Question: Number of tubes & power output...

fingerace

New member
For some reason that I don't understand (yet) the Fender deluxe reverb has 5 pre amp tubes and 2 power amp tubes and has an output of 22 watts.

The blues deluxe (and other similar amps) have 2 pre amp tubes and 2 power tubes. Yet they have an output of 40 watts.

The only difference I can spot is that the power tubes are 6V6 in the reverb delux and 6L6 in the blues deluxe... Is that the answer to the difference?

I am sure that this has been asked before by some other learing guitarist.

Does it mean that the tubes in the blues deluxe are pushed more, therefor having a better sound? Or does it mean that the many tubes in the reverb deluxe make it sound richer it tone??

Thanks for helping.
Andreas
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

For some reason that I don't understand (yet) the Fender deluxe reverb has 5 pre amp tubes and 2 power amp tubes and has an output of 22 watts.

The blues deluxe (and other similar amps) have 2 pre amp tubes and 2 power tubes. Yet they have an output of 40 watts.

The only difference I can spot is that the power tubes are 6V6 in the reverb delux and 6L6 in the blues deluxe... Is that the answer to the difference?

I am sure that this has been asked before by some other learing guitarist.

Does it mean that the tubes in the blues deluxe are pushed more, therefor having a better sound? Or does it mean that the many tubes in the reverb deluxe make it sound richer it tone??

Thanks for helping.
Andreas

6V6 10-12 watts output

6L6 20 -25 watts output

AFAIK the # of preamp tubes have very little effect of overall output.
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

6V6 10-12 watts output

6L6 20 -25 watts output

AFAIK the # of preamp tubes have very little effect of overall output.

Thanks!! that cleared it up.

Now, what would be better tone-wise, having (more) tubes which have lower output, or having only a few that have higher output?
Just curious...
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

LP in a clean fender amp kind of tone... rich and full, yet clear...

And classic overdriven tones, not too much gain. about... early AC/DC kind...

but the clean tone is my favourite...
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

I would suggest a 30 - 50 watt amp...any smaller and you will sacrifice clean tone. Play as many amps as you can, they all react and sound differently.

Also, do a google search on output tubes and read everything you can.
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

Dirfferent tubes have differnt usages. Tubes from different manufacturers can sound slightly different.

Preamp tubes are the small tubes. They take the millivolt output of the guitar's signal and amplify it to about the level of 1 volt. The 12A?7 tubes AU7, AT7, AY7, AX7 have different gain factors: a 12AU7, IIRC, has a gain factor of 20, while the commonly used 12AX7 has a gain factor of 100. Each of these tubes has two sections--two tubes in one.

Power tubes are the big bottles in your amp that do all the work, taking that 1 volt signal and making it become roughly 30 volts. EL34s are common in European amps, while the 6L6 and 6V6 types were the choice of many American companies. Another favorite of both sides of the Atlantic is the EL84. All of these tubes have different outputs, different operating parameters, and different tones and characteristics.

In many modern amps like Mesa Boogies and the Marshall TSL 2000, the preamp tube circuits are overdriven to produce a distorted sound. Back in the early days of tube guitar amps, there were no "master volume" circuits or "cascading preamps". In fact engineers worked very diligently to AVOID distortion. Tubes aren't the only part of the equation, though--the engineer has to make choices in his circuit design to best accomplish his goal.

When an amp is driven hard into distortion, lots of things start happening in that circuit. Single coil pickups, typically don't have the high output of a humbucker, so while the SC guitars stays cleaner at high volume, the HB guitar can overload the first input stages of the amp causing the tube to distort. The same thing happens to the amps power tubes, as voltages swing, the amp takes on a lively three-dimensional feel--if the engineer has done his job well with the rest of circuit. Some we like, some we don't. Some distortion is pleasing, often times it isn't.

Some of us become technical geeks, but try to remember that the technical specifications don't tell the real story about any musical instrument. Concentrate on the sound, the feel, the quality.

Does it meet your needs? Does it play with enough clean volume and headroom? Is the distortion pleasing?

And then you have to deal with the more mundane things, like how am I gonna pay for this? Can I read the knobs? Can I lift it? Will it fit in my car? Will my mom and dad kill me when they find out I took money out of my college fund to buy a guitar amp?

As you read more and more, the technical understanding will come, even though at times, it may seem like magic. Remember though, the real magic comes from the process of transforming your creativity and communicating your musical ideas to your audience. The guitar and the amp are just tools to accomplish that goal.

Bill
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

6V6 10-12 watts output

6L6 20 -25 watts output

roughly the output for PP cathode bias class AB1,
in PP fixed bias class AB1 about double that...
but in class B, a 6L6GC can put out 120 watts...
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

roughly the output for PP cathode bias class AB1,
in PP fixed bias class AB1 about double that...
but in class B, a 6L6GC can put out 120 watts...

I'm no expert when it comes to tubes and amps....most of the amps I've played ran 40-50 watts with 2 6L6's and around 20 watts with 2 6V6's. :)
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

You should also take into consideration that preamp tubes are often used for stuff like reverb...
 
Re: Question: Number of tubes & power output...

a 12AU7, IIRC, has a gain factor of 20, while the commonly used 12AX7 has a gain factor of 100. Each of these tubes has two sections--two tubes in one.


As you read more and more, the technical understanding will come, even though at times, it may seem like magic. Remember though, the real magic comes from the process of transforming your creativity and communicating your musical ideas to your audience. The guitar and the amp are just tools to accomplish that goal.

Bill

Bill, first of all, what does gain factor affect? what is the difference that I can hear?

And, I really try to read a lot. For the last 2 years i hvae been reading and learning and trying to understand what is going on. Sometimes, I give up, and turn off the PC and just go and play the guitar.
I want to try all the things that I hear on line, I want to hear the differences. But, living is such a tiny island, where there are not enough guitarists to support a large enough market of musical gear, I CANNOT! 15 days ago, I found out that a store has a laney VC30 and a fender hot rod and blues jr. for me, those are great to try out! unfortunately that's it!

So I post here asking for tips from you guys. You have been really helpful.
 
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