Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

[schooljeans]

Good evening,
I'm writing in from Australia,..Does anyone know which is the best Amp and maybe other equipment needed that is "friendly" to the ears for Boss multi-effects pedals please? I see Alex Hutchings with the wonderful GR55,RC300,GT100,..but the Amp is never displayed or mentioned and if there are other filterings,sound alterings,....
It's just that I've seen a few Youtube videos and some Amps don't seem to be too friendly with certain pedals. I spent weeks studying and get excited with this pedal and that one,..
All the wonderful sounds that make you want to go out and buy a pedal is in vain if the Amp is wrong to start off with,..I have seen one video whereby it talks about a 4 cables and return with the GR55-it was brilliant only,I don't know how I can do this on my Vox AC30C2 and unsure of how to use it to get the best sound and my guitar is a Gibson '61 reissue...There is an effects in the Amp but I've tried with Boss ME 70 only and it sounded awful. I just wondered if there was a site that would list amps, pedals and guitars that were friendly to
each other-and possibly display settings and help pages,..Would anyone know or have come across something like this please? I am just a beginner in electric guitar and have been playing acoustic-self taught last 2 years now semi-acoustic and finding it hard to adjust to electric guitar playing,thanks

 

[Aceman]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

A few points…

A key to using a multi fx box is that you want to generally use ONLY the multi fx for distortion and other sounds.

Generally, if there is an fx send/return, run the unit into the return. Optionally, set the amp for a clean neutral sound and then only use the amp eq to touch up the sound from the unit.

Honestly, I would think the AC 30 could get a spanky clean sound that would easily work with a boss multi fx. A bigger problem is really taking the time to tweak the unit tones. Most presets are stupid over the top sounding. Less is generally less in those things. I used an old ME-6 for a long time into a solid state Peavy and it sounded awesome.

Finally, think about getting one of the powered cabs by Tech 21 or Atomic, designed for modelers. Thiose are more like studio monitors than guitar amps and are designed to translate the sound of the unit accurately.

 

[devastone]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

I don't know what Alex Hutchings is using, but to get the best tones from using a multi-effects unit like the GT-100 with a real amp, you want to turn off the amp models, amp models/preamps usually don't sound very good running into a the front end of an amp. Or, if you are using the preamps/models, you want to run into the fx return on the amp. Look up the 4CM or 4 Cable Method for hooking up a GT-100 to a real amp. Once hooked up in that configuration, the GT-100 is flexible enough to be able to run either the preamp on your AC30 or one of the internal amp models by configuring where the loop and models are in the chain. Sorry, I don't have time to explain all of that right now, there are tons of users and information about the GT units out there.

I can't speak to the GR or the RC, they are totallly different beasts being a a synth and a looper.

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

A key to using a multi fx box is that you want to generally use ONLY the multi fx for distortion and other sounds.

What ?

Since the inception of multi-FX boards, it seems most people have always been happy enough to use everything available EXCEPT the inbuilt overdrives/ distortions, usually opting for their favourite outboard pedal to take care of the dirt department. This is very likely why some boards now offer inbuilt loops in which to insert other pedals ... and I bet that largely they are used to insert external dirt devices more than anything else.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

I would imagine that Roland BOSS demonstrator, Alex Hutchings, plays the GT-100 and GR-55 through a full range public address system. Within the "Global" parameters of these units, there will be a setting to match the EQ of the overall audio output to whatever amplification or recording equipment the signal is going to next.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

I don't know what Alex Hutchings is using, but to get the best tones from using a multi-effects unit like the GT-100 with a real amp, you want to turn off the amp models, amp models/preamps usually don't sound very good running into a the front end of an amp.

That was my point. If you are using this beast for all the sound shaping (and why wouldn't you?) Treating a multi-fx like a dirt box in front of the amp will suck balls every which way.

Craft the sound entirely from the box, preferably in the loop.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

What ?

People use them ALL sorts of ways.
- All straight into clean
- All into the loop
- Split; Dirt into front, swirly into loop (higher end stuff)
- Only for swirly into dirt at front of amp
- We can go on….


I'm saying IF you are using the unit for ALL your sound. Not some hybrid scheme etc….Dirty multi FX into driven amp sound BAD usually. The built in loops IMO are more often used for you particular favorite pedal that isn't in there - often a wah, or whatever. I bet most don't insert dirt pedals.

It is not hard at all to craft great freaking sounds from a Boss GT-6 or better, let alone a 100 etc…The key is NOT treeing the dirt in the unit like it is a stomp hitting the amp.

 

[devastone]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

I think both are valid, especially with the GT-100. The modeling is really good, definitely a step up from the older GTs I've used and sound good into a power amp and speakers (I admit that I haven't played with it direct much, yet). With the 4CM, you can put the amp's preamp in the loop of the GT and run effects in front of the amp and in the effects loop. You can have patches that use the amp's preamp and other ones that turn off the GT's loop and use the models in the GT, so lots of options are available.

 

[schooljeans]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

Thanks for this, it opened my eyes a little I live right out of town in the rural and I rely a lot on youtube but it takes weeks of studying to get anywhere sometimes,..I'm a very beginner. I am trying to get some aeroplane or flanging effects .. and aiming for those warm sounds of the 70s and am trying to describe as best I can what I am trying to achieve,..The other thing is I am a fervent songwriter so I'd be using different sounds,..the more sounds the better to choose from and making them from scratch so not so "controlled" is even better,..any tips would be amazing. I'll go and see the music shop here for powered cabs-Tech 21 or Atomic but I may need to study up first,..I'm looking to gig my work in the simplest form without internet and write my work without internet - just using the internet for the patches into the pedal at the initial start. Still I don't know how the GT100 or GR55 work,..

 

[Gainstage]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

A preamp or amp model was never designed to go into an amp front end.
Having used a bunch of various multi units over time, I seldom kept them for long. As David Gilmour once said, "pedals just sound better". Depends on the level really, I get tired of things pretty easy once I reach where they can go or the limits of their programming.
Honestly, if you have a good amp, a 4CM thing is a waste of a great amp, if that is what you're after; using the unit as a core and just power amping works very well. I have tried a lot of modelers and seldom been happy with them past the newness stage. I suppose I could have given the Atomic more time as the amp models were pretty damn good but I kept getting this annoying digital clock tick through the effects. I made the mistake of selling off my pedals for the next all great multi unit more than a couple times. Every result was slowly rebuilding my board.
I got really upset with tube quality and amp failure a ways back and have been experimenting with modelers and tube emulation and ran across some marvelous things. If you have a multi unit that has everything in it then adding more is pretty much diminishing returns. You may never be happy with the units dist and drive things unless you're lucky enough to have a unit that uses analog for the front end effects. I have never had any multi unit that sounded close to my pedal drives, boosts or high gains. A couple good pedals in the unit's effect loop and away you go.
I tend to not like digital drive type stuff just does not do it for me, would a Fractal quality be better, I do not know, cannot afford that level but everything I've had was just not close to pedals.
I recommend not messing with a 4CM thing unless you have a not so great amp and need to do something with it. POD does that a lot to cover up their level issues on the loop and hiss floor they have.

Never preamp a preamp, just a design flaw. I used a GR 55 for a time and unless you get the 3rd party custom switch box with a loop for pedals you will miss them. I used two rig chains into two different amp rigs for mine. The amp models and overall capability of the GR-55 are incredible. I mainly just used the synth stuff but it needed a fullrange speaker system verses a guitar speaker rig. Anyone really wanting to get the best out of guitar synth is not going to run it into a guitar amp or guitar speakers, just a different animal.

Bottom line: if your unit has good tweakable amp modelling try setting the levels accordingly (many have output option levels) into a reasonable power amp and then your speaker rig and have at it. Power amps are really low priced and the trick is finding one that does not have too much wattage. I really like the ART SL-1 I use, a studio quality musical quality power amp, and it will be working long after I am bones. You can get a tube power amp and all that but really is it gaining much for the cost and tube issues? Tubea are meant to be driven and pushed, that is not really the intent or purpose of a modeler which is trying to deliver that sound to begin with. A lot of modeler hate comes into view because of thinking along tube amp ideas.
Plug any drive or boost pedals before the model (in its effect loop) and use the multi for your mod, delay and reverb stuff. One of the cool abilities of many multi units is the ability to run stereo which can be really great sounding. I've been running stereo rigs ever since I made my synth rig and stayed with them to present. I love stereo spread of modulation and delay/reverb panning. Throwing delay or reverb all the way to one side of the stereo can be a really nice wet/dry rig and it sounds really big. Having a modulation like a panner, or trem go from side to side can be wicked cool.

 

[Hank-]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

4CM can be used to switch between the preamp model & an amp's own preamp, although that's not the only thing it's good for. It allows one to place effects before and after an preamp, which is what you want to do if you have a great amp already. Not doing it is what i would call a waste of buying an multi fx that allows that function. Most if not all multi untis offer the function of turning off the internal models as well, so going straight into the front end of an amp is not an issue, same putting a big pedalboard up front. Besides not all amp's have an fx loop or did in the past, its definitely possible to use all kinds of stuff with those as well plugging into the input.

Having said that, i don't like the amount of cable clutter or a single fat snake it creates to use a amp's fx loop even with regular individual pedals. One option is to buy the pedalsnake kit, it's not two expensive & very effective for such setups. Other option, go into the front end of the amp with all pedals like Paul Gilbert, this is what i do as well. Doesn't sound bad either, works fine as long as an analog delay is not involved with a lot of preamp gain on the amp.

Coming back to Roland/Boss Gt units, I have the GT10. I like it for 4CM, hard to understand getting unity gain when going 4CM with it for first timers since it's got level adjustments a plenty but once you do get unity gain it stays pretty transparent. Not a big fan of using it direct, don't care a lot for the amp models in it either. The ODs can work but i prefer certain dirt boxes so i use them with it.

 

[Mincer]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

If you are way out in a rural area, and a songwriter, you may consider just using software. It might be easier to record, and you can get some really great sounds out of the different ones out there (Guitar Rig, Amplitube, etc).

 

[Boppy]

Re: Roland Boss Pedals Multi effects pedals

After using pedals for many years, I've only just recently started messing with muti-effects--I have a BOSS ME-50.

I found that the overdrives/distortions sucked initially in the way that a lot of folks describe--gritty, thin, strident, etc., but I also found that the signal coming out of the ME-50 is very bright--especially with a Strat going into my Fender amps.

After adjusting the EQ on my amp--that is, turning the treble and edgy mids down, I now have an all around decent tone--whereas before I was like "How the hell is this setting supposed to sound even remotely like a Tube Screamer, or a Big Muff?"