Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

M

mikeyp

New member
I recently picket up a Seth Lover set for my Ibanez AGS83BBG. Their diagram shows the above mentioed cap for what looks like all of their humbuckers. Just curious why that is? Do they feel their humbuckers are inherently bright? Imo rolling back the tone knob a little with a .022 cap would give comparable tone.

I've had them in for about a week but there was an issue with the bridge tone pot , so I fished it all out today. The bridge pup seemed a little bright but it could have been the f'd up pot.

I used the original caps which have a 333 on them but no decimal point . any thoughts on that?

And lastly, if I can type this in a way that is understood, speed knobs. The original ones, coarse spline, have a bit of a skirt which hides the nut on the pot. If you were to turn the knob upside down and measure from the bottom of the splined hole to the edge of the knob, or bottom of the knob, it looks to be approximately 1/16" more then the new knobs, which are fine spline to fit the new cts pots. What gives? Are all coarse knobs similiar to my original and all fine knobs the same as my new ones?

Thankyou,
Me
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

Their diagram shows the above mentioed cap for what looks like all of their humbuckers. Just curious why that is? Do they feel their humbuckers are inherently bright? Imo rolling back the tone knob a little with a .022 cap would give comparable tone.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure it was just a generic choice on their part.
Cap values change according to personal taste.
They probably should have put a range in there, if they could have foreseen there would be an issue.

I used the original caps which have a 333 on them but no decimal point . any thoughts on that?
Click to expand...
Edit: Doh. Misread. Slightly_rude got it right.

And in terms of your knob/pot shaft issue, I think that has more to do with differing manufacturer specs than anything.
Ibanez sources their parts out of Asia using their standards.
Parts sourced in the US aren't an exact match... and in some cases, like pot shaft diameter, aren't even close.
So, your mileage may vary, is the about it.

Once you get the wiring squared away, those Seths should sound awesome in that guitar.
 
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Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

Just to clarify, the 333 is on the cap.

Yeah they did sound pretty good/different. I took that guitar to a jam last week. Either I was having a bad picking hand night or these pups are really sensitive to picking.
 
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Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

From all my SD experience their bridge humbuckers sound best with 500k pots and .047 caps. Keeps the sound open without being harsh.

People can argue all they want that "it only effects the tone when you roll your tone knob back". <--- that is not true. I hear a big difference with all knobs at 10.
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

John E Rokker said:
People can argue all they want that "it only effects the tone when you roll your tone knob back". <--- that is not true. I hear a big difference with all knobs at 10.
Click to expand...

I guess you've just got better ears than the rest of us. Even if there IS a difference with all the knobs on 10, it cannot be "a big difference" or we would all hear it and there would not be any "argue(ment)".

Anything wrong with this picture?!
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

GuitarDoc said:
I guess you've just got better ears than the rest of us. Even if there IS a difference with all the knobs on 10, it cannot be "a big difference" or we would all hear it and there would not be any "argue(ment)".

Anything wrong with this picture?!
Click to expand...

Even with a tone pot on 10,there is a slight rolloff of highs that still get shunted to ground..The circuit still sees the resistance from the pot...The cap still sends a small amount of highend to ground...If you take the pot and cap out of the equation,you hear the highend and a slightly louder overall signal.
 
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Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

John E Rokker said:
From all my SD experience their bridge humbuckers sound best TO ME with 500k pots and .047 caps. Keeps the sound open without being harsh.
Click to expand...

You forgot to add those two little words (in red). They sound best TO ME with 500k pots and .015 caps, they sound best to Blueman with 250k pots and .022 caps, they sound best to...etc, etc, etc.

Sound is a perception not an absolute.
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

GuitarDoc said:
You forgot to add those two little words (in red). They sound best TO ME with 500k pots and .015 caps, they sound best to Blueman with 250k pots and .022 caps, they sound best to...etc, etc, etc.

Sound is a perception not an absolute.
Click to expand...

Agreed.....On my dual humbucking guitars(SG,335,LP) I like .022/500k for the bridge.... .015/500k for the neck..

Strats/Teles....250k and .022 caps..
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

Basically this is what I hear/have found...

The larger the tone cap value,the faster the tone rolloff and the darker the tone as you roll towards 0 on the tone pot...At 0 on the tone pot,your guitar's tone will be darker with the .047 compared to the lower value .022 as an example....The larger cap will even very slightly remove some added highs compared to the .022...Try it and see..
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

STRATDELUXER97 said:
Even with a tone pot on 10,there is a slight rolloff of highs that still get shunted to ground..The circuit still sees the resistance from the pot...The cap still sends a small amount of highend to ground...If you take the pot and cap out of the equation,you hear the highend and a slightly louder overall signal.
Click to expand...

"I" don't. I've tried A/Bing with one end of the cap soldered in place and intermitently touching the other end to its appropriate contact point with knobs on "10"...I don't hear a change. If there is a change, it is small. I can definitely hear a big difference between different cap values when the pot is rolled off from "10", but not when the pot stays on "10".

I'm not saying that there is no electrical difference, only that it is tiny enough for me not to be able to hear it.
 
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Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

a
GuitarDoc said:
"I" don't. I've tried A/Bing with one end of the cap soldered in place and intermitently touching the other end to its appropriate contact point with knobs on "10"...I don't hear a change. If there is a change, it is small. I can definitely hear a big difference between different cap values when the pot is rolled off from "10", but not when the pot stays on "10".

I'm not saying that there is no electical difference, only that it is tiny enough for me not to be able to hear it.
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Doc....My highs are shot and your's are maybe a little worse? ;O) You have over 10 years on me! I use 500k No Load tone pots that I make myself...I do hear a difference with the pot on 10 vs say 9 and on down...May be the way my guitars are wired(50s wiring) but I do hear a slightly brighter overall tone when the caps and pots are out of the equation..
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

STRATDELUXER97 said:
Basically this is what I hear/have found...

The larger the tone cap value,the faster the tone rolloff and the darker the tone as you roll towards 0 on the tone pot...At 0 on the tone pot,your guitar's tone will be darker with the .047 compared to the lower value .022 as an example....The larger cap will even very slightly remove some added highs compared to the .022...Try it and see..
Click to expand...

I certainly agree. I definitely hear the difference between different cap values as the pot is rolled away from "10". I just don't hear it when the pot stays on "10".
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

mikeyp said:
The bridge pup seemed a little bright but it could have been the f'd up pot.
Click to expand...

Some of us think bridge PU's tend to be a little bright, and we use one or two 250K pots with our bridge HB's and P-90's to cut out excess treble. I prefer doing it this way (setting the EQ up front) rather than dialing down the bridge tone pot.

My goal is a warm bridge (with a full sound that hits hard) and a bright, articulate neck. I use pots and magnets to bring their EQ's closer. That makes it much easier to get one amp EQ setting that works great for both PU's. I have two 250K's on my bridge Seth, and two 500K's on my neck Seth. Sounds great to me.

But the majority of guys use 500K's on all their HB's and P-90's. Chosee whatever method works best for you.
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

"From all my SD experience..." I thought that covered it.
Yes, my ears are very frequency sensitive. But It's not something you notice as much unless you are playing with a drummer.
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

John E Rokker said:
"From all my SD experience..." I thought that covered it.
Yes, my ears are very frequency sensitive. But It's not something you notice as much unless you are playing with a drummer.
Click to expand...

Agree.....These test scenarios are me playing guitar by myself at home and just listening..."Critical listening"...With a band,everything changes totally!
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

GuitarDoc said:
I certainly agree. I definitely hear the difference between different cap values as the pot is rolled away from "10". I just don't hear it when the pot stays on "10".
Click to expand...

Again I'm not sure if how the guitars are wired,changes the load or the way the overall circuit sees resistance/capacitance? I definately hear more highend on my humbucking guitars using No Load 500k tone pots...Thats why I use them..It gives my guitars that little bit of extra "crispness"....Something my ears hear...But it's all good really!

You are familiar with a No Load tone pot and how it works I'm guessing and why it's used in the circuit....It's so the cap/pot resistance doesn't drain "all" highend to ground...Oddly enough Fender uses it and their guitars are bright to begin with...
 
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Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

Thanks for all the info. Yes I too feel most bridge pups in general are too bright. Two that aren't to me are a Rio Grande BBQ in a guitar I made and also a Carvin C22B which is in a Carvin Dc 127. I generally set my drive channel to where the neck pup is just out of mud territory. At that point is where I judge my bridge pup.

Being the Ibanez is a semi hollow I dont want to do this too often, though I'm getting pretty good at it.
 
Re: Seymour Duncan and .047 caps + a few more Q's

mikeyp said:
Thanks for all the info. Yes I too feel most bridge pups in general are too bright. Two that aren't to me are a Rio Grande BBQ in a guitar I made and also a Carvin C22B which is in a Carvin Dc 127. I generally set my drive channel to where the neck pup is just out of mud territory. At that point is where I judge my bridge pup.

Being the Ibanez is a semi hollow I dont want to do this too often, though I'm getting pretty good at it.
Click to expand...

Good to get some advance advice,but great to try stuff and learn to trust your own ears! What matters most in the end,is what "you" like.
 
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