JoeHammersmith
New member
What's your take on VHT's Sig:X line? What cabs work well with it for rock and metal? Thanks!
Sig:X anyone?
- Thread starter JoeHammersmith
- Start date
rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
I would love to play one but the only "official" dealer in England is 300 miles away so that won't happen soon.
From the clips I've heard, it has all of the tonal hallmarks of VHT (tight low-end, dry, organic overdrive, open sound, sparkling cleans etc). The Lead channel seems to be more gainy than the other VHT amps, but I haven't played 1 so how true that is, I'm not sure. It's hard to tell with YT clips and mp3's since you almost always get a compressed nasally sound whether the amp is or not.
The Rhythm Channel is pure VHT (medium gain and retaining all the afformentioned qualities), the Lead channel sounds like a slightly more "modern" version of the VHT tone. It's a KT88/6550 tube amp just like the Pittbull UL (obviously that's switchable to 6L6 if desired but I believe they come stocked with KT88- in the UK at least) & the Deliverence. I think some VHT fans billed it as a less pricey Ultra-Lead. Hopefully that's the case!
The 40w power option I believe adds more low-end looseness and a bit more of a "smooth" quality via a 5U4 rectifier tube, again, how loose I don't know but I doubt it'll be Recto/Uberschall level so I see that option as more of an enhancement of the low-end for guitars in standard, Eb, drop-D or drop-Db tuning. Players like Michael Angelo Batio use a loose amp for rhythm when in standard tuning. If the clips on You Tube are through the 40w setting then it's not loose at all. Machine-gun, palm-muted staccato riffs will be perfectly audible & clear through the low power option.
The number of permutations on the clean channel is what I'm impressed with the most. Here's the front panel: http://vhtamp.com/images/frontpanel.jpg
As for cabs, for metal, I really like the 212 Fat Bottom. I'm sure that'll be sufficient for gigging since the bigger venues should (And do in the UK) have a PA.
What's YOUR take on the Sig:X?
I would love to play one but the only "official" dealer in England is 300 miles away so that won't happen soon.
From the clips I've heard, it has all of the tonal hallmarks of VHT (tight low-end, dry, organic overdrive, open sound, sparkling cleans etc). The Lead channel seems to be more gainy than the other VHT amps, but I haven't played 1 so how true that is, I'm not sure. It's hard to tell with YT clips and mp3's since you almost always get a compressed nasally sound whether the amp is or not.
The Rhythm Channel is pure VHT (medium gain and retaining all the afformentioned qualities), the Lead channel sounds like a slightly more "modern" version of the VHT tone. It's a KT88/6550 tube amp just like the Pittbull UL (obviously that's switchable to 6L6 if desired but I believe they come stocked with KT88- in the UK at least) & the Deliverence. I think some VHT fans billed it as a less pricey Ultra-Lead. Hopefully that's the case!
The 40w power option I believe adds more low-end looseness and a bit more of a "smooth" quality via a 5U4 rectifier tube, again, how loose I don't know but I doubt it'll be Recto/Uberschall level so I see that option as more of an enhancement of the low-end for guitars in standard, Eb, drop-D or drop-Db tuning. Players like Michael Angelo Batio use a loose amp for rhythm when in standard tuning. If the clips on You Tube are through the 40w setting then it's not loose at all. Machine-gun, palm-muted staccato riffs will be perfectly audible & clear through the low power option.
The number of permutations on the clean channel is what I'm impressed with the most. Here's the front panel: http://vhtamp.com/images/frontpanel.jpg
As for cabs, for metal, I really like the 212 Fat Bottom. I'm sure that'll be sufficient for gigging since the bigger venues should (And do in the UK) have a PA.
What's YOUR take on the Sig:X?
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the guy who invented fire
Fuzzy. Guitars
Re: Sig:X anyone?
I've not tried a Sig X yet but the sound clips I have heard are impressive!
VHT is the last word IMO in high gain channel switchers so I have high hopes!
I've not tried a Sig X yet but the sound clips I have heard are impressive!
VHT is the last word IMO in high gain channel switchers so I have high hopes!
JoeHammersmith
New member
Re: Sig:X anyone?
I too have high hopes Mr. Fire. I can't say I've ever really heard a bad thing about them other than complaints about the price tag. But I think those were generally aimed at the UL line.
The youtube clips have got me salivating, but like you said Rivera, it's youtube and not real life. Unfortunately, right now the closest for me is around 700 miles away. Based on the youtube clips, the rhythm channel sounds amazing and given all the options for gain setting and the like, one could cover a lot of territory and sound great at the same time. The lead channel does sound quite tight and clear, which is something I want in an amp, but not the only thing. I like having usable cleans as well and as far as I can tell, the Sig:X has those as well. I think you're right Rivera that it probably won't own the Uberschall or Recto in the metal department, but I'm sure it'll do the job just fine. I've heard also that it doesn't compress very much or sound like a can of bees under high gain and I like that fact a lot. I don't believe I'll cranking the gain all way anyway. Man, the front panel looks superb!
One thing that I did hear was that a lot cabs don't sound all that great with VHT's, v30 loaded cabs especially. I've also heard that the Deliverance cab is much more open and loose vs. the fatbottom. It would be cool to hear a A/B of those two cabs.
I too have high hopes Mr. Fire. I can't say I've ever really heard a bad thing about them other than complaints about the price tag. But I think those were generally aimed at the UL line.
The youtube clips have got me salivating, but like you said Rivera, it's youtube and not real life. Unfortunately, right now the closest for me is around 700 miles away. Based on the youtube clips, the rhythm channel sounds amazing and given all the options for gain setting and the like, one could cover a lot of territory and sound great at the same time. The lead channel does sound quite tight and clear, which is something I want in an amp, but not the only thing. I like having usable cleans as well and as far as I can tell, the Sig:X has those as well. I think you're right Rivera that it probably won't own the Uberschall or Recto in the metal department, but I'm sure it'll do the job just fine. I've heard also that it doesn't compress very much or sound like a can of bees under high gain and I like that fact a lot. I don't believe I'll cranking the gain all way anyway. Man, the front panel looks superb!
One thing that I did hear was that a lot cabs don't sound all that great with VHT's, v30 loaded cabs especially. I've also heard that the Deliverance cab is much more open and loose vs. the fatbottom. It would be cool to hear a A/B of those two cabs.
rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
I actually meant I don't think the tone on the 40w setting will be like the recto (even thought it uses a rectifier tube). I doubt it'll have the loose low-end the 2 amps I mentioned have and I actually prefer a very tight amp.
But a touch of looseness on the low-end can add to the "size" of the bass for a player who's guitar is in standard tuning.
I'd really need to try a Sig:X on the 40w setting using my 6-string in Drop-B to see how much low-end looseness the amp has, but If I were a betting man, I'd say it'd be around half that of the Solo Recto heads & Uberschall.
Yep that's true. Even with the gain on 10 on VHT's, the sound is still organic and open. Compare it to an ENGL which sounds compressed to hell on a gain rating of 3 and there's the difference.
There's no buzz/fizz at all barring what you'd expect from a tube amp on VHT's. Hopefully the Sig:X is the same.
I have the gain around 6-7 on VHT's which is more than enough. You really need to be able to play to sound good through a VHT. There isn't any excess gain to help your legato so most metal hacks would dislike VHT's for lead.
I'm a fan of keeping the cab uniform to the head provided the construction & speakers are top quality.
I don't see any reason to use a non-VHT cab with the head tbh, since they are as good as any other cab.
The fatbottom gives a huge but tight bass response, so that'll be ideal for metal rhythm playing IMHO.
I actually meant I don't think the tone on the 40w setting will be like the recto (even thought it uses a rectifier tube). I doubt it'll have the loose low-end the 2 amps I mentioned have and I actually prefer a very tight amp.
But a touch of looseness on the low-end can add to the "size" of the bass for a player who's guitar is in standard tuning.
I'd really need to try a Sig:X on the 40w setting using my 6-string in Drop-B to see how much low-end looseness the amp has, but If I were a betting man, I'd say it'd be around half that of the Solo Recto heads & Uberschall.
Yep that's true. Even with the gain on 10 on VHT's, the sound is still organic and open. Compare it to an ENGL which sounds compressed to hell on a gain rating of 3 and there's the difference.
There's no buzz/fizz at all barring what you'd expect from a tube amp on VHT's. Hopefully the Sig:X is the same.
I have the gain around 6-7 on VHT's which is more than enough. You really need to be able to play to sound good through a VHT. There isn't any excess gain to help your legato so most metal hacks would dislike VHT's for lead.
I'm a fan of keeping the cab uniform to the head provided the construction & speakers are top quality.
I don't see any reason to use a non-VHT cab with the head tbh, since they are as good as any other cab.
The fatbottom gives a huge but tight bass response, so that'll be ideal for metal rhythm playing IMHO.
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JoeHammersmith
New member
Re: Sig:X anyone?
aahhh... I see what you're saying about the looseness, Rivera. If you ever make the trip to try one out, I fully expect a review.
How does the fatbottom handle clean and slightly dirty sounds?
aahhh... I see what you're saying about the looseness, Rivera. If you ever make the trip to try one out, I fully expect a review.
How does the fatbottom handle clean and slightly dirty sounds?
rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
Ha ha, Ok I will do. If I go to play 1, I'll probably camp in the shop since they have the Deliverence, Pittbull UL, Pittbull CL, Pittbull CLX as well as the Sig X plus a variety of other great amps.
I love the cleans through the P50E speakers!
If you didn't already know, the P50E are designed by the people @ VHT and built by Eminence so they aren't "stock" speakers at all.
Normally I disregard the buffed-up descriptions from the manufacturer, but this description is pretty much what I got independently:
"This 2 x 12" cabinet features front-mounted Pittbull P50E speakers for wide dispersion with the maximum in tight low end, smooth midrange, and crisp highs. The warm distortion character of the P50E blends classic British crunch with full-bodied American punch."
The mids (although smooth) are very prominent but not overbearing. It's a fat sound, but the high and low-end are there too. The P50E's really are 1 of the best alround speakers I've played.
Will you find better speakers for specific genres? Of course, but will you find a speaker that genuinely ranges from beautiful cleans to death metal rhythm? I doubt it.
Put it this way, If & when I buy a VHT 100w head & cab, I'd keep the P50E speakers and I'm very picky about tone.
But, tone is SO opinion based that you may disagree with everything I've said in this thread so you'd need to.
I'd love to hear an A-B with the VHT 412 Fatbottom & 412 Deliverance. It's interesting if there is a noticable difference since both have the P50E speakers in. The VHT comments on the D cab- "Deliverance series cabinets are unique in design and construction and will enhance the “wood” of the guitar tone and emphasize cabinet resonance, speaker breakup and amplifier saturation while maintaining definition on low notes".
I haven't even seen a Deliverance cab so I wouldn't know but the majoirty of VHT users know their **** when it comes to VHT so the Deliverance probably is a bit more open. Having said that, you still get a VERY open (but tight) sound from any VHT head-cabinet combination.
* BTW- This thread isn't helping my GASing for a VHT!!! Lol.
- Steve
Ha ha, Ok I will do. If I go to play 1, I'll probably camp in the shop since they have the Deliverence, Pittbull UL, Pittbull CL, Pittbull CLX as well as the Sig X plus a variety of other great amps.
I love the cleans through the P50E speakers!
If you didn't already know, the P50E are designed by the people @ VHT and built by Eminence so they aren't "stock" speakers at all.
Normally I disregard the buffed-up descriptions from the manufacturer, but this description is pretty much what I got independently:
"This 2 x 12" cabinet features front-mounted Pittbull P50E speakers for wide dispersion with the maximum in tight low end, smooth midrange, and crisp highs. The warm distortion character of the P50E blends classic British crunch with full-bodied American punch."
The mids (although smooth) are very prominent but not overbearing. It's a fat sound, but the high and low-end are there too. The P50E's really are 1 of the best alround speakers I've played.
Will you find better speakers for specific genres? Of course, but will you find a speaker that genuinely ranges from beautiful cleans to death metal rhythm? I doubt it.
Put it this way, If & when I buy a VHT 100w head & cab, I'd keep the P50E speakers and I'm very picky about tone.
But, tone is SO opinion based that you may disagree with everything I've said in this thread so you'd need to.
I'd love to hear an A-B with the VHT 412 Fatbottom & 412 Deliverance. It's interesting if there is a noticable difference since both have the P50E speakers in. The VHT comments on the D cab- "Deliverance series cabinets are unique in design and construction and will enhance the “wood” of the guitar tone and emphasize cabinet resonance, speaker breakup and amplifier saturation while maintaining definition on low notes".
I haven't even seen a Deliverance cab so I wouldn't know but the majoirty of VHT users know their **** when it comes to VHT so the Deliverance probably is a bit more open. Having said that, you still get a VERY open (but tight) sound from any VHT head-cabinet combination.
* BTW- This thread isn't helping my GASing for a VHT!!! Lol.
- Steve
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JoeHammersmith
New member
Re: Sig:X anyone?
haha, yeah I know about the gas. Sorry about feeding yours. I try to remind myself that what I have is good enough for the time being and that a lot of people in the world don't have anything. I'd rather play through less desirable gear than not at all. Not everyone will agree with that, but that's alright.
Thanks for your take on the Fatbottom's cleans! They sound like they'll be pretty sweet. And I love that they're supposed to tight sounding. I think unless the D-Cab sounds better when I get to try them out, I'll be grabbing a Fatbottom 2-12 to start out with when the time and the $ comes.
haha, yeah I know about the gas. Sorry about feeding yours. I try to remind myself that what I have is good enough for the time being and that a lot of people in the world don't have anything. I'd rather play through less desirable gear than not at all. Not everyone will agree with that, but that's alright.
Thanks for your take on the Fatbottom's cleans! They sound like they'll be pretty sweet. And I love that they're supposed to tight sounding. I think unless the D-Cab sounds better when I get to try them out, I'll be grabbing a Fatbottom 2-12 to start out with when the time and the $ comes.
rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
You could always have a full stack with the 412 Deliverance AND Fatbottom cabs. That'd probably pwn your whole street/block. If you DO go for that option, invite me round & we'll watch your neighbours squirm!!!! Muhahahahahahaha.
If you can find a cab which has Eminence V128 speakers in, that'll give you a rough idea since (according to Eminence bods) that speaker is the closest in tone to the P50E (but with a looser low end).
Many VHT experts would say the P50E's go hand-in-hand with VHT, but I've heard clips of V30's in a VHT cab which sound great too (don't like the V30 cleans tbph).
I'm not an expert by any stretch, but I liked the P50E's a lot.
As for my GASing, telling yourself what you've got is good enough doesn't bear any weight when you own a crappy MG30dfx like I do. Lol. Thank god I have friends with great gear (just wait til they go on holiday and leave the key under the flowerpot......).
You could always have a full stack with the 412 Deliverance AND Fatbottom cabs. That'd probably pwn your whole street/block. If you DO go for that option, invite me round & we'll watch your neighbours squirm!!!! Muhahahahahahaha.
If you can find a cab which has Eminence V128 speakers in, that'll give you a rough idea since (according to Eminence bods) that speaker is the closest in tone to the P50E (but with a looser low end).
Many VHT experts would say the P50E's go hand-in-hand with VHT, but I've heard clips of V30's in a VHT cab which sound great too (don't like the V30 cleans tbph).
I'm not an expert by any stretch, but I liked the P50E's a lot.
As for my GASing, telling yourself what you've got is good enough doesn't bear any weight when you own a crappy MG30dfx like I do. Lol. Thank god I have friends with great gear (just wait til they go on holiday and leave the key under the flowerpot......).
JoeHammersmith
New member
Re: Sig:X anyone?
Yeah man, for sure. You'll probably shred circles around me though...
I've heard also that Celestion G12H30's are in the neighborhood of the P50E's, and that V30's are also good with VHT's. Although some have said they hate the midrange that comes out with that setup. I liked the V30's in my old roomate's Orange Cab along with his Rockverb 50, but that rig isn't what I'm going for. Hopefully when I get closer to a dealer (I'm moving to the U.S.) they'll have a few other decent cabs in stock with VHT's so I can get a better opinion on things.
Yeah man, for sure. You'll probably shred circles around me though...
I've heard also that Celestion G12H30's are in the neighborhood of the P50E's, and that V30's are also good with VHT's. Although some have said they hate the midrange that comes out with that setup. I liked the V30's in my old roomate's Orange Cab along with his Rockverb 50, but that rig isn't what I'm going for. Hopefully when I get closer to a dealer (I'm moving to the U.S.) they'll have a few other decent cabs in stock with VHT's so I can get a better opinion on things.
Hot _Grits
Buttery Toneologist
Re: Sig:X anyone?
Well, I've actually played one. A customer dropped a head and 2x12 off for us to try out, and we gave it a good run alongside some other hgh gain channel switchers.
Lots of tones in that amp, for sure. It can certainly do that very tight VHT thing, but also a good classic mid-gain and clean. I started to tire of it after playing it for a while, though. I found there was something a bit fatiguing in the voicing of the amp that wasn't for me.
I think it would be a good choice for someone who really likes the VHT metal tone, and would like a bunch of other decent (if not spectacular) tones under the hood. For my money and tastes it doesn't touch Bogner or Diezel for being able to do more than one tone really well, but those amps don't sound like VHT, so if that's your bag, it's a cool amp at a good price.
Well, I've actually played one. A customer dropped a head and 2x12 off for us to try out, and we gave it a good run alongside some other hgh gain channel switchers.
Lots of tones in that amp, for sure. It can certainly do that very tight VHT thing, but also a good classic mid-gain and clean. I started to tire of it after playing it for a while, though. I found there was something a bit fatiguing in the voicing of the amp that wasn't for me.
I think it would be a good choice for someone who really likes the VHT metal tone, and would like a bunch of other decent (if not spectacular) tones under the hood. For my money and tastes it doesn't touch Bogner or Diezel for being able to do more than one tone really well, but those amps don't sound like VHT, so if that's your bag, it's a cool amp at a good price.
PVFan
Fudgeitallologist
Re: Sig:X anyone?
I played one too, but only to test out a guitar. I didn't try all the switches, and many didn't seem to do much; I moved right past the controls for landing gear, auxilliary fuel tanks, primary coolant rate, fuel rod extraction, prostate exam, gyroscopic precession, magic elf charisma, spell of disenchanting, and like most VHTs, I couldn't even find the switch for warm fat lead tone. I did the flip the switch labeled "wood" but when I looked down, it didn't seem to do anything. Not even a little Rivera Chubster. It sounded like a VHT though.
But, but, but!
Hats off to Steve Fryette. I know he put a lot into this. Full power/~half power per channel alone is a feat. I give him much props, kudos, and an A for effort in attempting to make a FAR more affordable amp than the rest of the entire VHT line, and yet he also attempted to make it as versatile as possible (lots and lots of switches). I honestly don't know how well he succeeded as I didn't give it a real test and I didn't get super loud with it. I noticed it had more gain than a CL 50, but probably not as much as a UL. VHT cleans are underrated; even on a UL they are magnificent. They seemed close on this one. You never hear about that because it's metal-folk that tend to buy VHTs and rave about their metallishness.
Mr. Fryette's offering does my heart good. I should get in there and really check it out, it's the least I can do for him. Who knows? I may end up loving it and buying it after I heal up from my boutique cult deprogramming, from which I'm still quite sore. But I congratulate him, at least on what he tried to do with this model. I hope he continues pursuing the idea of affordability (and Reinhold, Peter, and Mike catch on). Economic theory aside.
I played one too, but only to test out a guitar. I didn't try all the switches, and many didn't seem to do much; I moved right past the controls for landing gear, auxilliary fuel tanks, primary coolant rate, fuel rod extraction, prostate exam, gyroscopic precession, magic elf charisma, spell of disenchanting, and like most VHTs, I couldn't even find the switch for warm fat lead tone. I did the flip the switch labeled "wood" but when I looked down, it didn't seem to do anything. Not even a little Rivera Chubster. It sounded like a VHT though.
But, but, but!
Hats off to Steve Fryette. I know he put a lot into this. Full power/~half power per channel alone is a feat. I give him much props, kudos, and an A for effort in attempting to make a FAR more affordable amp than the rest of the entire VHT line, and yet he also attempted to make it as versatile as possible (lots and lots of switches). I honestly don't know how well he succeeded as I didn't give it a real test and I didn't get super loud with it. I noticed it had more gain than a CL 50, but probably not as much as a UL. VHT cleans are underrated; even on a UL they are magnificent. They seemed close on this one. You never hear about that because it's metal-folk that tend to buy VHTs and rave about their metallishness.
Mr. Fryette's offering does my heart good. I should get in there and really check it out, it's the least I can do for him. Who knows? I may end up loving it and buying it after I heal up from my boutique cult deprogramming, from which I'm still quite sore. But I congratulate him, at least on what he tried to do with this model. I hope he continues pursuing the idea of affordability (and Reinhold, Peter, and Mike catch on). Economic theory aside.
rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
G12H-30 & V30 speakers seem to be the 2 which people change the P50E's for the most.
I haven't tried a VHT cab with either of those 2 speakers in but did try a cab (Mesa Recto 212) with V30's in WITH the UL head and it sounded very good for metal; but as I said earlier, I don't really like the V30 cleans.
You'll probably find a place in the US which have the 212 & 412 variants of both the Deliverance and Fatbottom cab. Ironically (since it's the only VHT cab I tried) you have to special order a 212 Fatbottom from the only official UK dealer. Lol.
G12H-30 & V30 speakers seem to be the 2 which people change the P50E's for the most.
I haven't tried a VHT cab with either of those 2 speakers in but did try a cab (Mesa Recto 212) with V30's in WITH the UL head and it sounded very good for metal; but as I said earlier, I don't really like the V30 cleans.
You'll probably find a place in the US which have the 212 & 412 variants of both the Deliverance and Fatbottom cab. Ironically (since it's the only VHT cab I tried) you have to special order a 212 Fatbottom from the only official UK dealer. Lol.
rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
The amp definitely isn't for you- send it to me! Lol.
Out of interest which amps did you compare it with? Were you able to compare against an Ultra-Lead (w/KT88's not 6L6 or 6550) and/or Deliverance 120?
I agree VHT does 1 main tone and 1 tone well (which is present in every amp of theirs). It's a "marmite" amp for the majority of people (marmite is a food product in the uk with the slogan "You either love it or hate it"). I've seen people say it's the best amp company ever, others saying it's the most over-rated so......
The amp definitely isn't for you- send it to me! Lol.
Out of interest which amps did you compare it with? Were you able to compare against an Ultra-Lead (w/KT88's not 6L6 or 6550) and/or Deliverance 120?
I agree VHT does 1 main tone and 1 tone well (which is present in every amp of theirs). It's a "marmite" amp for the majority of people (marmite is a food product in the uk with the slogan "You either love it or hate it"). I've seen people say it's the best amp company ever, others saying it's the most over-rated so......
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rivera213
Guest
Re: Sig:X anyone?
+ 1.
Love the VHT cleans.
I've read that a few Sig:X users think the cleans on that amp could be the best in the whole VHT line.
Unfortunetly that is true.
I also love the lead tone. You really need to be able to play otherwise you sound like crap. It's an acquired taste, but I love it (as you can tell).
+ 1.
Love the VHT cleans.
I've read that a few Sig:X users think the cleans on that amp could be the best in the whole VHT line.
Unfortunetly that is true.
I also love the lead tone. You really need to be able to play otherwise you sound like crap. It's an acquired taste, but I love it (as you can tell).
Hot _Grits
Buttery Toneologist
Re: Sig:X anyone?
We compared it to a Diezel VH4, an XTC101B and an Uber.
Bear in mind that I'm not an extreme metal guy by trade. I know how to get those kinds of tones in a 'ballpark' sense, but it's not my bag.
The Sig didn't thrill me on clean/crunch/old school high gain, but it certainly had that VHT modern high gain tone.
We compared it to a Diezel VH4, an XTC101B and an Uber.
Bear in mind that I'm not an extreme metal guy by trade. I know how to get those kinds of tones in a 'ballpark' sense, but it's not my bag.
The Sig didn't thrill me on clean/crunch/old school high gain, but it certainly had that VHT modern high gain tone.
Hot _Grits
Buttery Toneologist
JoeHammersmith
New member
Re: Sig:X anyone?
How loud did you crank it Hot Grits? Or did you even have to? And thanks for your take on it!
How loud did you crank it Hot Grits? Or did you even have to? And thanks for your take on it!
Hot _Grits
Buttery Toneologist
Re: Sig:X anyone?
We cranked it on both 40w and full settings. We always test at battle volume, probably louder than most master volume amp users will run theirs, if what I see at gigs tells me.
We cranked it on both 40w and full settings. We always test at battle volume, probably louder than most master volume amp users will run theirs, if what I see at gigs tells me.