Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

[NullPointer]

Hello,

Sorry for the long post. I'll put a TLDR at the bottom.

I'm thinking of having a custom Strat made from Warmoth parts (assembled locally by a professional, not by me, because as you will learn, I am clueless), mostly because I have fairly small hands and they offer a 24.74" scale neck for Strats. I can also pick a slimmer neck profile while I'm at it, so just all around a way more comfortable neck for me. The rest would just be boring old standard Fender; solid alder body, maple neck, etc.

I play mostly "pop" punk (Alkaline Trio, Green Day, Blink-182, etc., perhaps with an emphasis on Blink right now), and while I realize "just use any guitar with any pickups and any amp" is a common response to pop punk/punk requests (not necessarily here, I've just noticed it all over the place when Googling for answers), I'm afraid I'm going to need something more specific. I've only been playing casually for a few years and have only been looking into hardware specifics for a few weeks, so I apologize if I sound like an alien trying to blend in with humans at a party using words and phrases incorrectly.

I currently have a Les Paul 60s Tribute with P-90s, an Orange Dual Terror head, and an Orange PPC 212 cabinet. I couldn't really explain how I arrived at this set up; I suppose I just picked kind of randomly for the most part. I play alone in my bedroom for fun and don't really have any ambition to go any further, though that doesn't mean I have no want for quality equipment.

I don't have the experience nor the tonal vocabulary to explain what I don't like about the sounds I'm currently getting (muddy? dark?), so I'd rather just start from scratch with a new guitar, recommended from the start for the sound I'm looking for given my amp. I'm going for a custom build because I'd be replacing the neck and pickups anyway, so unless I can find a brand new American Standard Strat for the price of a Warmoth body plus hardware and labor, it seems more cost effective to do it this way. I'd also just be interested in the experience and the novelty.

Initially, I was under the impression that an Invader in the bridge was just the obvious choice. The Tom Delonge Strat comes with one and it's easy to find legions of people recommending it specifically for punk. After doing a bit more research, however, it's easy to find even more people recommending against it, or at least cautioning that you really need to take your amp into account when considering an Invader. I've also read that Tom never used it in any recordings, which removes a bit of the pedigree as well.

So that's where I am now. I'm not even sure if I should go HSH, HSS, HH or HS, and which pickups to use in each. It seems like a humbucker in the bridge is really the only common recommendation I've seen. I don't mind buying more pickups than I'd realistically be using right now to round out my tonal options for the future, so advice on both/all of the pickups would be welcome.

I'm also not opposed to moving towards a more "punk friendly" head/cabinet if the one I stumbled into isn't ideal for the genre, though that is a more difficult purchase because I don't have the room, so I'd have to sell mine and buy the new ones concurrently. I'd prefer to not have to do this, though, so hopefully I didn't pick the literal worst brand for the kind of music I like.

TLDR: For pop punk/punk, which two or three pickups would be best in a Strat given an Orange Dual Terror head, an Orange PPC212 cab, and given that the Strat would have a custom 24.75" scale neck (if that even affects anything)?

Thanks!

 

[HKZSquared]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

I loved a JB for punk stuff, also enjoyed the invader, and even the Dimarzio D-Activator bridge. I got some punk out of a Screamin' Demon but wouldn't completely reccomend it. I'd say that the JB and Invader should be your first choices, (and I personally think you should start with the JB). Good luck!

 

[TheRip]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

I cant really recommend anything particular with amps, but what i know is that a HSH strat with the option to split the humbuckers is the best bet for punky stuff, since you can get pretty decent clean tones from a splitted humbucker and you dont really need that special single coil only sound when playing punk. anyways, you still got the middle single coil for that, but the outer two humbuckers give you the "umpf" needed for heavy distorted playing.
I personally have my strat upgraded to a HSH and the bridge humbucker angled like billie joe's green strat, just to be a bit more "punk" (take into account, you need the pool routing for that...)
Pickup-wise i'm running a Dirmarzio CrunchLab in the bridge, which i find the best pickup i've had yet, it has great clarity and has a ton of output, and on top of it, a pretty sweet clean sound, even splittet. (Neck still isnt upgraded from a cheap noname humbucker my dad had laying around, though will probably become a LiquiFire)
Going HSS is also a good option, but go for a noiseless neck pup, or else your solos will hum with the usual gain you have in pop punk tones...
If you want to go budget, a splittable HH configuration would also do the trick, though i still play the middle single coil for clean stuff and would miss it.
From the Invader I've mostly heard that it is too hot and muddy, but havent palyed it yet.

Also, since you're ordering directly from warmoth, think about getting a hard tail strat, they usually have longer sustain, and my tremolo is blocked of anyways on my "gain-strat"...and they are cheaper -> i think tremolo is a feature you dont really need in pop punk.

Another tip that is considered obvious but may not occur to yu since you're new to custom builds: depending on hardttail or tremolo, check for the string spacing and buy the adaquate version of the bridge pickup, trem spacing or regular spacing. if you want to have an angled humbucker like billie joe does, you need a gibson(aka standard) spaced HB, afaik trem spaced HBs werent so available back in the days, so people put them in angled to make up for the wider string spacing of a strat.

well, long post, long answer, hope that helped a bit!

 

[allbutromeo]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

I play a lot of similar stuff. I've used Screamin Demons, 59b, Invader (in a DeLonge strat), and various stock Gibson and Fender pickups. A good "hot" PAF type or something like a 59/custom hybrid works best because you can cover a lot of ground and make up the difference with minor amp setting tweaks. As far as neck, SH1n

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

Heres the thing dude... your asking us to tell you what guitar,amp and pickups to buy from ground up. Thats a sure fire recipe for failure. What works for me MIGHT work for you. Probably not. You can take reccomendations as advisment but at the end of the day you gotta find if it works for you. I can tell you this though... I can punk all day long with the gear you have now. I played punk for years (not so much pop punk but skate or hardcore) using a old P90 pickup SG special. It had 2 pickups but the neck one was broke so never used it. 90% of punk is played on the bridge pickup the rest can be played there, you definitely dont need HSH or anything fancy.

Without knowing why the gear you got now isnt working for you your really just grasping at straws hoping for a better outcome when you start from the ground up. You REALLY NEED to be able to say what about the gear you got now isnt working for you.

The warmoth strat wont really save you any money in the end. Particularly if you wind up having to pay someone to finish or set the guitar up. If you want a project for the sake of having a project thats cool. If your hoping it will solve your tone issues its another shot in the dark. Better to buy an instrument that is completed that you know the sound and feel of before hand than to put one together and hope that you like it.

 

[PushedCrayon]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

Using a Gibson style guitar, I'd move away from the invader, it tends to lose itself quite a bit in thicker guitars. I've got one of the tom delonge signature strats and it's my number one guitar. But the amp does play a big role with the invader. For the strat you're wanting to make, I'd shoot for something like a jb. I've used one for a long time and it covers more "punk" ground than the invader. It has more of a tonal range in my opinion, at least for this type of music. You could also look into the Gibson dirty fingers. That's what tom is using now, and I've got one as well. It's not as hot as the invader, but it's got a great crunch sound too it. Good luck with your hunt!

 

[Snake Aces]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

When I used to play punk I found the amp gain to be the most important factor. I prefer using humbuckers for punk because of the warmth they bring to the table. However, I like those humbuckers to be paired with something like a Marshall or Mesa tube amp. You need gain and articulation for a great punk tone IMHO. This is something EL84 tubes can really do well. I have played some punk on 6L6 tubes as well, it can be done on the right amp for example a Traynor YCV40 has a gain channel plus a gain boost channel. When you hit the boost you get a real nice gain for punk using single coils or humbuckers, however, I still prefer the extra "oompf" a humbucker brings to the table.

I am old school though, I like to get a low output humbucker (jazz, alnico II pro, 59, etc.) and let the amp do all the work.

 

[Snake Aces]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

90% of punk is played on the bridge pickup

This is punk gospel.

 

[Kac]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

Well you'll get a hundred different reccomendations. So listen to some sound clips and try out some different stuff if you can. In my Strats for punk/pop-punk I like the JB Jr. or the SSL-5. Good Luck!

 

[elelpe]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

I'd go with one pickup in the bridge only, P-Rails hot wired for four sounds: P-90, Rails, HB in parallel, HB in series.

 

[NullPointer]

Re: Punk/Pop-punk Pickups for Strat + Orange Dual Terror

Also, since you're ordering directly from warmoth, think about getting a hard tail strat, they usually have longer sustain, and my tremolo is blocked of anyways on my "gain-strat"...and they are cheaper -> i think tremolo is a feature you dont really need in pop punk.

Another tip that is considered obvious but may not occur to yu since you're new to custom builds: depending on hardttail or tremolo, check for the string spacing and buy the adaquate version of the bridge pickup, trem spacing or regular spacing. if you want to have an angled humbucker like billie joe does, you need a gibson(aka standard) spaced HB, afaik trem spaced HBs werent so available back in the days, so people put them in angled to make up for the wider string spacing of a strat.

well, long post, long answer, hope that helped a bit!

String spacing was already on my radar as something to look out for, though it still is a bit confusing. Warmoth lists a Fender American Standard Flat Mount and a Narrow Strat Flat Mount option, citing that the Narrow option has "string spacing that matches humbucker pole spacing." However, the Standard Flat Mount is 52mm whereas the Narrow is 54mm. I suppose I would need a trembucker with either of these. This is all something I was going to square away with the luthier, but it's nice to learn it on my own.

Heres the thing dude... your asking us to tell you what guitar,amp and pickups to buy from ground up. Thats a sure fire recipe for failure. What works for me MIGHT work for you. Probably not. You can take reccomendations as advisment but at the end of the day you gotta find if it works for you. I can tell you this though... I can punk all day long with the gear you have now. I played punk for years (not so much pop punk but skate or hardcore) using a old P90 pickup SG special. It had 2 pickups but the neck one was broke so never used it. 90% of punk is played on the bridge pickup the rest can be played there, you definitely dont need HSH or anything fancy.

Without knowing why the gear you got now isnt working for you your really just grasping at straws hoping for a better outcome when you start from the ground up. You REALLY NEED to be able to say what about the gear you got now isnt working for you.

The warmoth strat wont really save you any money in the end. Particularly if you wind up having to pay someone to finish or set the guitar up. If you want a project for the sake of having a project thats cool. If your hoping it will solve your tone issues its another shot in the dark. Better to buy an instrument that is completed that you know the sound and feel of before hand than to put one together and hope that you like it.

Yeah, this is definitely a project for the sake of having a project. I think I'm pretty much open to anything; I don't really have much of a tonal preference yet, so I feel confident that what's "conventionally" good/popular will be good for me.

I don't mind if I end up having to pay more with the custom built route, but I was just curious about any expenses I might not be taking into account. From Warmoth, it would be about $400 for the finished body and $350 for the finished neck. Using Warmoth prices for the hardware, it would be $50 for the bridge, about $30 for the knobs, switches, plates, screws, etc., $25 for the pickguard, $60 for the tuners. $80 per pickup, so we'll say $160 if I go HH. Luthier's in my area charge $225+ for custom builds, so let's say $300. That's $1375, so we'll round up to $1450 or even $1500 to cover my bases.

The cheapest I can find for a new American Strat is $1250 (perhaps I should have said that I don't like buying used things, so I'd have to be buying new, and I prefer to buy American). I'd still need to buy the custom neck and the pickups, and have all the work done ($350, $160, and $60, respectively), which is already up to $1820.

I hope this didn't sound too defensive. I really would be eager to learn potential financial pitfalls I'm not taking into account.

Anyway, thanks for all the advice everyone. I think right now I'm leaning towards a JB in the bridge based on the audio samples on this website, YouTube videos, and the testimonials of people here and on other forums.