Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

[_actual time_]

(hello, all. long-time reader; first-time poster. but i've been on rig-talk for years and sevenstring.org for ages--i organized the group buy there years ago for A5 and A8 magnets in 7-string sizes. :headbang: )


i'm having trouble finding the right pickup for one of my guitars.

it's mahogany, with a thin satin finish. maple neck, ebony board, locking trem. pickups direct-mounted.

i play mostly classic rock and hard rock, power metal, prog metal. through a Bogner and a Mesa Mark. i like my high gain sounds with thick mids and a little bit of squish, but lows that aren't boomy; my medium gain sounds thick with a bit more squish.

the guitar sounds really good with a Custom 8--thick mids, fat, a nice bit of squish or sag, good lows that aren't stiff or boomy. but there's no upper-mids bite or cut to it. it gets lost in the mix.

i've also tried a Custom (too stiff in the mids), Custom 5 (too loose), and Full Shred (too round and mid-heavy; less highs than the Custom 8).

for reference, through those same amps, i get just as thick a sound but with great upper-mids bite from a Custom 5 in my Dean (mahogany w/ maple cap; tune-o-matic bridge), and my Ibanez (mahogany w/ maple cap; locking trem) with a custom Dimarzio ~20 kohms modded with an A8 magnet.

what should i try next?

thanks!

 

[CTN]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

Interesting that you found the Full Shred too round/mid heavy and lacking in highs. In my experience it's got lots of highs and it supremely tight in the lows.

Have you tried a JB?

 

[Frogman]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

Before swapping pups, there's a few things I'd try first:

-Hex screws

-1meg vol pot

-Unoriented ceramic

 

[_actual time_]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

Before swapping pups, there's a few things I'd try first:
-Hex screws
-1meg vol pot
-Unoriented ceramic

thanks very much.

i have the Full Shred in there now. i will at some point test the C8 wired straight to the output jack, to test how a higher resistance vol pot might sound, but i'm guessing that won't be enough more bite.

hex screws would look ugly to me next to slug poles, but if i get desperate...

Interesting that you found the Full Shred too round/mid heavy and lacking in highs. In my experience it's got lots of highs and it supremely tight in the lows.

Have you tried a JB?

i totally agree--the roundess and weak highs of the FS really surprised me. it was somewhat tight in the lows, especially on high gain sounds, but stiff.

i don't know if there's any point in trying an A8 magnet in the FS. the FS sound in this guitar seems so far off from what i'm aiming for that i don't know if just a magnet swap would get it there.

i haven't tried a JB yet. i've read here that sometimes in mahogany it's great and sometimes it's crap. i would be happy to change the magnet to A8, so i wouldn't mind taking the risk that the stock JB might sound like crap.

 

[CTN]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

yeah, i'm not too big a fan of the JB in mahogany, but other people are. The full shred actually has a very similar wind to the custom series, believe it or not, but the double rows of hex polepieces gives it much more tight/bright character than it's nearest relative, the Custom 5 - same magnet, similar wind, different polepieces.

What guitar is it exactly?

 

[_actual time_]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

The full shred actually has a very similar wind to the custom series, believe it or not, but the double rows of hex polepieces gives it much more tight/bright character than it's nearest relative, the Custom 5 - same magnet, similar wind, different polepieces.

What guitar is it exactly?

yeah, that's why i was surprised at so much difference in sound between my C8 and the FS.

the guitar is a clone of an Ibanez S that i built myself. the body is Honduran mahogany, thicker than a normal Ibanez S; standard Strat thickness.

 

[elelpe]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

Have you tried Distortion? I'm curious because some players with musical preferences like yours usually start with that pickup.

 

[CTN]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

I'd give the JB a shot, or the Distortion. JB especially tends to have a bit of squish in the lows and a lot of upper mid presence. Same for the Distortion, but the squish is more like a tight, solid thump.

 

[_actual time_]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

I'd give the JB a shot, or the Distortion. JB especially tends to have a bit of squish in the lows and a lot of upper mid presence. Same for the Distortion, but the squish is more like a tight, solid thump.

i haven't tried the Distortion because i really like the Alnico squish, even if it's A8 and how it has less squish than all the other Alnicos. and the DIstortion magnet is a different size, IIRC, so i couldn't easily swap an A8 into it.

JB may be the one to try. especially because i could swap an A8 into it if it had too much squish and not enough tightness.

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

It's easy to swap in an A8 into the Distortion. No big deal at all. That may get you the bite that you're looking for.

But since you already like the sound of the C8, the first thing I would do is to take a look at replacing your pots. If you currently have 250k pots, changing them to 500k will probably get you there. If you currently have 500k pots, change them to 1 meg pots. The difference won't be as great as going from 250k to 500k, but it will help. It is a quick, easy, cheap thing to try before investing in a new pup. Or just bypass the pots and wire the pup directly to the jack to see if you will get enough bite from just a change in the pots.

 

[_actual time_]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

... If you currently have 500k pots, change them to 1 meg pots. The difference won't be as great as going from 250k to 500k, but it will help. ... Or just bypass the pots and wire the pup directly to the jack to see if you will get enough bite from just a change in the pots.

yep, the wiring to the output jack i will definitely try, once i get the pickup back in that guitar.

the pots are 500k. i've had pickups wired directly to the output jack before, for quick tests, and i haven't noticed a ton of difference. but i'll certainly try it.

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

A little more presence on the amp EQ wouldn't hurt either.

 

[surface54]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

id say distortion or DD8

 

[LatsMcGee]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

I would try the large ceramic mag in the custom before I did anything....

 

[darthphineas]

Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

If you want to stick with an A8 mag, go with the Alternative-8. I have had luck with it brightening up a dark guitar.

Or the Hybrid, but it won't have the drive you're getting from the C8




Sent from my armored space station using Tapatalk on iPad

 

[Amplifuzz]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

i like my high gain sounds with thick mids and a little bit of squish, but lows that aren't boomy; my medium gain sounds thick with a bit more squish.

what should i try next?

thanks!

A tubescreamer set as a booster, or any other kind of bass cut tweak between guitar and amp. Seriously, that's the ticket if you like a pickup just fine but think it's too boomy, especially on a 7 string or when tuning lower than C.

Otherwise it seems you've sort of exhausted your Duncan options (apart from the Distortion): Dimarzio has good 7 string offerings but they all seem to be ceramic-based. I'd try something off the Bare Knuckle line.

 

[_actual time_]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

A tubescreamer set as a booster, or any other kind of bass cut tweak between guitar and amp. Seriously, that's the ticket if you like a pickup just fine but think it's too boomy, especially on a 7 string or when tuning lower than C.

hmm--i think you missed something in my original post. it's not too boomy, it doesn't have enough bite.

the Alt 8 sounds interesting, but i've read here about it not having as much bite as the custom. the Crazy 8 seemed maybe a better choice than the Alt 8; i've read that it has more cut. but either of those would be custom shop only (7-string), so i'm looking at stock or modded stock options first.

 

[Amplifuzz]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

hmm--i think you missed something in my original post. it's not too boomy, it doesn't have enough bite.

Yep. The trick is that from a functional standpoint, 'cutting bass' is exactly like 'emphasizing mids and treble', which is where the various kinds of 'bite' are. What we're talking about here is fine tuning the signal that hits the first gain stage. You'll have a hard time with bite if the bass from the pickup is overpowering the mids, while you have plenty of ways to fatten up a lean, tight pickup signal with the amp's EQ or power amp resonance/depth control.

 

[CTN]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

i haven't tried the Distortion because i really like the Alnico squish, even if it's A8 and how it has less squish than all the other Alnicos. and the DIstortion magnet is a different size, IIRC, so i couldn't easily swap an A8 into it.

JB may be the one to try. especially because i could swap an A8 into it if it had too much squish and not enough tightness.

JB8 is phenomenal and one of my favourite pickups. It's the perfect halfway point between a JB and the Distortion. All the organicness and character of the stock JB, but with more of the "punch you in the gut" dynamics of the Distortion. Killer killer pickup.

 

[_actual time_]

Re: Something brighter than a Custom 8? (in mahogany)

The trick is that from a functional standpoint, 'cutting bass' is exactly like 'emphasizing mids and treble', which is where the various kinds of 'bite' are. What we're talking about here is fine tuning the signal that hits the first gain stage. You'll have a hard time with bite if the bass from the pickup is overpowering the mids, while you have plenty of ways to fatten up a lean, tight pickup signal with the amp's EQ or power amp resonance/depth control.

i know about pre EQ'ing approaches. that's not my issue. like i said, the lows and mids on the Custom 8 sound great. it's not boomy. the bass is not overpowering the mids.

the high end just needs that 'extra push over the cliff,' in the words of the immortal Nigel. the sort of brightness that a maple cap or changing from 250k to 1 meg pots might add. not the sort of change that boosting with a pedal would give.