Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

[Fuhgawz]

I need a new bridge pickup for my LTD EC500. It is shaped like a Les Paul, but with a thinner mahogany body and has a 24 fret rosewood fretboard. It needs to be a backup guitar to my '79 Yamaha SG2000 for when my band is going to play its first couple of shows in a few months. The problem is that the EMG pickups in the LTD make it sound a lot different from the Yamaha and I need them to sound more similar in case the Yamaha fails mid show and I need to pickup the LTD.

The plan is to sell the EMG set and use that money to buy a new passive bridge pickup, so I can get closer to my sound and break even money wise. I have a Dimarzio Bluesbucker laying around for the neck position. Now I just need a new bridge pickup. They don't need to 'match' because I don't use the neck position much.

I recorded the dry sounds of both guitars to see what needs to be different compared to the EMG81. The Yamaha recording has a lot more bass, but the bass sounds big and clear. It has less mids than the EMG, but doesn't sound all that scooped, because it does have a lot of low mids. Both have ample highs, but the highs sound different. Quite clear and slightly smoothed on the top end on the Yamaha, but the highs on the EMG sound quite flat and hard. Contrary to what I expected, the Yamaha actually does not seem any lower in output than the EMG, but perhaps it just seems that way because of the big bass, which the EMG lacks.

So, who can recommend a pickup that can get my LTD to sound closer to my Yamaha? It doesn't need to sound 100% exactly the same, but I do want to get a lot closer than I am now. It seems like I need to look in the 'medium output' or 'vintage hot' area of pickups with big bass, flat or slightly scooped mids, clear highs and slightly smoothed top end (compared to an EMG81). Preferably passive, widely available (used) and in the Dimarzio/Duncan price range. Thanks!

 

[astrozombie]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Invader with hex polepieces.

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Invader with hex polepieces.

Thanks, but where can I get hex poles that fit and in which way do the hex poles make it sound different from the regular Invader?

 

[Adieu]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Pfff...no.

A8 PAF for similar output to EMG 81 (no strangely i am not in the least sh!tting you, shelve the invader and go try it), but bassier clearer and lower midspike than 81. Heck, just for mad output at classical even voicing. The trick?

Adjustment is crucial, move it towards strings until the obscene pull of the A8 physically makes the strings bend at an angle over its poles, then lower it gradually until the highest position in which string pull no longer causes side effects. Welcome to the sweet spot, where an A8 mag gives crushing output levels yet perfect clarity.

Btw, whats in the Yamaha thats so powerful? Aftermarkets or stock?

 

[Rand-O-Monium]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

EMG 85

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Btw, whats in the Yamaha thats so powerful? Aftermarkets or stock?

Yes, stock pickups. They're strange looking. I've never seen anything similar and I really can't find much information online about them, other then that they should have an alnico 5 magnet and have quite a high output. These guitars came out in the late 70s, so perhaps they're inspired by the higher output pickups that were coming out at that time by Dimarzio?

But like I said, it may only seem that the output is similar to the EMG, because it has more bass. The treble, on the other hand, is clear compared to the EMG, which sounds flat, hard and forward in the treble and high-mid department, has enough mids, but not boosted mids and really not much in the low end. I want to make the treble clearer/smoother and the bass bigger without sacrificing too much output.

I am okay with not getting there 100%. It would of course not even be possible because the construction of the guitars differs. I definitely can get closer than I can with the EMGs though.

Maybe I should ask a simpler question: which pickup has medium output, big bass, slightly scooped mids and clear but smooth highs?

 

[Adieu]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Yes, stock pickups. They're strange looking. I've never seen anything similar and I really can't find much information online about them, other then that they should have an alnico 5 magnet and have quite a high output. These guitars came out in the late 70s, so perhaps they're inspired by the higher output pickups that were coming out at that time by Dimarzio?

But like I said, it may only seem that the output is similar to the EMG, because it has more bass. The treble, on the other hand, is clear compared to the EMG, which sounds flat, hard and forward in the treble and high-mid department, has enough mids, but not boosted mids and really not much in the low end. I want to make the treble clearer/smoother and the bass bigger without sacrificing too much output.

I am okay with not getting there 100%. It would of course not even be possible because the construction of the guitars differs. I definitely can get closer than I can with the EMGs though.

Maybe I should ask a simpler question: which pickup has medium output, big bass, slightly scooped mids and clear but smooth highs?

Oh, they ARE from the same era and people after all

Japanese did all the crazy mag swap tricks in the book back in the day. At the factory, back in the design phase, or in finishing stuff, to populate catalogues with more options. Some of those things hit amps like a freight train, but unlike Duncans or Dimarzio, would be much more evenly EQd. And being stock, not aftermarket, far better suited to the guitars they came in then the average upgrade done with SD or DMZ

Super 70 wasnt the only pickup to come with A8 or other interesting magnetic innovations - just the only A8 pup out of japan to come with A STICKER and an explanatory FLIER. Hence, down into memory it went.

 

[EDX]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

try the lace finger burners, they supposed had a T-Tops main tone and response but with the grit of monsters like Invader or Dirty Fingers, and less noise than most passives, lace is doing really cool pickups, if i played it, really not, but a friend who is produccer and worked with a guitarrist that had lace pickups in some axes, tell me to try them, so i ordered the lace Deathbucker (the guitarrist that he worked with used to had deathbucker set on a king v and finger burners in epi explorer)

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

try the lace finger burners, they supposed had a T-Tops main tone and response but with the grit of monsters like Invader or Dirty Fingers, and less noise than most passives, lace is doing really cool pickups.

Thanks. I hadn't considered Lace, but it seems like some of my favorite guitarist are using them. Plus, the all black look of them is the same as the EMG's, which actually looks great on this guitar. Too bad there aren't that many user reviews about them though.

 

[Toe-Knee]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Bulldog Black Label

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Bulldog Black Label

Thanks, but again, not much info online. I'm hoping to find something in the Duncan/Dimarzio/Gibson range, so it's easier to buy (and sell) used. I have since compared the EMG81 to a Dimarzio Super Distortion. It's in a Gibson SG, which is also a thinner solid mahogany body with a rosewood fretboard, like the LTD. The SD has the amount of lows that I'm after, but is also has too much fuzzy sounding (low) mids and the highs are too raspy.

So, what's like a clearer sounding Super Distortion?

 

[jon the art guy]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

If you want a fuller tone, I've heard the Duncan Distortions are excellent and more full-toned. The Invader also comes in pretty well regarded, has output nearing actives, and still has more "meat".
I'm not the greatest person to ask, but it looks like your main culprits are doing holiday business. SD has some excellent tools to sniff out the sound you like.
http://www.seymourduncan.com/comparetones
The EQ section on the chart will probably be what you're looking for
http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/audio-samples/
If you've got the time, listen to them.

Again, there's some pretty intense pickupologists on this forum, so hang out a bit.

 

[soulforger]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Dimarzio Breed neck model used in the bridge, maybe an AT1 or the new Transitions (Steve Lukather sig) which are supposed to be a higher output 36th ann. Paf.?

 

[MkIII Renegade]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

EMG 85

I second this! My Charvel superstrat sounded a bit thin with the 81 and the 85 was much fuller, but still has absolute clarity.

 

[jon the art guy]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

I could have sworn this was a Seymour Duncan forum and he asked for Seymour Duncan suggestions. Come on, guys.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

 

[soulforger]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Fair enough, Custom or Custom 5...

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

I could have sworn this was a Seymour Duncan forum and he asked for Seymour Duncan suggestions. Come on, guys.

Well, it doesn't have to be, but it would help a lot if it were a Seymour Duncan or Dimarzio or Gibson pickup, because they are relatively inexpensive, can be bought anywhere and there are reviews all over the web. After all, this is just a backup guitar, so I'm not going to risk buying expensive 'boutique' pickups. I do want to get close to the sound of the other guitar though, so EMG 85 might not be what I'm after.

Fair enough, Custom or Custom 5...

The Duncan Custom might be a good idea. I have an A8 and A5 magnet in my drawer from when I changed magnets on a P90 pickup, so I can always make it a C5 or C8 if I want to. Now that I'm thinking about it, what about a good old 498t? Or would that be too light in the bass department and scratchy?

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

Alt 8 sounds about right to me.

 

[Inder_Cine_Mann]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

I could have sworn this was a Seymour Duncan forum and he asked for Seymour Duncan suggestions. Come on, guys.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

Who cares that it's a Duncan forum? All pickups are discussed

I would go, in this order, C8, Alt8, Custom.

I love the Super Distortion but it seems you already have experience with it

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Replacing EMG81 with passive, need: bigger bass, less (high) mids, clearer highs.

I love the Super Distortion but it seems you already have experience with it

I love it too, but it's in another guitar for another project. For this project, I want to come as close as I can to the Yamaha. And as great as the Super Distortion may be, it still sounds different in the fact that it has more mids and sounds kinda fuzzy, where I need a more clear sound. It's closer to the sound I want then the EMG though, but I'm hoping to come even closer.

I'm a little surprised with the A8 recommendations, because I thought that A8 pickups typically boost the mids, where in this case I need the mids to be slightly recessed and open.