Should I Buy A New Amp, Or Just A Cab?

[Megadeth420]

I have an Orange Micro Dark, and I realized by playing a show recently while on semi-high gain and full volume that I need something that can push more air. So I'm wondering whether I should buy something with higher wattage, or if having a bigger cab will be enough to make up for it. If I do need a higher wattage I will likely crash out on a Marshall Valvestate 8100.

 

[Aceman]

What, may I ask exactly, made you "realize" that you need to "push" more air?

Asking for a friend...

 

[Securb]

I would be curious as to what cab and speakers you are using. More efficient speakers will give more volume. However, when playing metal live with a drummer, 20-watts IMO is just not enough. I would go with the Valvestate. They are overlooked, underrated amazing amps. For these reasons, they can be found at great prices.

 

[Mincer]

Have any friends with a 4x12? If not, bring it to a store that has them. How many watts does a Micro Dark have? At a certain point, smaller amps can only push so much. But I would see how it sounds through a 4x12 before to spend the $ on another amp.

 

[jeremy]

the old valvestate are pretty sweet. a 20w ss amp is usually not enough to gig with unless you have efficient speakers. i gig with a 20w tube amp all the time, but its got a very efficient speaker. im also not playing metal

 

[Phantasmagoria]

New amp ....always


20 watts solid state just isn't going to cut it in a live gig situation w/ a drummer...especially for metal...

Valvestates are great and so are some others like Randall RG's & Peavey Transtubes... (XXL especially)

Or if you prefer to buy new. At 60 watts each these keep up with a loud drummer as well (w/ reasonably efficient speakers) & sound awesome for any kind of metal/hard rock..

I have a 120 W Laney Ironheart tube head as well as the IRF Dualtop SS and the tones are'nt world's apart ...the little guy can get really thick, deep & brutal as well...

 

[Megadeth420]

Thanks for the responses, I think I'll save up for the Valvestate if trying out a 4x12 cab doesn't help the situation of loudness.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

What speaker are you running it through? FWIW, more efficient speakers could also help. V30's are very noticeably louder than Greenbacks or T-75's, for example.

 

[jeremy]

correct, those vs cabs dont have great speakers. again, what speakers are you currently using?

 

[Securb]

I played my Orange Micro through a ton of different speaker configurations including many 4x12 cabs. It sounded loudest and best with my Celestion 1x15 cab. The amp always sounded amazing but there is no way in hell I could have gotten that amp over my drummer comfortably and cut through the mix even with a 4x12.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I don't think a 4x12 is much louder than a smaller cab. At least not multiple times. There is Newton's second law. Speakers cannot magically create more energy than they have put into them. Both a 1x12 and a 4x12 are getting the same 20W put into them. And speaker coupling only really occurs below 500Hz or so on guitar speaker cabs, so that means the bigger cab sounds fatter, but not louder. However, a 4x12 has a couple of the speakers closer to ear level, so that might help it be heard better.

What does sound louder is a 1x12 loaded with a Creamback H vs. a 1x12 loaded with a Creamback M, for example. Twice as loud, actually.

 

[Securb]

There is Newton's second law. Speakers cannot magically create more energy than they have put into them..

No but less efficient speakers can drain more energy thus all speakers will not project the same volume. A speaker with a higher sensitivity rating will produce more sound at a given power level. For instance, a speaker rated at 100 dB will sound louder than one rated at 95 dB when driven by the same amplifier. There are other factors also at play like cab design.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

No but less efficient speakers can drain more energy thus all speakers will not project the same volume. A speaker with a higher sensitivity rating will produce more sound at a given power level. For instance, a speaker rated at 100 dB will sound louder than one rated at 95 dB when driven by the same amplifier. There are other factors also at play like cab design.

Exactly.

 

[jeremy]

i find that cab design has more to do with tone/thickness/clarity than volume. speaker efficiency is key to volume

 

[Seashore]

I vote more powerful amp as well. Better to have the volume on hand and not need it than need it and not have it.

 

[jeremy]

yes and no, in this case i assume yes. when you have a master volume and want a gainy sound, more power is almost always better. in my case, i use nmv amps and i dont want too much volume for my blues rock wanking on gigs. if its too much amp, i have to use pedals for gain, and i try not to if i can

 

[Cynical]

Sounds like you need both.

 

[Hiwatts and Gibsons]

I have an Orange Micro Dark, and I realized by playing a show recently while on semi-high gain and full volume that I need something that can push more air. So I'm wondering whether I should buy something with higher wattage, or if having a bigger cab will be enough to make up for it. If I do need a higher wattage I will likely crash out on a Marshall Valvestate 8100.

if you really like the sound of the amp, then you could just use an ABY box in the loop and send the second output to another poweramp and cab. Or you could add a stereo fx pedal, and do the same. Might be a best of both worlds scenario in either case.

 

[Securb]

if you really like the sound of the amp, then you could just use an ABY box in the loop and send the second output to another poweramp and cab. Or you could add a stereo fx pedal, and do the same. Might be a best of both worlds scenario in either case.

Or go from the headphone out to a powered speaker.

 

[ehdwuld]

mic it for the FOH
set the speaker up to head/ear level for your monitor