RW/RP middle pickup not humbucking

[RowRowRowsYourBoat]

Hi,

I have a set of Invaders in my HSH Ibanez guitar and I wanted to find a single-coil to match with the two humbuckers, so I picked the Quarter Pound Strat in RW/RP configuration as the Seymour Duncan Pickup Finder tool recommends. The problem is that there is still a hum in positions 2 and 4. To clarify, all three pickups are installed in such a way that "Seymour Duncan" is readable when the guitar is upright. Should I have gotten the standard-wound single-coil instead? And can somebody confirm for me to which coil the Invaders split with standard wiring? It's not clear which one is the slug coil and which one is the screw coil with the Invaders...

Thanks!

 

[beaubrummels]

I thought most all (with few exceptions) Duncan Strat pickups are wound to match Fender's spec, which is reverse polarity relative to Duncan Humbuckers, so you'd just have to flip the hot and ground? (Either flip the humbucker wires, or flip the QP wires)

FWIW the Custom Shop has a single Invader, and you could ask specifically to make it work with regular Invader humbuckers.

Single-Coil Invader

Design your dream pickup. The Seymour Duncan Custom Shop hand-builds humbuckers, Strat, Tele, P90 & bass pickups, wound to your exact specs. Choose magnets, wire, wind, covers & more. Made in Santa Barbara.

customshop.seymourduncan.com

 

[freefrog]

Hi,

Just to be clear: a RW/RP single coil is meant to buck the hum only when paired with other single coils, IOW with humbucker in split mode. Is it the case in your guitar?

Anyway: which coil is disabled in split mode depends on the wiring schematic of your instrument. If the switch is a conventional 5 ways for Strat and splits the humbuckers through the second row of poles, it should be easy to reverse the path of split coils by modifying to what the center lug of the second row is connected (if the white and red wires tied altogether are connected to ground by this center lug in 2d and 4th positions, just reconnect the center lug to "hot" and it will change which coil is split).

AFAIK, the coil connected to ground through green and bare wires is normally the South one, where the Seymour Duncan logo is printed. The other coil without logo is the North one and goes to hot through the black wire. I don't remember Invaders as being different there.

Last but not least: its symmetrical coils allow to flip an Invader under the strings if the split coil is not the desired one. It puts the logo upside down but sonically, it works. That's exactly what I've done once with a HSH Cort guitar, FWIW (flipping the pickups under the strings was quicker than reversing the polarity and wiring of both humbuckers).

Hope you'll find a solution. Good luck.

 

[RowRowRowsYourBoat]

I thought most all (with few exceptions) Duncan Strat pickups are wound to match Fender's spec, which is reverse polarity relative to Duncan Humbuckers, so you'd just have to flip the hot and ground? (Either flip the humbucker wires, or flip the QP wires)

FWIW the Custom Shop has a single Invader, and you could ask specifically to make it work with regular Invader humbuckers.

Single-Coil Invader

Design your dream pickup. The Seymour Duncan Custom Shop hand-builds humbuckers, Strat, Tele, P90 & bass pickups, wound to your exact specs. Choose magnets, wire, wind, covers & more. Made in Santa Barbara.

customshop.seymourduncan.com

Will this not put one of the pickups out of phase? I get confused between wind and polarity.

Hi,

Just to be clear: a RW/RP single coil is meant to buck the hum only when paired with other single coils, IOW with humbucker in split mode. Is it the case in your guitar?

Anyway: which coil is disabled in split mode depends on the wiring schematic of your instrument. If the switch is a conventional 5 ways for Strat and splits the humbuckers through the second row of poles, it should be easy to reverse the path of split coils by modifying to what the center lug of the second row is connected (if the white and red wires tied altogether are connected to ground by this center lug in 2d and 4th positions, just reconnect the center lug to "hot" and it will change which coil is split).

AFAIK, the coil connected to ground through green and bare wires is normally the South one, where the Seymour Duncan logo is printed. The other coil without logo is the North one and goes to hot through the black wire. I don't remember Invaders as being different there.

Last but not least: its symmetrical coils allow to flip an Invader under the strings if the split coil is not the desired one. It puts the logo upside down but sonically, it works. That's exactly what I've done once with a HSH Cort guitar, FWIW (flipping the pickups under the strings was quicker than reversing the polarity and wiring of both humbuckers).

Hope you'll find a solution. Good luck.

That's right, positions 2 and 4 are splitting the humbuckers and combining with the single-coil. And both humbuckers have the white and red wires tied together and soldered to the TAP on the Ibanez 3SWLSP5 switch.

 

[freefrog]

That's right, positions 2 and 4 are splitting the humbuckers and combining with the single-coil. And both humbuckers have the white and red wires tied together and soldered to the TAP on the Ibanez 3SWLSP5 switch.

So the easy solutions that I evoked seem doable... I'd start by reconnecting where the TAP wire goes (by sending it to "hot" if it initially goes to ground) and by rotating the Invaders under the strings if split coils are not the desired ones.

Regarding OOP: it doesn't happen when a coil is RW and RP relatively to another. It does happen when coils are RW but not RP or conversely, if there's RP without RW.

Possibly useful reading : https://www.1728.org/guitar1b.htm

HTH for your HSH. ;-)

 

[RowRowRowsYourBoat]

So the easy solutions that I evoked seem doable... I'd start by reconnecting where the TAP wire goes (by sending it to "hot" if it initially goes to ground) and by rotating the Invaders under the strings if split coils are not the desired ones.

Regarding OOP: it doesn't happen when a coil is RW and RP relatively to another. It does happen when coils are RW but not RP or conversely, if there's RP without RW.

Possibly useful reading : https://www.1728.org/guitar1b.htm

HTH for your HSH. ;-)

Thanks for your response, freefrog.

So to be clear: I would have to rotate both humbuckers and rewire them?

 

[freefrog]

Thanks for your response, freefrog.

So to be clear: I would have to rotate both humbuckers and rewire them?

You're welcome.

You haven't to rewire your humbuckers: your issue can be solved by moving just one wire on the switch, the "TAP" one (from ground to hot or conversely, from hot to ground: I don't know since it depends on how your instrument is wired exactly).

Once that done, test which coil of each humbucker is active in 2d and 4th positions. If it's not the proper one, just rotate the humbucker under the strings.

If the RW/RP mid single coil is in phase with the humbucker right now, it won't be out of phase if you change with wich coil of each humbucker it's paired (reason: in a humbucker, each coil is RW and RP relatively to the other).

 

[freefrog]

I share below a schematic showing two ways to do "autosplit" with a standard 5 ways Strat switch.

Let's ignore the push-pull with brown / blue wires: let's do as if it didn't exist and focus on the other wires. Then let's watch where goes the green or orange wire from the lug shown by a lil' red arrow in each case, on the upper part of the switch... That's the easy way to permutate which coils of humbuckers are enabled in 2d and 4th positions.

FWIW. HTH.

 

[Artie]

A Duncan single "neck" will be hum-cancelling with a Duncan humbucker stud coil. An RWRP middle will be hum-cancelling with a Duncan screw coil. If that helps.

P.S. It's a little pricey, because it's Custom Shop, but an Invader single would be sweet between those Invaders.

Invader Single

 

[beaubrummels]

I would just flip the hot/ground on the single coil myself. AFAIK Ibanez uses a proprietary switch, you can't just change the tap.

 

[freefrog]

Flipping the hot and ground of the single coil would just put it OOP with the humbuckers.

If it hums while paired with split coils and in phase with them, the only solution is to pair it with the other coils. I've shared how to do that in the simplest way AFAIK.

 

[beaubrummels]

If it were me, I'd just get a normal single for the middle then. It's not worth screwing with more than that.

 

[freefrog]

An RWRP middle will be hum-cancelling with a Duncan screw coil. If that helps.

I lacked of time to express my agreement but that's why I've shared in post 8 a pic showing how to split to "outside" (South / screw) coils by moving one single wire, FWIW.

 

[Artie]

I lacked of time to express my agreement but that's why I've shared in post 8 a pic showing how to split to "outside" (South / screw) coils by moving one single wire, FWIW.

Yup. I forgot that after I clicked on your diagram, I could click it again to open it up where I could see it.