Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

[Lewguitar]

Hi guys, Thought I'd share some insights I've had about what sounds good to me in my Strat - especally since I've started using a Klon Klone between my guitar and my Fender amps.

No more RW/RP middle pickups.
No more overwound bridge pickups.
No more .02 tone caps...back to .1.
No more 50's mod.

I started playing through a Klon (actually an original AF-1 Klone) a couple of years ago and it has revolutionized my tone and my approach to playing electric guitar.

I leave the Klon on all the time and can go from clean to very overdriven and everything in between using my Strat's volume control and my "touch". Touch meaning the way I pick and shape the notes with my left and right hands.

I sold my '63 Strat. But before I sold it Seymour rewired it for me back to exact, 1963 stock specs.

We measured the pickups and found that all three were near identical and that the DC was about 6.4K for all three.

That '63 Strat sounded better through my Klone than any of my other guitars. The bridge pickup sounded especially great. When I played my Strats with hot bridge pickups through it they just didn't sound as good.

After I sold the '63 Strat, I paid off some bills that had piled up. Medical bills mostly. But my '89 Toyota 4WD truck needed a lot of work as did my '05 Forester.

With what I had left over I bought a used 2013 Fender Eric Johnson Strat with the 12" radius rosewood slab fingerboard and jumbo frets. Best modern guitar I've ever owned - but I wasn't crazy about the pickups.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Since I wanted to recreate my '63 Strat, I replaced the pickups with a set of 6K '62 style pickups. All three almost identical and no RW/RP middle pickup.

I left everything else alone. Kept the .1 tone cap. Kept the tone control on the bridge pickup, as EJ specified, instead of it being on the middle pickup.

I've been suspecting that a RW/RP middle pickup does something to the resonance of the guitar that chokes the tone a little and maybe keeps the guitar from resonating as deeply as it could. Bottom line: my '63 Strat was thicker and more resonant sounding than any of my other Strats - until I got the "new" EJ. With the new pickups, they sound very similar.

So I've been converting my other Strats. I removed the overwound Antiquity Custom bridge pickup and RW/RP middle pickup from my Parts-O-Caster Strat and put three Antiquity Surfer neck pickups in it. I went back to a .1 tone cap. Got rid of the blender pot and installed a Schaller 5 way mega switch that instead of giving me the middle pickup by itself in the #3 setting, now gives me the neck and bridge pickups combined - like on a Tele. There's no doubt about it that that guitar resonates better and sounds deeper and livlier. It inspires me again.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Interesting post Lew, I always look to you for vintage tone advice, you've pretty much owned them all! I've noticed on the demos of the custom shop reissue Strats that they all use low wind bridge pickups and they all sound even and balanced from position 1 through 5. I think I may need to sub out my slightly hotter bridge or something in the 6.4K range.

Who was the maker of the pickups (and did you spec them out at 6K on the nose?)

That Rosewood EJ looks nice, is it the basics of a 60's strat but with a flatter radius and bigger frets? (If so, it may be on my short list! I know many are fans of the maple neck model)

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I've never found an overdrive pedal that I loved...or loved enough to use.

The best was a King of Tone but that puppy has to many knobs and I hate fiddling with the knobs of a pedal onstage.

So until discovering the Klon, I went back to using no overdrive pedal at all. And for that, having an overwound bridge pickup was helpful.

But when I started using a Klon most of the time I found that an overwound bridge pickup didn't sound as good as one that matched the output of my neck and middle pickups.

Even if the volume of the vintage accurate bridge pickup was a little less than the neck or middle pickup, I could easily make up for it with the Klon.

Anyways, I'm happier with my Strat tone than I have ever been.

Some guys don't "get" the Klon. It's not distorted enough for some guys.

But if you're the kind of player who likes to shape his tone with the way you pick the note, if you're the kind of player who can "squeeze" those notes out for added sustain and coax the string to keep going with finger vibrato, if you're the kind of a player who wants to be able to go from clean, to semi-clean, to overdriven to VERY OVERDRIVEN using your guitar's volume control and get a violin-like tone by shaping your tone with the guitar's tone control, than the Klon might be the pedal you've been looking for all of your guitar playing life.

And the way I've been setting up my Strats works better with a Klon than the way I had them set up before.

Here's some detailed info on Jeff Beck's gear, including his settings when he uses the Klon. Jeff sets his Klon up exactly like I do - just a coincidence.

And here's Jeff using the Klon:

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Interesting post Lew, I always look to you for vintage tone advice, you've pretty much owned them all! I've noticed on the demos of the custom shop reissue Strats that they all use low wind bridge pickups and they all sound even and balanced from position 1 through 5. I think I may need to sub out my slightly hotter bridge or something in the 6.4K range.

Who was the maker of the pickups (and did you spec them out at 6K on the nose?)

That Rosewood EJ looks nice, is it the basics of a 60's strat but with a flatter radius and bigger frets? (If so, it may be on my short list! I know many are fans of the maple neck model)

Howdy...and thanks! I have Antiquity Surfers in my Parts-O-Caster and still love the heck out of them. All three are neck models.



But I like to try new things and Chris Klein of Klein pickups wound the '62 style Strat pickups I put in my EJ Strat. They're really, really good!

I called and told him I wanted to duplicate the pickups in my '63 and we decided that since it was made in February of '63 that the pickups were probably more like those Fender made in '62. A little stronger than those made in some other years. The Antiquity Surfers are also based on the 1962 Fender Strat pickup.

I measured the pickups in my '63 and they were all about 6.4K. Klein also listed the DC Resistance as being 6.4K for his '62 pickups so that's what I ordered.

When they came, NONE measured even 6K! All three were under 6K and I was disappointed. I called Klein and he said he got that all the time and he was kind of grumpy about it.

I put them in anyway and they sounded just like I'd hoped.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

That Rosewood EJ looks nice, is it the basics of a 60's strat but with a flatter radius and bigger frets? (If so, it may be on my short list! I know many are fans of the maple neck model)

Yep. That describes it. It uses a thick slab board rosewood fingerboard (not curved), medium jumbo frets and 12" radius. Quarter sawn maple neck - super comfortable.

Honestly, it plays as easily as my ES-335 and I can bend and hold notes just as effortlessly.

I owned a maple neck EJ and liked it a lot but I sold it when I decided to get the rosewood fingerboard version that just came out last year. I'm glad I did because I like everything about the rosewood version better - especially the way it plays.

But the EJ pickups don't get me my sound...especially the alnico 3 neck and middle pickups. I like the deeper and throatier tone of alnico 5...like my Surfers and the Kleins.

I'm a bluesy, jazzy, swing type player and I like to solo on my neck pickup. The EJ alnico 3 neck pickup is great and I could gig with it and all - but it's better suited to Eric's style and all those cascading harmonics that he does. I don't play like that. If I had to compare myself to anyone I'd pick Michael Bloomfield or Robben Ford or BB King or someone like that.

 

[LReese]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I revisited RWRP middle with my most resent restore job.

RWRP should theoretically have no change in sound. But when in a combo position, it seems to lost a little output and thin out a little. I might at some point in the future have that pickup remagnetized with reverse polarity and appropriately re-leaded.

I used a APS-1 in the middle of my EJ for a long time. Sounded great.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I revisited RWRP middle with my most resent restore job.

RWRP should theoretically have no change in sound. But when in a combo position, it seems to lose a little output and thin out a little.

That's what I feel the diff is too, only I think it thins out the tone of the guitar in all settings of the 5 way switch...not just the #2 and #4 settings.

My Strats seem to sound ballsier now that I've gotten rid of the RW/RP middle pickups.

Can't prove it...got no scientific data on it or anything. It's just the way it seems to me.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Great stuff Lew. I was wondering what happened to your maple board EJ as I thought you had one. The blue 60's style one looks great. I also prefer the flatter fingerboard on a strat, and don't really get along with the vintage radius. A couple of questions:

1 How does the vintage stagger work out with 12" radius? Any problems?

2 How did you end up setting your pickup heights.

I don't use a Klon but I might try that approach with my JTM45 sometime. I like you want a dynamic sound with out fiddling with any buttons: "No buttons to push, didn't even rain .." I don't find myself probably using a vintage output bridge PU on a strat, but I'll remember your advice.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Great stuff Lew. I was wondering what happened to your maple board EJ as I thought you had one. The blue 60's style one looks great. I also prefer the flatter fingerboard on a strat, and don't really get along with the vintage radius. A couple of questions:

1 How does the vintage stagger work out with 12" radius? Any problems?

2 How did you end up setting your pickup heights.

I don't use a Klon but I might try that approach with my JTM45 sometime. I like you want a dynamic sound with out fiddling with any buttons: "No buttons to push, didn't even rain .." I don't find myself probably using a vintage output bridge PU on a strat, but I'll remember your advice.

Thank you!

1. Just fine. My '63 had been refretted several times and every time I did it (I do all of my fret work) I flattened the fingerboard a little more each time. Never to a 12" radius though. I'm so used to a vintage stagger that it sounds normal to me. Right or wrong, after 40 years it's what I expect to hear. I had a Strat for a while with flat pole APS-2's and a Twangbanger and I liked it a lot. I'm cool with flat pole pickups too!

2. I first set my string height and intonation. Then I hold the low E and high E down at the highest fret and adjust the pickup so the polepiece is about 1/8" away on the bass side a little closer on the treble side. I can get away with 1/16" on the treble side but I don't always end up that close. Then I check the low E and fret it all up and down the neck and listen for any warbling or out-of-tuneness. I find that I have to accept some warbling when I fret on the highest frets. And that's OK with me up to a point - how often do any of us fret a note on the low E string on the 21st or 22nd fret? Not to often.

But to much warbling or out-of-tuneness is unacceptable and I'll adjust the neck and middle pickup a little further away if I need to. Generally though, about an 1/8" away from the underside of the strings when I fret the low E at the 21st fret usually works.

I set it that way and play the guitar for a while and tweak the ht. of the pickups a little more over the course of a few days, if needed, until I've found that happy medium.

I'm not one to set them even with the pickguard or anything like that. That's to far away for me.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I have been avoiding rwrp for years. While I came to no conclusion whether it does indeed make an audible difference in sound there certainly is a theoretical chance that it does, and I mean change the sound when only one pickup is on, especially on a Strat.

Lew, I'm very happy for you that you found a soulmate Strat.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I have been avoiding rwrp for years. While I came to no conclusion whether it does indeed make an audible difference in sound there certainly is a theoretical chance that it does, and I mean change the sound when only one pickup is on, especially on a Strat.

Lew, I'm very happy for you that you found a soulmate Strat.

Thank you! I really do love the rosewood EJ's. The stock EJ pickups are really good too. I changed them because I bought it planning on doing all I could to make it as close as possible to my '63.

Now I just have to play the sh!t out of it! :chairfall

Weighs the same as my '63, BTW. Both weigh under 7.5 lbs.

 

[ItsaBass]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I have always believed that a RW/RP middle pickup and a hotter bridge pickup are great ways to just ruin a Strat's sound...at least what I want in a Strat. Make the bridge hotter, and you ruin the most unique position on the whole guitar - that raw, unattenuated, piercing, downright violent sounding bridge pickup. Nothing else sounds like it. It's perhaps the best pickup to use for breakup and overdrive, because it sounds nasty and angry, yet remains articulate. It's one of the main reasons I go for my Strats, yet a hotter bridge pickup eliminates it. And I don't use the in between switch positions very often, but when I do, I don't want that noise cancelation that goes on with a RW/RP middle. First of all, to me, the buzz is an essential ingredient in the tone and response of a Strat, and something that should not be eliminated. Secondly, with RW/RP, the buzz is inconsistent from position to position. It's annoying to me to have the main positions humming, yet to have the hum go away on the in between positions. If my guitar is gonna buzz, then I want it to at least be consistent about it. Yup. RW/RP middle and hotter bridge are bad inventions IMNSHO. **** that ****.

 

[LReese]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

There's a way to eliminate buzz and hum - a pricey way. Its very effective and negligible impact on tone. (IMO)

RWRP was a godsend back in the day, but I still remember the days when the local dealers didn't carry sets with RWRP middle or even individual RWRP pickups even though the SD brochures mentioned them.

Even though I like my Strats pretty traditional, I do like the tone on the bridge pickup. Ideally on a super switch with Bridge on its own tone and the other 4 positions on the neck tone. The loading of the 250K potentiometer on the tones is a good thing.

 

[mojosman]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Lew, I am on the same page as you. I was trying to build a partscaster to replicate Blackie. Not the Fender version, but the original Blackie. I ended up buying the D. Allen Tru-62 pickups. They are as close to original early 60's pickups as you will find. No RW/RP middle, and no overwound bridge. They sound amazing, and are quieter than I expected.

The tone is vintage. I love them, and other people have played it and loved their tone as well. They are wired with the Jimmy Vaughan tone mod, and .047 mfd tone caps. I'm thinking that under wound pickups are the way to go for vintage tone. Under wound, no RW/RP, and A5 magnets is my recipe for my next set.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

My pickups are 69 style and read 5.8k but the bridge is JUST over at 6.2k amd all A5 magnets. So just enough to balance output but keeps that raw spike, and keep the betwrrn positions quacky. All scatterwound too. They are rwrp, but I have a switch to put them out of phase for swonky harmonic Brian May tones. Underwound is the way to go.

 

[FuseG4]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

some of my fav pickups have been fender 57/62s... no rw/rp, 3 identical pickups. I had a chrome red MIM strat with 57/62s and a .1 cap. I miss it.



Now I have an ash strat with a rosewood board... I got some klein s-7 pickups which were supposedly reverse engineered from some Eric Johnson strat pickups (the first version, not the ones re-spec'd for a the EJ w/ Rosewood board).
The set has an overwound a5 bridge... I ended up swapping the ~6K A3 middle pickup with the ~6.8K bridge pickup. I then dropped the new middle pickup (the a5) all the way down and then disconnected it. Somehow the wiring gave me neck only, neck only, neck only, neck and bridge, bridge. I really should just get a 3-way switch

Sometime I really might just do the same as Lew and drop 3 neck surfers in there with .01.

 

[freefrog]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Same choices here (3 identical standard PU's with .1 cap) for all my Strats and for the same tonal reasons. Enjoy!

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Another fan of non rwrp in the middle and 3 matching non calibrated pups

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk

 

[Artie]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Nice post, Lew. (As always.)

But I gotta ask, did you actually mean 0.1uf cap? As opposed to 0.01uf? I would think that would be counterproductive to the high-end a Strat gives you to begin with. Just wondering.

Artie