so my friend wants a palomino

[drew_half_empty]

and we're in a band together & i told him he should get something 100 watts to match the bassman (or atleast come close), and he really likes the crate palominos, but hasn't had a chance to crank one of the 30 watt heads, so neither of us knows how loud it is. He plans to crank it one day before he pulls the trigger, but only combo amps are in town.

so here's the question - it's 30 watts class A, but is it as loud as say, a vox ac30? Or is it more like a class AB 30 watts? Cause if it's ac30 loud then i can give him my seal of approval, and yanno, can't buy an amp without consulting your friends

thanks

oh, and on a side note - i won the traynor bassmaster on ebay. Thank god for paypal credit, 3 months no interest!

 

[jeremy]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

its all about the speakers, with the right speakers 30w is plenty. my 22w deluxe reverb is loud as hell

 

[bungalowbill]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

I have a V-32 with a g12H30 and it is plenty loud.

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

i have a 4x12 with emi wizards which are loud as hell so i don't think that'd work

but no one can compare the volume to an ac30? or even a twin?

 

[That90'sGuy]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

The V32 Palomino can get plenty loud. If your friend wants clean headroom at really high gig volumes, he'll have to know how to ride the volume control on his guitar (it has more clean headroom than most of the 30w I've played, but due to its wattage, it will inevitably breakup at high volumes).

Vox AC30s IIRC are a bit louder, but I haven't really pushed an AC30 in a long time, so I'm not sure how good the clean headroom is (I want to say it's good just based on how loud they get).

Drew, I hope you're not going to running your 100w wide open because your buddy will get buried with a 30w amp. 30w can really be opened up at gig volumes and can sound glorious, but you need decibel conscientious bandmates to make it work.

 

[jeremy]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

part of the reason old ac30's and lots of new ones are so loud is two 12" alnico blues = LOUD
36w goes further than ya think.

i dont think the crate will get that loud even with a red fang

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

really? the spl on those blues isn't that impressive

must be how they're voiced or something

as far as burying him, well, that's part of the reason i picked up the traynor, cause his head now is 50 watts, but we both agreed for larger venues it'd be nice if we could both run 100 watters

this class A thing is confusing now, i've read tons of tech articles that say class A amps can be 2-3 times louder than class AB ones with the same wattage, but apparently it doesn't apply to all class A amps, just ones made my orange, mesa & vox

i don't suppose there's a simple mod you can do to get that loud as hell class A 30 watts?

 

[bungalowbill]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

really? the spl on those blues isn't that impressive

must be how they're voiced or something

as far as burying him, well, that's part of the reason i picked up the traynor, cause his head now is 50 watts, but we both agreed for larger venues it'd be nice if we could both run 100 watters

this class A thing is confusing now, i've read tons of tech articles that say class A amps can be 2-3 times louder than class AB ones with the same wattage, but apparently it doesn't apply to all class A amps, just ones made my orange, mesa & vox

i don't suppose there's a simple mod you can do to get that loud as hell class A 30 watts?

Drew, Do you guys have to be THAT loud? Are you guys lacking PA? Take care of those ears, bro.

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

yes, we play loud music in hole in the wall venues with PA's just loud enough for vocals

I'm not disrespecting anyone but i think the majority of you older guys have forgotten what it's like to be a young musician in a rock band. You don't play the nicer venues in town where people talk & drink during your set, you play the DIY venues that you can rent for $100, and all the talking & drinking happens between sets or outside of the venue

the people go there to see the bands, and if you play anything harder than tom petty you better have the wattage to back it up or people complain cause you're too quiet

the only exception is the tiny buildings where 100 watters sound like white noise, in which case you can either turn down or have a 50 watt head, but that same 50 watter won't cut it in the bigger venue

 

[bungalowbill]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

yes, we play loud music in hole in the wall venues with PA's just loud enough for vocals

I'm not disrespecting anyone but i think the majority of you older guys have forgotten what it's like to be a young musician in a rock band. You don't play the nicer venues in town where people talk & drink during your set, you play the DIY venues that you can rent for $100, and all the talking & drinking happens between sets or outside of the venue

the people go there to see the bands, and if you play anything harder than tom petty you better have the wattage to back it up or people complain cause you're too quiet

the only exception is the tiny buildings where 100 watters sound like white noise, in which case you can either turn down or have a 50 watt head, but that same 50 watter won't cut it in the bigger venue

I am an "Older Guy" and we are by no means quiet......we do play through smaller amps and use the PA to blast out front. We all have tinnitus from doing gigs the way you are doing now......all I'm saying is watch your ears bro.....take good care of them, you only get one set.

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

I'll get some plugs

 

[bungalowbill]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

I'll get some plugs

Very cool

 

[thespricket]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

im sure one of those would be fine in any band situation.

 

[That90'sGuy]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

Drew, I play put fairly often with a 40W Bandmaster, and it has never been too quiet at all. In fact a lot of the venues I play at, get pissed off if I put it past 4. I had to get a pedal to get some grit out of the amp without the sound man screaming at me.

Let's put it this way, I had to kick a guy in the chest last weekend during the song. I'm playing those down and dirty places that you're talking about.

+1.

With the gigs I play, I have my master set at 10 o'clock and my preamp volume set at 10 o'clock on my 80w amp (and yes, it's LOUD at that point). The only time you really would ever want anything close to 100w is if you want pure clean headroom for a large outdoor venue unmic'd. Anything indoors would be simply crushing at that wattage (and at that point you'll lose the audience, so it's counter productive).

30w are the bare minimum I'd personally use live due to my experiences of how they sit in the band mix. 15w and lower are fine if you trust the soundman and can have everything mic'd, but realistically, most people probably won't have the luxury of playing those kind of venues. From the sounds of things Drew, your bandmate shouldn't be looking at 30 watters.

Vox AC-30s have been proven to not be Class A, but they must be doing something to make them as loud as they are (and the Vox AC30CCs I've heard these days without the Blues are loud as heck too).

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

almost everyone uses 100 watters, that's just how we do things

i guess a palomino won't cut it

 

[marvar]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

I just got through A/B ing my old Crate VC20 (class A) with my Marshall JCM600 (60 watts class A/B) and honestly, the Crate kept up with the Marshall in every respect. Pretty good for 20 watts. I swear, if the Palamino sounds as sweet as my VC20, I might have to sell the Marshall and get one!
Of course, I have played around with the tubes in the VC20, and changed the speaker to a G12H30, but bang for the buck, I'm really impressed.

 

[thespricket]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

Still though, 100 Watts for indoor gigs in buildings smaller than Carnagie seems overkill.

i agree, smaller amps preserve the delicate tones larger amps turn into mush. Any gig that will be too large for a 112 amp is more than likely going to have a decent PA that you could mic your amp into.

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

none of the venues we play have the ability to mic venues. Yes those venues actually exist, one happens to be a huge skate park

I'm just gonna stick that in my sig

 

[drew_half_empty]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

i don't gig THAT much

and you gotta understand, it's wichita. If you don't play blues or country you don't exactly make a ton

 

[firebirdV]

Re: so my friend wants a palomino

The one thing that puzzles me is that I always believed that class ab amps were generally louder and generally had alot more headroom.