Seymour Duncan mV Data

[IMENATOR]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

I think the mVolts readings should be delivered with a comprehensive explanation of what they mean and what they don't mean. I think this is table is great to choose a pickups to balance in volume when playing clean but in my humble and short experience a louder pickup may not translate to thicker or heavier sound when playing thru overdrive/distrotion, maybe that is what the EQ should help to?. Anyways I think this is a great thing you are doing, just be carefull to set the proper expectation on how to use it and it will be great.

Edit: I know people out there uses like an informa vocabulary for pickups and their characteristics. Maybe the more experienced people of the forum can put their own rating on growl, bite and stuff like that. After all we always go to the forum and ask for opinions on which pickup one has more bite, growl etc and I have seen a lot of threads where suggestions from the users lead to good results, as long as the asking person really knows what he wants of course. This may sound revolutionary but not so much if you think about it.

 

[Dark Order Lord]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Nazgul cracks me up. The fact that the BW measures as less than a distortion surprises me.

I'm not surpised, thats how the BW has more clarity than the sh6. I can actually crank my gain another notch on my Marshall TSL100 and still have clarity, where with sh6 it starts to loose it

 

[Johtosotku]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Interesting stuff, surely a good move to put this info out.

 

[Big Flannel]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Can we get some definitive answers as to how these comparisons were made? The numbers say one thing, but the perceived output of these pickups is contradictory to many of the readings listed.

 

[vinta9e]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

The numbers say one thing, but the perceived output of these pickups is contradictory to many of the readings listed.

Could it be a question of peak vs. RMS values, perhaps?

 

[vinta9e]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

The numbers say one thing, but the perceived output of these pickups is contradictory to many of the readings listed.

Could it be a question of peak vs. RMS values, perhaps?

 

[darthphineas]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

You might want to post this as a disclaimer on your site, because someone WILL compare the results to DiMarzio's...

most definitey.

when speaking to Cathy C. Duncan about this 2-1/2 years ago, the pickup selector is something she said that she felt was something Seymour Duncan led the industry in. she said something to the effect of that it was a tool that they had fallen behind on while competitors caught up and in some cases surpassed. so...although people have been pointing out the obvious comparison to the DiMarzio pickup picker, people will have to see how it pans out. maybe a beta version of the impending new site can be ran through a focus group for people to give a trial run for a proper shakedown.

 

[jeremy]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

the seth neck is louder than the seth bridge eh? and the full shred is the hottest pup Duncan makes?

 

[Masta' C]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

I love where this project is headed, but I'm scratching my head at many of the results as well. Perhaps there is an additional adjustment that needs to be applied?

If a model tends to spike in response at a particular frequency, it could cause the peak output to appear higher, while its perceived output would be much lower as a result of the reduced response across the rest of the frequency spectrum. This is where "tone curves" showing the frequency peaks and valleys would come in handy.

 

[mamm]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Perhaps there is an additional adjustment that needs to be applied?

Agreed.

May I humbly suggest that a RMS figure over a constant period of time (say, the first 1s or so after plucking the string) is way more representative of "volume" than a peak figure?

 

[DreX]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Frequency response curves are the only way you can make a valid comparison, because knowing what happens at any one point in the frequency / amplitude spectrum doesn't tell you anything about what's happening in the rest of the spectrum. The fact that people are already seeing counter intuitive values that don't match what they hear is evidence that the mV might not even be useful for the purpose of making rough guesses.

The peak resonance is a pretty good value, though, because one think you can (almost) assume is that the amplitude drops away either side of that peak value, and it really does give you a ball-park idea as to how a pickup will sound.

If you were to say "the output is X mV at frequency 1 kHz, and Y mV at it's peak resonance Z kHz", then that's really something, because then you have two plot points, and that will tell you if the pickup is bass, mid, or treble heavy, or relatively flat, or relatively peaky. You could draw a line between those two points, and super impose them, and easily see how numerous pickups compare, so if you're thinking, "I want a '59 with more mids" then it would be very easy to see which pickups differ from the '59 in that particular way.

 

[Farkus]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Even if it's all adjusted mV is a BETTER indicator of output, not the only one. I have a played a FSb and a JB in the bridge of the same guitar (FS replaced the JB) and my perception is the JB is hotter. But that can be a function of its eq as much as it measured output. So as surprising as the numbers are, I am sure there are reasonable explanations for it.

 

[Securb]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

I am having a lot of trouble using this pickup selector.

 

[Scott Olson]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Methodology for Obtaining Guitar Pickup Output Readings

Strum Testing, Guitar Pickups:
Equipment used:
• One Telecaster guitar modified with three cutouts to allow easy installation and removal of pickups to be tested. Installed on the guitar, just below the low side of the bridge is a custom-made, spring loaded, mechanical strum arm. The end of the arm is equipped with a clamp in which we installed a custom pick made from 0.004” tempered spring steel.
• One Agilent Infiniium Digital Storage Oscilloscope
• Various BNC cables, as required
Setup: Our custom built “Auto-Strum Guitar” is hooked up to the Agilent Infiniium Oscilloscope. The scope is set to measure the pickups output in volts RMS for a period of 50ms starting 50ms after the scope is triggered. Each pickup is loaded into a custom cut mounting plate which slides into place in the guitar. A steel dowel pin (Diameter .0935”) is then set on top of the pole pieces and the pickup is raised until the D and G strings just touch the dowel. At this time the dowel is removed and the system is ready for use.

Testing: The strings are depressed and the arm drawn back to its limit. Then the scope is armed and the strum arm released. 3 examples of each pickup model were obtained, and each of those samples was strummed 5 times. This data was averaged in order to obtain a nominal value.
Consistency Testing: At the beginning of testing, we reserved one APS-1 as a reference pickup. Before starting any testing, we carefully set up the reference pickup and took a series of output readings. We repeated this test each day and compared the output figures to the original data to insure that we were obtaining consistent results over the duration of the test.
Notes:
• All pickups were tested in the center position to provide consistent correlation between the outputs of neck and bridge models. If we had not done this, and tested neck pickups in the neck position and bridge pickups in the bridge position, the numbers obtained would have misled customers into believing that most neck pickups were hotter than most bridge pickups when they actually are not.

 

[Scott Olson]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

On a side note...I think there may be a typo on the TB-15 Alt 8 measurement compared to the SH-15 and also the two Jason Becker versions (TB and SH).

Let me follow-up with the engineering folks on those and will let you know.

 

[Scott Olson]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

I am having a lot of trouble using this pickup selector.

View attachment 56198

Are you using Internet Explore 3? The pickup selector only works if you click on it and play the opening riff to "Stairway to Heaven"

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

How about inviting Duncan Designed pickups to the party?

 

[Scott Olson]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

Ahh looks like the Engineering folks have an updated list, standby.

 

[Chris of Arabia]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

My guess on the values, as many have suggested, is that we are just seeing a peak reading at a particular frequency point in what each pickup puts out. I'd hazard a guess that what we percieve as a pickup being louder is actually the sum of all the energy a pickup puts out across a spectrum of frequencies, not just the frequency where it happens to hit its peak. I've no way of testing that, but there feels like there's a logic to it in there somewhere, much like voltage x amperage gives you watts

 

[jeremy]

Re: Seymour Duncan mV Data

I assumed that they were all tested in the same postion but not sure why the seth neck would have more juice than the seth bridge for example