Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

[DarkMatter]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Cool discussion. I certainly see how the RW/RP will change the 2 and 4 positions, and not just the hum, but I'm still not convinced it affects any isolated pickup. If only one pickup is sending a signal then polarities alone shouldn't cancel anything.

 

[Bludave]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Great to see you posting Lew. Its good to see some familiar faces(or Avatars) . I have the Surfers in one Strat & the Texas Hots in another. I have the RW/RP middle & I bridge the tone pot to the bridge pickup when I rewire them. I love both & for me to pick a favorite is hard. I also have another Strat that has a set of Lindy Fralin Blues Specials with the RW/RP middle as well & the same wiring configuration. Personally I think the Duncans drive a lot better then the Fralins do, but the Fralins are beautiful when played clean. Out of these three guitars there are certain things I like about each, sometimes its the way the neck feels, sometimes its the way the neck pickup sounds, but in all three they are great sounding & palying guitars....

I use a TS9 that has been modded by John Spina. That OD pedal has been on my board since I got it. I use in my Shiva and I have the gain almost all the way off. I use it more as a clean boost & it works beautifully. I have never seen any reason to experiment with anything else. When I play out I use a Deluxe Reverb as you do and I use a modde TS9 with that as well. But with this setup I use the TS9 more like a channel switch. I set the amp to just give me a bit of hair with full volume & like you I can back off the guitar to clean it up. The overdrive is set to give me a bit more grit, sustain & volume. I use it mostly when I solo.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Great to see you posting Lew. Its good to see some familiar faces(or Avatars) . I have the Surfers in one Strat & the Texas Hots in another. I have the RW/RP middle & I bridge the tone pot to the bridge pickup when I rewire them. I love both & for me to pick a favorite is hard. I also have another Strat that has a set of Lindy Fralin Blues Specials with the RW/RP middle as well & the same wiring configuration. Personally I think the Duncans drive a lot better then the Fralins do, but the Fralins are beautiful when played clean. Out of these three guitars there are certain things I like about each, sometimes its the way the neck feels, sometimes its the way the neck pickup sounds, but in all three they are great sounding & palying guitars....

I use a TS9 that has been modded by John Spina. That OD pedal has been on my board since I got it. I use in my Shiva and I have the gain almost all the way off. I use it more as a clean boost & it works beautifully. I have never seen any reason to experiment with anything else. When I play out I use a Deluxe Reverb as you do and I use a modde TS9 with that as well. But with this setup I use the TS9 more like a channel switch. I set the amp to just give me a bit of hair with full volume & like you I can back off the guitar to clean it up. The overdrive is set to give me a bit more grit, sustain & volume. I use it mostly when I solo.

Thank Dave! Sounds like you got it all going on. Between a Duncan Surfer Strat, Texas Hot Strat and Fralin Blues Special Strat...and some cool amps. John modded my TS-9 also.

For the last five years at least, my favorite Strat used a mix of two Surfers and a Texas Hot bridge. And the middle pickup was reverse polarity.

I thought: "This is IT!" And it was - it made a great sound.

I love those Surfers and Texas Hots and love the Fralin Blues Specials too. And Lindy's Vintage Hots. There's NOT just one way to do it and there's lots of great pickups, pedals and amps.

Right now I'm kind of high on the sound of my stock '63 Strat that I'm getting from my customized Eric Johnson Rosewood fingerboard Strat, into my Klone and into my Deluxe Reverb with a Celestion speaker.

 

[Ashurbanipal]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Hey Lew, good to see you around, happy festive season.

Just wondering whether your opinion on bridge pups with steel baseplates has changed as a result of this new tone phase.

Nothing to add on my part, except that I love those vintage Strat tones - the Stratocaster neck pup is perhaps the best thing since the invention of electricity - and why I have two SSL2s in my superstrat (gets me in the ball park).

 

[uOpt]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I'm not comfortable throwing the hot bridge pickup and rw/rp into the same basket.

There is no question that the hot bridge pickup sounds different.

For the rwrp we have a couple of theories why we might not be crazy when we think we hear a difference, but they are on shaky grounds. I once posted clips and people listening to them thought it is inconclusive (myself I thought I hear a difference, a little bit of the "roar" that all humbucking has).

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Hey Lew, good to see you around, happy festive season.

Just wondering whether your opinion on bridge pups with steel baseplates has changed as a result of this new tone phase.

Nothing to add on my part, except that I love those vintage Strat tones - the Stratocaster neck pup is perhaps the best thing since the invention of electricity - and why I have two SSL2s in my superstrat (gets me in the ball park).

Thank you! Happy Solstice to you!

Well, as for baseplates on bridge pickups, the only bridge single coil Strat I have with a baseplate is this one:



It's an old 80's MIJ Fender Squier Strat that I've had forever and which has two Surfers and a Jerry Donahue Tele bridge pickup. Not worth much money, but it sure plays and sounds great.

I haven't had a Strat pickup with a baseplate in a guitar in quite a few years. Don't have a real reason for stopping using them...I just did. When I was using Fralins I always had a baseplate on the bridge pickup. When I switched over to Antiquitys I stopped using a baseplate - probably simply because the baseplate wasn't offered.

It does add some bottom and give the pickup a slightly fuller tone though. It's a good idea if you like the pickups you've got and just want to add a little fuller tone to a bridge single coil.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

I'm not comfortable throwing the hot bridge pickup and rw/rp into the same basket.

There is no question that the hot bridge pickup sounds different.

For the rwrp we have a couple of theories why we might not be crazy when we think we hear a difference, but they are on shaky grounds. I once posted clips and people listening to them thought it is inconclusive (myself I thought I hear a difference, a little bit of the "roar" that all humbucking has).

I stopped using a hot bridge pickup in my two favorite Strats (my EJ and my Parts-O-Caster) simply because when I plugged my '63 Strat into the Klon its stock bridge pickup sounded better than what I had been using: the Texas Hot Custom Bridge pickup that measured about 9K.

There was more snap and twang to the treble with the stock 50 year old Fender pickup and if I want more gain I can get it from the Klon.

So when I put new pickups in my EJ, I went with matched 1962 style alnico 5 pickups with no RW/RP middle pickup like those in my '63 Strat. And I found that I was getting the tone of my old '63 Strat.

So I did the same thing to my Parts-O-Caster and put three Surfer neck pickups in it. I liked that better too!

But if a guy (or gal!) is not plugging into something like a Klon, then a hot, over wound, bridge pickup can be a big help in getting your amp to break up and sing a little more easily.

You know, the whole thing about replacing the bridge pickup in a Strat with a hot pickup started before we had modern amps and modern overdrive and modern clean boost pedals. The JB JR. is the first one I recall using and it was a big help back then.

It's probably still a big help for players looking for heavier, PAFish tones from a Strat.

But the Klon Klone has changed everything for me. I can now get those tones from it, and to me three Duncan Surfer neck pickups sounds better through the Klon than a hot bridge pickup.

To me. Maybe not to every one.

In any case, for me to hear the sound of my 50 year old '63 Strat from a modern guitar, namely my 2013 Fender EJ Rosewood Fingerboard model, I had to use three matched 6K alnico 5 pickups without a RW/RP middle pickup or a hot bridge pickup.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Speaking of it, does anybody know whether the Ant Custom bridge pickups are overwound awg42 or underwound awg43?

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Lew, what's the neck profile like on the Eric Johnson?

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Lew, what's the neck profile like on the Eric Johnson?

Mine is the rosewood fingerboard EJ and it's just great. 12" fingerboard radius and jumbo frets and the neck shape is like a big 60's style C shape. The fingerboard is a thick slab not a veneer. It's bound too...like a 335 or Les Paul. I just love it.

I did own a maple fingerboard EJ before this. I sold it to get the rosewood fingerboard EJ.

Although I really liked the maple fingerboard EJ, I couldn't afford both and had to let it go.

I wouldn't have kept playing it much anyway after getting the rosewood fingerboard EJ - I like everything about the rosewood fingerboard version much more.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Regarding the doubts that a RW/RP middle pickup should have any effect on the overall tone of the guitar, I was in that same doubting camp until I made the comparison and heard the difference for myself.

Forget all the theorizing. That's where the bullsh!t is at.

Just try it and see.

I did and now I've removed the RW/RP middle pickups on all of my Strats.

I'm convinced.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Mine is the rosewood fingerboard EJ and it's just great. 12" fingerboard radius and jumbo frets and the neck shape is like a big 60's style C shape. The fingerboard is a thick slab not a veneer. It's bound too...like a 335 or Les Paul. I just love it.

I did own a maple fingerboard EJ before this. I sold it to get the rosewood fingerboard EJ.

Although I really liked the maple fingerboard EJ, I couldn't afford both and had to let it go.

I wouldn't have kept playing it much anyway after getting the rosewood fingerboard EJ - I like everything about the rosewood fingerboard version much more.

Thanks. I think I need to get myself to a guitar shop to check on out. Seems like an optimal combo of vintage Strat with a bit more modern fingerboard/fret setup. Perfect!

As usual, hope everything is well for you!

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Thanks. I think I need to get myself to a guitar shop to check on out. Seems like an optimal combo of vintage Strat with a bit more modern fingerboard/fret setup. Perfect!

As usual, hope everything is well for you!

Thanks my friend. I have good days and not so good days. But mostly good.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

+1 to non rwrp.
It always irked me that something seemed missing in the knotch positions.
No reverse= no worries!
It sounds like two pickups combined, rather than two pickups sucking the life from each other.
I'm never going back

 

[LReese]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Anyone tried remagnetizing a pickup to the reverse the polarity? I have one Strat with Stockers I'm overall happy with, but want to do away with the RP. I'll have to reverse the leads on that pickup but that's no big deal.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

+1 to non rwrp.
It always irked me that something seemed missing in the knotch positions.
No reverse= no worries!
It sounds like two pickups combined, rather than two pickups sucking the life from each other.
I'm never going back

Disconnecting the middle pickup tone control and putting it on the bridge pickup instead gives a better tone when the middle pickup is combined with the neck pickup as well.

The reason, I think, is that when the neck pickup has a tone control and the middle pickup has a tone control, those two tone controls are combined in parallel when the neck and middle pickups are combined.

Since the tone control on a Fender is basically a variable 250K resistor, when you combine two 250K resistors in parallel you get a 125K resistor.

So that sounds like a 250K tone control turned way down and is part of the source of the muffled tone you get when the neck and middle pickups are combined on a Strat.

Plus, I just like having a tone control on my bridge pickup - especially when using a clean boost or overdrive pedal such as the Klon Klone from PCE that I now use a lot.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Disconnecting the middle pickup tone control and putting it on the bridge pickup instead gives a better tone when the middle pickup is combined with the neck pickup as well.

The reason, I think, is that when the neck pickup has a tone control and the middle pickup has a tone control, those two tone controls are combined in parallel when the neck and middle pickups are combined.

Since the tone control on a Fender is basically a variable 250K resistor, when you combine two 250K resistors in parallel you get a 125K resistor.

It's even worse than that, because you also have the second capacitor in play. You don't have 125Kohm to one 47nF capacitor, you have two capacitors.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

It's even worse than that, because you also have the second capacitor in play. You don't have 125Kohm to one 47nF capacitor, you have two capacitors.

Some guys do use two caps with their custom wiring. On my vintage style Strats there's just one capacitor. Seymour's diagram shows it as being .022 but on my Eric Johnson Strat it's a .1 cap and since I started using the PCE Klon Klone I like that .1 value better. I used to use the .022 value though.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Right, never mind. Messing with too many LPs lately.

 

[Zombiwoof]

Re: Strat pickups: I've stopped using a RW/RP middle and a hotter bridge pickup

Lew, isn't a Strat really bright with vintage low-wind pickups and a .1uf cap?. I think that's why Fender switched caps in the first place.
By the way, I used to have a beat '63 Strat when I was younger, and sold it at one point. It had been modded a lot while I had it, by the time I sold it it had Quarter Pounders in it. Did the '63's still have the .1uf cap?. I thought they had changed the cap by that point.
I like the newer Fender 9 1/2 inch radius, I think 12 inch radius on a Strat is a bit too much. 9 1/2" keeps the high bends from fretting out, which is the main problem I had with the vintage radius, but still feels like a Strat neck to me. I like the look of the EJ rosewood Strat, but I wish he hadn't put a bound neck on it. I prefer unbound, other than that it seems like a nice Strat. How is the neck profile?. I grew up with the '63 profile, and the modern Fender profile just isn't round enough for me, although my modded Standard Strat has it. I'm going to change the neck on it at one point, I have changed out the trem block to a full sized steel block, and the pickups are an old Duncan set I've had for years, this is the second guitar I've had them in. SSL-1's in the neck and middle, and the Seymorized staggered one in the bridge (SSL-6? Can't remember).

Al