Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

T

Teleplayer

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Which one will be hotter and fatter sounding out of the TB-APH-1 Trembucker, and the Pearly gates Trembucker?

In the old SD tone chart that I downloaded about 5 years ago, it used to say the Pearly Gates bridge humbucker had a hotter wind and lower resonant frequency, compared to the APH-1 bridge humbucker.
Now the figures seem to have been changed and resonant frequencies are no longer specified.

According to the product pages, both of the Trembucker pickups have the same 8.8k resistance.
http://www.seymourduncan.com/pickup/pearly-gates-trembucker
http://www.seymourduncan.com/pickup/alnico-ii-pro-trembucker

I wonder if they are really the same resistance or if it may be a mistake on the web page.
I am actually looking at the Trembucker pickup, rather than a standard spaced one.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

When I last looked at the Duncan site, the APH bridge was 7.9k and the PG was 8.35.....non TB.
But as a comparison the T spaced version of the 490 is about .1 to .2K more than the non T spaced.
 
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Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

According to my ears, the PGb has more drive and pushes my amp harder than the APH-1b.

But neither is a hot, overwound, molten metal pickup.

The PGb is a fabulous blues and rock pickup though.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

If the APH uses a different wire gauge then talking about DCR is completely pointless!
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

They're both 42 ? PG has somewhat greater DCR... Per an old post you can search for, the PG has greater millivolt output as well. I haven't played either pickup at length, but signs point to the AP2 having lower output.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

If you don't mind, how do you actually know the APH is 42AWG?

Without even going into the method of measuring (yes, I've seen the data and read the discussion) I could riff on mV not being a decisive indicator of loudness, too (and it isn't!), but that would be going to far off-topic.
 
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Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

Neither in any way your ear will be able to tell or that a screw driver can't change.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

Forum search, which is why I placed the question mark after that statement as it is uncorroborated by anything official. In any case, if you google something like "Duncan Mv Values" there's a post that does indicate 499 vs. 543 (non-TB) millivolt output in favor of the PG, which seems to align with the DCR difference if they are both the same wire gauge.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

Did you happen to see any information about how full the bobbins of each pickup are?
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

i have both pups and they are both #42, pg is pe the aph is maybe poly but kinda looks like formvar color? different insulation for sure. the pg is more upper mid focused so might push an amp a bit more
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

How do you know for certain the APH is 42AWG and not 0.060 mm?
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

youre just being difficult. i dont think its a secret that the aph/jazz is #42. i didnt scour the shelves last time i was at the factory but i didnt notice anything that said .060mm. i did see a wide variety of #42, #43, #44 spools along with some others but nothing listed in mm
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

Nonsense.

I'm asking for reasons/evidence to believe something being stated as a fact and I get "youre just being difficult"?!?
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

Its odd that people claim the APH-1 Bridge humbucker has 7.9k winding. The website product page claims its 8.4k.

A similar thing applies the SH-2 Jazz bridge. The old tone chart specifies 7.9k, but the website now claims its 8.4k like the APH-1.

A change in the wire spec could explain a lot.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

I'm pretty sure the pickups are wound based on the number of turns. Depending on the batch of wire and temperature at the time of measurement you can get a range of measured resistances. Whether the ohm meter is calibrated can make a difference. I also wonder whether people are measuring the resistance of their pickups with the volume control attached, which will lower the measurement.

I'll have to dig up a link, but I'm certain it has been officially confirmed that the APH and Jazz use the same wind (at least the neck model). I'm also fairly certain that it has not been officially confirmed that they use 42AWG, despite all the posts claiming this is the case. The APH/Jazz are not described as PAF-style, but I think one can only infer that this means they don't use plain enamel 42AWG. They could still use 42AWG or the wire could still be plain enamel, but probably not both.
 
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Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

gregory said:
I'm pretty sure the pickups are wound based on the number of turns. Depending on the batch of wire and temperature at the time of measurement you can get a range of measured resistances. Whether the ohm meter is calibrated can make a difference. I also wonder whether people are measuring the resistance of their pickups with the volume control attached, which will lower the measurement.
Click to expand...

As far as manufacturer's specification goes, I'd expect them to be consistent in the way they are measured, eg. measured at controlled temperature, based on averaged measurements.
I am not expecting every item from the production to be close to the spec. Obviously there will be a lot of variation.
I am a bit perplexed whem people claim the Pearly Gates is hotter wind, but the website shows the APH-1 as having a higher DC resistance. (listed at 8.4k).
However the Trembucker version apparently has an identical spec between the two products.

Can we really assume the tone chart that is so many years out of date may be more accurate than the website?
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

The information on the product pages have a lot to be desired. FWIW, I recently bought a pickup based on the BMT figures and found them to be quite misleading.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

Thanks for the replies. I think I can see a Pearly Gates pickup in my future.

I may get the humbucker version for my Strat. The string spacing over the pickup is borderline 50.5mm.
Normally I'd buy F-spaced or Trembucker by default, but in this case I'd prefer not to modify the pickguard to make it fit.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

I think the PG sounds hotter to my ears in real world use, as it has more highs, and the perception I have is the clarity = volume, even if that isn't the scientific case. I hear it as louder, though. But I like the tone of the APH-1 better.
 
Re: Pearly Gates Trembucker vs TB-APH-1, which is hotter?

I hope I am not giving the impression that I think the APH is louder than the PG. I have no personal experience. I simply wouldn't use the "higher DCR means more output" argument to make the case, especially with no definitive information about the wire used to make the APH.

If I were to look at the numbers, I'd look at the resonant peak, the Q, consider whether it is in the wheelhouse of the A2 as well as the rig being played though and where that falls on an equal loudness contour.
 
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