone I would write with. I always find a fuzz or digital fake sound I don't care for. I find this is a lot of stand alone pedals as well. I tried out the line 6 models and went back to Boss and MXR as I find them to sound more REAL for a lack of a better word.

I disagree. Coheed and Cambria use their Axe FX as preamps and use tube power amps in 4x12 for controlled feedback as well as tube saturation. They sound like they are playing 12 different amps that actually sound like the amps.

 

[everdrone]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

I know a few guitarist who don't like the feel of a tube amp. I think they have hearing issues but it's what they like and who are we to judge.

they are prolly into jazz or death metalz and don't listen to tube saturation much??? I am not sure if I will ever listen to much of the extreme metal anymore except for Meshuggah who does prefer axefxII (costs way more than tube amp! at $2600), and I think jazz can benefit from tube

 

[exnihilo]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

All i use is modeling. It's only a pod xt live, but i love the versatility. I don't know if I've posted that already - tapatalk doesn't show. Anyhow, yeah, i freaking love the thing. And creating your own sounds with the software is pretty righteous!

cg

 

[beaubrummels]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

I'm gigging this weekend using a Line6 Flextone III and I noticed something that I had forgotten before. It imitates the sound of my tube amps well enough, but it doesn't match the levels/dynamics in the same way. For example, with my Marshall, when I play chords and slip in some single notes in between, all of my playing punches through past live drums. But the other night using the Line6, single notes got buried against the drums, while full chords punched through just fine.

 

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

Get why the users like the digital stuff....got no use for it myself, but it is a tool....we all use different ways to get the desired result.

 

[MkIII Renegade]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

Nope.

And I don't like fake wood, or fake leather either. Or fake singers with autotune.

 

[Mincer]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

I dig it. But I also like non-wood guitars too.

 

[voggin]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

I only have a low-end modeller, a Fender Mustang III. I quite like it. I hadn't used it for a while, mainly practising on my old Pro Junior with an OD pedal. But the other day I was going to go over to a drummer's place and jam with some guys. I dreaded the thought of hauling my HR Deville all the way to his place for just a couple of hours of beer and messing around. So I thought I would give the Mustang another try. I never ended up going to the drummer's place, but it got me back into the MIII.

I find the high-gain stuff sort of "meh", but since I don't play that sort of music, it's no big deal (although the super sonic model is pretty good, by far the best higher gain model, probably due to Fender's proprietary thing.) But I am really loving the 65 Deluxe model. It is really close (so is the twin model and the bassman) to that great fender amp sound, which you can tell I'm into given my two tube combos. I've been using the Deluxe model almost exclusively lately. It is really, really close to the sound of a tube amp, and when you are just plugging in for twenty minutes or so, it's a lot handier than a tube amp.

What it seems to do best is be at that Fender sweet spot of just about to gain, where you can pick lightly and stay clean but get dirt with some attack. I think if I were a gigging musician (which I'm not, so take my opinion with a grain of salt) I'd be sorely tempted to use the Mustang III combo (it's 100 watts) for bars. It works well with my pedals, too. And it responds well to volume and tone controls on the guitar (you can set a nice drive at 10, clean at 6 balance on my gibson-style guitars.)

Don't know where I'm going with this, other than to say my $300 modelling amp is pretty good. I can only imagine the higher end stuff like AXE must be very good. I'd like to see Fender make a mustang amp, but a little heavier-duty (the jacks, etc. are pretty flimsy). That would be pretty cool for open mike, small club things. I'd love to get a real deluxe RI, but I don't think I'd want it around a bunch of thieving, stumbling drunks!

 

[75lespaul]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

I use a Vox Valvetronix Tonelab LE through a 1971 Univox 60 watt head and Earcandy Buzzbomb 2X12 and I love it. Granted, I may be "cheating" by using a modeler through an honest to goodness tube amp, but I love the sound. Very tuby. Still not the equivalent of playing purely tube, but once it is in a band setting, only a trained ear could tell...and maybe not even then? Keep in mind, I play rock and hard rock/metal, so the modeler through the tube amp gets a fantastic tone. Always get compliments on my tone, which is a direct connection to this forum. Thank you bros.

 

[Wattage]

Re: No love for modeling 'round here, uh?

I have a Line 6 DT25 head w/cab and an HD500. They don't get tons of use right now but I like them a whole lot and my Vetta combo was a fantastic rig.