Seth Lovers through a Hot Rod Deluxe?
- Thread starter Wound_Up
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Wound_Up
New member
Any settings. It's only really one area of the fretboard. A, D, & G between 4 & 10. Those notes seem to have some weird mids thing going on. I have the stock Celestion A-type in this one. It's also literally brand new, a 2024 model, so I guess it could be related to the speaker still being really stiff?
I've had it for 2 weeks and only played through it for maybe an hour combined. That was only to test it out and make sure everything worked so I knew if I needed to return it for another one. I won't have it to play through daily for another month, when my bday finally comes around.
If I play through the HRD and run it through the 12" Celestion Seventy/80 in my Monoprice 15w combo, I don't hear it but the A-type sounds nothing like the seventy/80. So I imagine that's why. The A-type is clear and articulate where the Seventy/80 seems to break up much, much, much earlier. It's EQ'd wayyyy different, also.
The next time I get it out, I'll try and remember to get some audio recorded so people can hear what I hear. For all i know, something could be wrong with it or this could be it's normal sound and I just have to get used to it. I wired an extra input jack to the speaker in my Monoprice amp so I can run the HRDlx through that speaker easier. I also need to try the Monoprice amp through the A-type speaker in the HRDlx and see if it still has that sound to it.
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GuitarStv
Sock Market Trader
Covered unpotted pickups?
I think I've had a similar issue with an Antiquity bridge. It was driving me nuts for a while . . . eventually I realized that the pickup cover was causing just the slightest rattle when I played in certain positions on the guitar. Took the cover off, put a couple pieces of electrical tape over the slug coils, then clamped the cover on pretty tightly and soldered it back. It sounded kind of like a weird distortion when playing completely clean - and it completely went away after resoldering the cover. I'm guessing this happens sometimes with unpotted pickups, they can be more prone to picking up rattles.
I think I've had a similar issue with an Antiquity bridge. It was driving me nuts for a while . . . eventually I realized that the pickup cover was causing just the slightest rattle when I played in certain positions on the guitar. Took the cover off, put a couple pieces of electrical tape over the slug coils, then clamped the cover on pretty tightly and soldered it back. It sounded kind of like a weird distortion when playing completely clean - and it completely went away after resoldering the cover. I'm guessing this happens sometimes with unpotted pickups, they can be more prone to picking up rattles.
freefrog
Well-known member
As suggested by GuitarStv, it might be due to some sympathetic vibrations.
A problem is that such things can have many physical sources: the pickups themselves but also their height setting springs... or the truss rod in the neck: have you checked if it isn't loose?
Unless it's the loudspeaker... or its screws... or anything loose in the amp - including the power valves producing "tube rattling", the cage around them, the reverb tank, etc.
A simple nut or screw can screw the sound and drive us nuts if it's not properly fastened... :-/
Anyway:
1- A, D and G strings from 4th to 10th frets = a frequency range of 138hz to 349hz when it comes to fundamental notes. Celestion A type and Seventy 80 aren't really different in this range. Now, the two drivers exhibit considerable differences if we talk about the 1380hz to 3490hz section, where are the 10th harmonics of the fundamental notes previously mentioned AND where the resonant peak of a Seth will occur through a standard guitar rig...
2-HRD's are mid heavy circuits. A Celestion A type fill the hi-mids more than a Seventy 80. Seth's do produce honky mids. The sum of these tendencies might certainly appear as too middy.
FWIW. HTH.
A problem is that such things can have many physical sources: the pickups themselves but also their height setting springs... or the truss rod in the neck: have you checked if it isn't loose?
Unless it's the loudspeaker... or its screws... or anything loose in the amp - including the power valves producing "tube rattling", the cage around them, the reverb tank, etc.
A simple nut or screw can screw the sound and drive us nuts if it's not properly fastened... :-/
Anyway:
1- A, D and G strings from 4th to 10th frets = a frequency range of 138hz to 349hz when it comes to fundamental notes. Celestion A type and Seventy 80 aren't really different in this range. Now, the two drivers exhibit considerable differences if we talk about the 1380hz to 3490hz section, where are the 10th harmonics of the fundamental notes previously mentioned AND where the resonant peak of a Seth will occur through a standard guitar rig...
2-HRD's are mid heavy circuits. A Celestion A type fill the hi-mids more than a Seventy 80. Seth's do produce honky mids. The sum of these tendencies might certainly appear as too middy.
FWIW. HTH.
Wound_Up
New member
I thought you were onto something here but then I remembered it does it with the 59 bridge, also.
Thinking about what freefrog said, I was actually reading something similar somewhere else. Another guy had a weird sympathetic vibration in his HR Deluxe and it ended up being that his speaker wasn't tightened to the baffle that well. 4 screws were loose.
So I'll go over the entire thing and see what I can find. I already tightened all of the external screws in the cabinet when it got here but it didn't occur to me to check the speaker. I might get it out of the closet here in a bit and see what I can see.
Thanks, you all. I really appreciate the help!
Wound_Up
New member
I tried to edit my last post to add this but I can't so I'll just make another post.
freefrog you mention it could be a nut or screw that's screwing the sound... I've been through that, too. I had a sympathetic vibration in one of my guitars when I'd play a certain note and it was ANNOYING. After a couple of months, I finally figured it out. It was a pickup height spring on the humbucker! So I pulled the springs and replaced them with rubber tubing. Finally killed that buzz. Boy was I happy! Lol
freefrog you mention it could be a nut or screw that's screwing the sound... I've been through that, too. I had a sympathetic vibration in one of my guitars when I'd play a certain note and it was ANNOYING. After a couple of months, I finally figured it out. It was a pickup height spring on the humbucker! So I pulled the springs and replaced them with rubber tubing. Finally killed that buzz. Boy was I happy! Lol
Wound_Up
New member
Well, I narrowed it down to the Celestion A-type 12 inch speaker. The Hot Rod through a Celestion Seventy/80 12 inch speaker sounds fine. But if I play my Monoprice 15w amp through the Celestion A-type, I get that same sound.
I guess it's just the way this speaker is voiced and I'm just not used to it. Or there could be something going on with the speaker itself but I don't know how I'd figure out if it was without having another HRD IV to compare it to.
I also tightened all of the baffle screws and was hoping that would somehow cure it but it didn't. That did get rid of a terrible buzzing I was having at loud volumes, though. So that's a plus.
Finally, I've found that it's extremely easy to play through this amp at bedroom volumes. Even up at 3-4, it's relatively easy to keep the volume down until I dig in. I don't think my Monoprice amp has that kind of dynamics. I'm quite impressed. But all I've had is the Monoprice 15w combo so I'm easy to impress lol :laugh2:
I guess it's just the way this speaker is voiced and I'm just not used to it. Or there could be something going on with the speaker itself but I don't know how I'd figure out if it was without having another HRD IV to compare it to.
I also tightened all of the baffle screws and was hoping that would somehow cure it but it didn't. That did get rid of a terrible buzzing I was having at loud volumes, though. So that's a plus.
Finally, I've found that it's extremely easy to play through this amp at bedroom volumes. Even up at 3-4, it's relatively easy to keep the volume down until I dig in. I don't think my Monoprice amp has that kind of dynamics. I'm quite impressed. But all I've had is the Monoprice 15w combo so I'm easy to impress lol :laugh2:
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freefrog
Well-known member
HRD's are among first price Fender tube amps but are also their best sellers if memory serves me and it's not without reasons: I know pro muzos who use it and it can be seen behind famous bands on TV... It has not a typical scooped clean Fender voicing (it's a variation on Bassman circuits and was designed by a former Marshall collaborator)... it has some reliability issues (the two big white cement resistors over the power tubes are well known for cooking the PCB)... it can sound a bit too middy, one dimensional or harsh as it is voiced... but it cuts through the mix on stage and has certainly some dynamic weight.
I've done something like 17 circuit mods on a HRD... and tried a bunch of drivers. What makes it sound the best IME is an EVM12L but it makes such a combo even heavier. ;-)
It's still possible to swap the loudspeakers of your monoprice amp and HRD if needed.
Enjoy!
Wound_Up
New member
Speaking of those resistors, it appears Fender has finally made some attempt at rectifying that problem.
How?
My resistors are mounted up off the pcb, with an air gap between them and the board! The legs are covered with cloth tubing like the 1w resistor close to them, and they also siliconed the 2 cement resistors together to help with vibration resistance since they aren't down against the board anymore. See below
I was shocked. I'm still shocked lol. My amp is the only one I've seen like this so far. But I don't know anyone else whos bought one in the last month. So that's probably why. All the ones you see repaired on YouTube are older ones obviously.
Now it's time to wait and see what happens. I'm hopeful but not expecting much.
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Wound_Up
New member
The resistors in the pic are no longer siliconed together, as seen. I didn't think that was conducive to good heat dissipation so I cut the silicone and separated them to get better airflow around them. That won't stay, that way for long after talking with Lyle at Psionic Audio. It was likely for vibration resistance so I'll likely be sticking them back together soon.
I also found a very interesting website that sells a bunch of stuff to correct those issues. One is a remote mount board for the resistors so they don't destroy the main board. You also get bigger resistors that are able to handle the heat. They also sell some pcb's that swap the axial caps for radial caps so that one can use any of the multiple high quality radial caps, like Nichicon, to repair the amp vs just the axial F&T's that are usually the only option. I'll have to find the link.
Here it is. Hot Rod Deluxe repair kit
https://www.rsdsound.co.uk/product/...deluxe-repair-kit-hot-rod-deville-repair-kit/
And the HR Deluxe Ultimate Fix kit with the remote resistor pcb
https://www.rsdsound.co.uk/product/fender-hot-rod-deluxe-lt-supply-ultimate-fix/
If I have to address these issues once it's out of warranty, I'll likely employ some of these fixes to mine. Hopefully it goes under warranty so Fender can fix it for me.
The weirdest thing about this is that the weird tone I'm hearing only affects a few notes. F# to A# on the D string. If I play the equivalent notes on different strings, there's no issue. It sounds fine. It's almost like the pickup is out of phase with itself or the speaker is out of phase with itself or I dunno what. It has an out of phase sound to it. If I play my 335-style with OOP pickups, it enhances the sound. Makes it worse.
Anyway. I'll figure something out, if it just means not playing those 4 or 5 notes on that string lol
I also found a very interesting website that sells a bunch of stuff to correct those issues. One is a remote mount board for the resistors so they don't destroy the main board. You also get bigger resistors that are able to handle the heat. They also sell some pcb's that swap the axial caps for radial caps so that one can use any of the multiple high quality radial caps, like Nichicon, to repair the amp vs just the axial F&T's that are usually the only option. I'll have to find the link.
Here it is. Hot Rod Deluxe repair kit
https://www.rsdsound.co.uk/product/...deluxe-repair-kit-hot-rod-deville-repair-kit/
And the HR Deluxe Ultimate Fix kit with the remote resistor pcb
https://www.rsdsound.co.uk/product/fender-hot-rod-deluxe-lt-supply-ultimate-fix/
If I have to address these issues once it's out of warranty, I'll likely employ some of these fixes to mine. Hopefully it goes under warranty so Fender can fix it for me.
The weirdest thing about this is that the weird tone I'm hearing only affects a few notes. F# to A# on the D string. If I play the equivalent notes on different strings, there's no issue. It sounds fine. It's almost like the pickup is out of phase with itself or the speaker is out of phase with itself or I dunno what. It has an out of phase sound to it. If I play my 335-style with OOP pickups, it enhances the sound. Makes it worse.
Anyway. I'll figure something out, if it just means not playing those 4 or 5 notes on that string lol
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