Pickup to compliment JB in neck

[Inflames626]

Hi all,
This is my first post here in the pickup forum in several years. I hope everyone is doing well.

Some years back I was complaining about things I dislike about the JB--until I tried it in the neck with the screws facing the headstock.

It became amazingly versatile then. To my ears, it had the warmth and responsiveness of an Alnico II ("woo woo" type bends). It had an awesome split coil tone that cleaned up nicely for such a hot, warm, bassy sounding pickup. And it sounded great for hot Dave Murray style soloing tones from the neck position--something I don't normally do (I prefer ceramics from the bridge and save the neck for cleans).

I would love to build a new guitar around a JB in the neck but I'm not sure about what I should use in the bridge. I am using import Japanese Jacksons retrofitted with OFRs and Schallers, mostly, with 32mm blocks. Typical mass produced lightweight alder/poplar/basswood/maple/rosewood stuff.

Of all the SD pickups I have tried, I prefer the Full Shreds most, as I prefer a balanced to somewhat bright and articulate pickup with a tight bass response and mid output--12-13k is my sweet spot. Alternative 8s were too scratchy. Distortions are more my flavor but can cause ear fatigue in the highs. I save those for tracking solos mostly and not rhythms.

The JB, Dimebucker, Distortion, and Alternative 8 are all a bit too hot for my tastes in the bridge. I can make up any gain I need in plugins (usually JCM800 boosted by a Tubescreamer with Dual Recs and 5150s mixed in to taste). I find it is much easier to boost a vintage pickup than to clean up a hot pickup.

Of non-Duncan pickups I have tried, my favorite is the Gibson 498t in the bridge. I like the Classic 57+ in the neck to balance that out.

Of course, I am loaded with 18 volt EMG 81s and Blackout AHB1s/AHB3s in my lower tuned guitars. They are my bread and butter. But this JB build is more for more complex, standard tuned passive tones.

Even though I think the Dimebucker is a bit too hot, I am leaning toward a JB/Dimebucker build, as the Dimebucker seems really bright and trebly and would offset the warm JB well. It also seems to be high enough in output to match the JB based on the DCR.

A few concerns:
I would prefer to stay with SDs. I am largely ignorant of DiMarzios, Lace, etc. I think trying one of them would send me down a rabbit hole of more tone chasing. Also I would be concerned about pickup phase and polarity issues, etc.

I would like to stay away from splitting up SD sets--as in JB/Black Winter bridge. I would prefer to keep pickups that are designed for each other together.

I have tried Invaders and generally hate them because I find them too dark and muddy. I also do not want to split up an Invader set.

I love the low end of a Screamin' Demon but find it too clean and underwound in other respects. I think a JB in the neck would overpower a Demon in the bridge.

It is my understanding that the Dimebucker is in some ways a more powerful branch of the 59/Custom 5/Custom family. I really like a Custom 5 in the bridge for a thumpy scooped mid guitar. I have not tried the Custom, but I imagine it sounds just as good with more mids and top end than the Custom 5. I have considered a JB/Custom, but I am concerned the JB will be too hot for the Custom.

I am considering trying my Distortion neck pickup in the bridge but I am concerned the JB will be too hot for it.

I tend to stay away from Alnico II pickups in the bridge for metal because I find the bottom end too loose and spongy. It's not a bad sound but just too colorful for this application, in my opinion.

I find the 59s to be rather bland and, again, too low output to match the JB.

This pretty much leaves the Parallel Axis family. I am thinking one of the Parallel Axis pickups might be a good idea. They are supposed to be very articulate and high output. A bright sound from the bridge with a warm JB tone from the neck would make the guitar really versatile IMO.

I would appreciate any thoughts. Sorry about the length. I wanted everyone to have the most information to work with in giving their advice.

Aaron

 

[Hsb]

Are you wanting a more classic or modern feel from the bridge?

What about a Black Winter? The name doesnt do it justice, much more versatile than the mame lends. Kind of a modern take on the Distortion.

 

[gsammo79]

A Super Distortion bridge came to mind first. The AT-1 is another Dimarzio option to look at.

The Custom wont be a a bad mismatch with the JB neck imo. That would be the first Duncan I'd recommend in this case.

 

[Inflames626]

Thanks Hsb!

Please see above where I said I don't want to split up any calibrated sets of pickups. The rationale here is I may want to use the BW neck pickup in something and it will be hard to justify that if the BW bridge is used with something else (in this case the JB/BW bridge). I want to avoid buying any certain model of pickup more than once unless I really love it. To date I have only done this with EMGs and Blackouts.

Edit: Also, what do you mean by classic and modern?

For classic I assume we would be leaning toward a Distortion. For a modern, "hi fi" tone I'm guessing a Parallel Axis?

 

[Hsb]

The BW doesnt have to purchased as a set. I get if you bought a set not breaking them up, bit if you dont have the set, just purchase a bridge.

Im about to order a BW neck to pair w a Distortion, once I fins oht total cost on some other repairs I have that particular guitar in for

 

[Inflames626]

gsammo79: Thanks to you as well. I am considering saving my Custom/Custom 5 for an Alnico Pro II in the neck. I don't go with the Slash versions because I don't think they split.

 

[NYCTone]

You want something to balance a JB in the neck but don't want something too hot? That's inherently contradictory unfortunately.

 

[Inflames626]

Hsb: I understand what you mean now. I just want to avoid buying the same pickup twice. If it works, great, but I like to try as many models as possible. I would prefer matched sets to stay together so that I have more of a reason to take a chance on single pickups like the Jason Beckers and Parallel Axis.

 

[Inflames626]

NYCTone: I hear you there. Maybe lowering the pickup as far into the body as possible will help.

 

[Mincer]

If you are going to boost the signal later, I'd recommend a 59 & 59/Custom Hybrid. You don't get the signal compression of the higher output pickups, so you get more dynamics.

 

[Inflames626]

Thanks Mincer!

 

[Ascension]

Easy Alt 8. Tighter brighter and hotter than a JB and many including myself think of the Alt8 as the JB on steroids. Would be a solid match IMO for a JB in the neck much more so that a Hybrid. Have both in guitars like the Hybrid but it wont be a match fro a JB in the neck IMO in tone or output the Alt will.

 

[Ascension]

Thanks Hsb!

Edit: Also, what do you mean by classic and modern?

For classic I assume we would be leaning toward a Distortion. For a modern, "hi fi" tone I'm guessing a Parallel Axis?

What you are describing here is spot on the Alt 8. Very clear and articulate pickup but not overly compressed even though it has serious output. The Alt 8 I vastly prefer to a JB is almost any guitar. In most guitars I find the JB to be overly compressed and sterile sounding. The exception is in a bolt on neck 25.5 scale Superstrat. Have a JB in 2 of my mid 90's Washburn USA MG's and they both kill!

 

[Inflames626]

If you are going to boost the signal later, I'd recommend a 59 & 59/Custom Hybrid. You don't get the signal compression of the higher output pickups, so you get more dynamics.

Mincer, do you think it would be worth it to try a 59 bridge in the neck with a 59/Custom?

I admit trying the 59 neck and not being that impressed with it. I was used to the Jazz and EMG 60 and was expecting the 59 to sound more like an Alnico II. In the end the 59 neck was neither bright enough for me to prefer it over a Jazz/60 nor was it expressive enough for me to prefer it to an Alnico II pickup.

I thought maybe trying the bridge pickup in that position might make it come alive. I know trying a bridge pickup in the neck did it for me with the Classic 57+.

 

[Mincer]

Mincer, do you think it would be worth it to try a 59 bridge in the neck with a 59/Custom?

I admit trying the 59 neck and not being that impressed with it. I was used to the Jazz and EMG 60 and was expecting the 59 to sound more like an Alnico II. In the end the 59 neck was neither bright enough for me to prefer it over a Jazz/60 nor was it expressive enough for me to prefer it to an Alnico II pickup.

I thought maybe trying the bridge pickup in that position might make it come alive. I know trying a bridge pickup in the neck did it for me with the Classic 57+.

Yeah, a 59b in the neck would be a good match, too, in tone and volume balance. But it really depends on your definition of 'coming alive' is.

 

[Inflames626]

Thanks for your help, everyone. I'll get back to this thread once I've experimented and figured out what works for me.

Hopefully my experience will help everyone else in return.

I got the JB "for free" somewhat as it came stock with a Jackson DK2S. I replaced the JB with a Distortion (the neck was a Sustainiac). I had much better results with the Distortion for that guitar and the role that I use it for (tracking solos).

Although I'm not a huge JB fan I hate to part with it as I think it would work well in the right guitar/position.

I'm not sure I could get a good trade or sale for it, either. They are so common on the used market I'm sure most people have 4 or 5 of them in a drawer somewhere.

 

[AdrianSD]

Inflames626 if you have another spare JB around throw an A8 magnet in it and install it in the bridge. More balls and less wah than with the A5, tighter low end, yet it still preserves its unique character, still sounds like a JB.

 

[playas]

If you want a similarly whacky option, why not try a Sentient neck in the bridge?

But as I haven't a notion what that would sound like etc. I will say that I think a PATB-3B is great for Maiden, so maybe it would be a cool match.

To me it sounds pretty scooped, with really balanced and accented treble and bass without sounding at all harsh/icepicky highs nor thumpy bass.

I had mine in an Alder Strat copy.
I took it out as I like more mids, but if I wanted a guitar for Maiden covers for example, I wouldn't think twice.

I think it's the only scooped bridge humbucker I've liked.

 

[Benjy_26]

One option would be to get a pickup you like the voicing of and then use an EMG PA2 boost to set the level and shove the assembly in the control cavity. Set in and forget it.

 

[Inflames626]

AdrianSD , I did read up a lot on Alnico 8's on the forums before the Alternative 8 was available but I was afraid to disassemble a humbucker on my own because I thought I would damage it.

When the Alt 8 came out I was very excited. I tried the Alternative 8 and found in my opinion that it had all the drawbacks of a ceramic and an A5 without really adding any benefit.

Mainly I found the Alt 8 to sound too "hairy" or gainy, even with the pickup backed into the cavity. I felt that a less wound ceramic would sound clearer for solos and a less wound Alnico 5 would cause less ear fatigue for rhythms.

We all have that sweet spot on our amps--usually around 6 or 7--beyond which we think the gain is too much. For me, the Alt 8 was like that. Or maybe like a solid state Marshall MG with the gain maxed out.

The best of all worlds I have found thus far is a Gibson 498t, which I assume sounds close to a Duncan Custom. It could be a little more defined in the highs for solos, but unlike the Distortion it does not cause ear fatigue in the highs. For a live situation with both lead and rhythm playing I would use the 498t.

playas , lots of great points. Gracias. I thought about trying at least a Pegasus with a JB in the neck but again I was concerned about an output mismatch. Nazgul seems like a djent version of a Distortion.

When the Nazgul/Sentient/Pegasus were launched, I admit being a little put off by how they were marketed. I felt they were meant for 7 and 8 string djent players, which isn't really me (I love Gothenburg Swedish death metal as you can probably tell by my name). Maybe I should give them a try.

I really want to try one of the Parallel Axis in a black Jackson RR with a metal pickguard. I think they would look cool. If you like a PATB for Maiden I'm sure I will like it as I love the sound. I love Maiden and the Swedish death metal bands aren't really that different from Maiden aside from tuning down and playing faster.

I like scooped mids if the song calls for scooped mids. When I first tried the Custom 5 the first thing I thought is "This is the Metallica 'Sad But True' pickup.'" Truly, no mids. And it is great for chuggy songs like that but I would hate using it in a mix with something on bass like an SPB3 which also lacks mids.

So I keep my Custom 5 for something I haven't decided on yet.

I may just keep the JB in the neck and not care what is in the bridge since I mainly record and the pickups don't have to be balanced. Mincer suggested something less hot and compressed in the neck but I admit I really enjoy how the JB just seems to push everything really hard in the neck.

Benjy_26 , thanks. I haven't thought of that. I think SD has a similar option to boost passive pickups to sound more like Blackouts. I'll have to experiment.