Tele grounding question

[Curly]

I have a Tele grounding question:

I have an '01 AS tele. I switched the pickups out to SD's (Hot neck/ JD bridge). I may have a grounding problem - I say may, because I only tested it a couple of times.

My question is, do you use the grounding lugs, besides the pot grounding?

besides the schematic, there are 3 grounding lugs on the body (I think) - one in the neck pup cavity, one in the control cavity, and one in the bridge pup cavity. The pots are grounded to the lugs, and the bridge pup lug has an additional wire through a channel that runs up underneath the bridge, with a bare end touching the underside of the bridge.

I didn't run ground back from the pots to the lugs in the control cavity and bridge cavity. The guitar could probably be quieter, but I honestly can't remember how loud it was before. :sad:

anyway, I wanted to ask before I open up the guitar again - teles are a bit more of a pain in that regard than strats!

thanks kindly

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Tele grounding question

I have a Tele grounding question:

I have an '01 AS tele. I switched the pickups out to SD's (Hot neck/ JD bridge). I may have a grounding problem - I say may, because I only tested it a couple of times.

My question is, do you use the grounding lugs, besides the pot grounding?

besides the schematic, there are 3 grounding lugs on the body (I think) - one in the neck pup cavity, one in the control cavity, and one in the bridge pup cavity. The pots are grounded to the lugs, and the bridge pup lug has an additional wire through a channel that runs up underneath the bridge, with a bare end touching the underside of the bridge.

I didn't run ground back from the pots to the lugs in the control cavity and bridge cavity. The guitar could probably be quieter, but I honestly can't remember how loud it was before. :sad:

anyway, I wanted to ask before I open up the guitar again - teles are a bit more of a pain in that regard than strats!

thanks kindly

Hi Curly, I've been doing alot of Tele work this morning...swappin' pickups, pots, caps, etc. Messin' with neck pickups trying to find the chimiest tones when the neck & bridge pickup are combined. Definately comes from covered pickups...not uncovered like the Fralin Blues Special. Forcing me to rethink everything, because I really like that neck & bridge combined tone for rythym.

You hear it alot on Pretenders tunes...it's a cool tone.

The cover for the neck pickup is always grounded to the terminal for the black wire right on the pickup.

Likewise, the baseplate for the bridge pickup is always grounded to the terminal for the black wire right on the pickup. That connection ought to also ground the bridge itself when the pickup screws thread into the grounded baseplate.

The chrome control plate grounds the two pots together too.

That's it for my guitars. I just attach all the black wires to the backs of the two pots.

Any help? Lew

 

[Curly]

Re: Tele grounding question

thanks, Lew ...
I'll have to read that a couple times to soak it in.

I agree about the in between tone - to me, it has a clear, almost acoustic quality that's good for rhythm. I think I like the bridge for punchy chords, and the neck for fatter lead tones - that may be a little backwards from most players, but that's kinda what I like on strats, too.

the AS tele stock wiring has the black wire going to a ground lug in that cavity, with one wire grounding to the bridge, and another to the pot. I ran the black to the pot, but I should run another wire back to the lug to be sure, and run another from the pots to the control cavity lug.

thanks again

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Tele grounding question

I made a couple of No Load 250K tone pots today. You know the unused terminal of the tone pot? I just took the cover off the pot and painted that last 1/8" end of the carbon strip with fingernail polish and let it dry...just enough that the wiper is disconnected when it hits the fingernail polish insulating coating.

The carbon strip is thick on a CTS pot so it can't really be scraped off with a razor blade as some have recommended...the whole strip appears to be solid, so painting it with fingernail polish at the end worked well.

That way, when the tone is one "10" the connection is broken and it's as if the pot and tone cap we'ren't even there.

Really helps brighten up the neck pickup a little...and enhanceds the chumey tones when the neck and bridge pickups are combined.

I've known how to do it for a long time but never tried it before. It's very easy to do.

Lew

 

[Curly]

Re: Tele grounding question

Lew,
the Hot neck, at 9K+, is not as "hot" as you might expect... I find it balances pretty well with the JD. I'd like to hear it combined with the Broadcaster, and a Hot lead, though, too.

 

[BS123]

Re: Tele grounding question

My experience with Telecasters has always been that all grounds go to the same point to eliminate the possibility of any grounding loops. Fender always has contacts to the body; whether it be in the pickups' cavities or the control cavity for sheilding. This comes from Fender themselves. A long time ago, I had the same questions.

 

[Artie]

Re: Tele grounding question

My experience with Telecasters has always been that all grounds go to the same point to eliminate the possibility of any grounding loops.

I hope everyone will take this with a little grain of salt, because I don't want to sound arrogant, or absolutely expert in this matter . . . but, while they may be problems that arise from grounding issues in a guitar, "ground loops" isn't one of them. The term "ground loop" refers to a specific type of problem. A classic example is that of installing a car stereo head-unit in the dash, and a high-power amp in the trunk. You have two powered devices, with one, a physically long distance from the power source. You get a slightly different "ground" level between the two, thus, a current flow, and thus, noise.

None of this happens within a guitar. The voltages and currents are too low, but more importantly, the physical distance in a guitar isn't large enough for a ground loop problem to exist. Consider the insides of a typical home stereo. The internal volume of an ordinary reciever is much greater than within a guitar, and with associated higher voltages and currents. And yet, these stereo's have multiple grounding points internally - and none with "ground loop" problems.

Just my 2-cents worth.

 

[Curly]

Re: Tele grounding question

thanks, folks

I'm guessing that Fender added the ground lugs for both better grounding, and maybe added safety. I have everything grounded to the pots, but it DOES get more quiet when I touch metal, so next time I open her up, I'll use the 2 unused lugs to see if that helps.

I followed the schematic, and looked at the pics in my telecaster book, but the 3 ground lugs threw me. In my strats, I found I preferred to just ground things well and not shield, since I do believe it cuts highs.

 

[BS123]

Re: Tele grounding question

I hope everyone will take this with a little grain of salt, because I don't want to sound arrogant, or absolutely expert in this matter . . . but, while they may be problems that arise from grounding issues in a guitar, "ground loops" isn't one of them. The term "ground loop" refers to a specific type of problem. A classic example is that of installing a car stereo head-unit in the dash, and a high-power amp in the trunk. You have two powered devices, with one, a physically long distance from the power source. You get a slightly different "ground" level between the two, thus, a current flow, and thus, noise.

None of this happens within a guitar. The voltages and currents are too low, but more importantly, the physical distance in a guitar isn't large enough for a ground loop problem to exist. Consider the insides of a typical home stereo. The internal volume of an ordinary reciever is much greater than within a guitar, and with associated higher voltages and currents. And yet, these stereo's have multiple grounding points internally - and none with "ground loop" problems.

Just my 2-cents worth.

Nope, didn't bother me. I just ground in the same place because they all came that way anyway. Since there's such a short distance in area of the guitar's body, it would make sense to me that ground loops actually would not be a factor. Fender, as well as the 'guitar nuts' webesite says otherwise though.

Curly, One thing about grounding... IMHO, you almost always need to run a separate ground from the bridge pickup to the bridge itself.

 

[Curly]

Re: Tele grounding question

Curly, One thing about grounding... IMHO, you almost always need to run a separate ground from the bridge pickup to the bridge itself.

thanks

the original wiring ran a short black wire from the bridge pickup to the ground lug in that pup cavity, then another wire from the lug to the volume pot, and another to the bridge ... that's what I'll do next time

right now, I have the pup to pot wire, the wire from the lug to the bridge, but I didn't complete that by running a wire from the lug to the pot

thanks again

 

[mrfjones]

Re: Tele grounding question

on my teles i have the neck pickup ground to the back of a pot and a wire from there to the bridge and i also have the bridge pickup ground on the bridge.

I have two places i ground and i then connect them. I think this is what butch was refering to. try connecting the lug to the back of the pot too. Good luck Curly

 

[Curly]

Re: Tele grounding question

try connecting the lug to the back of the pot too.

thanks,
I agree that's the part I missed

If you run a wire from the "bridge" lug to the volume pot, the way Fender had it, then you just have to solder the black bridge pup wire to the lug, which makes changing pups a little easier, since you don't have to run it over to the pot - sometimes, that connection to the pot is a little tough!

 

[brianwenz]

Re: Tele grounding question

Hello Hello--
Curly-- Wouldn't you have more of a "shielding" problem then a "grounding" problem? All of my Tellys that have a single-point ground [as was mentioned before] are as "grounded " as they can get, but if I shield the cavities with copper paint or tape and run THAT to ground I get a little less "single coil" noise.
Hey, Lew-- The '67 Esquire Custom that I've owned for the past 26 or-so years is the guitar that was played on all the Pretenders stuff from late '81 [Chain Gang] up to the late '80's. I don't meet to many people who are into them, so it's kinda cool that you brought 'em up!
Brian.

 

[Curly]

Re: Tele grounding question

Hello Hello--
Curly-- Wouldn't you have more of a "shielding" problem then a "grounding" problem? All of my Tellys that have a single-point ground [as was mentioned before] are as "grounded " as they can get, but if I shield the cavities with copper paint or tape and run THAT to ground I get a little less "single coil" noise.

Brian.

Brian,
thanks,
yeah, after doing my custom strat without shielding, I felt it sounded better, and removed the copper from my ash tele. In hindsight, that may have been a mistake, since I think it's a little noisier now.
On my current tele, I'd like to get the grounding right before I say for sure that shielding really helps.

after a while, I figured Leo did OK without shielding his guitars

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Tele grounding question

Hello Hello--
Curly-- Wouldn't you have more of a "shielding" problem then a "grounding" problem? All of my Tellys that have a single-point ground [as was mentioned before] are as "grounded " as they can get, but if I shield the cavities with copper paint or tape and run THAT to ground I get a little less "single coil" noise.
Hey, Lew-- The '67 Esquire Custom that I've owned for the past 26 or-so years is the guitar that was played on all the Pretenders stuff from late '81 [Chain Gang] up to the late '80's. I don't meet to many people who are into them, so it's kinda cool that you brought 'em up!
Brian.

Awesome! Does it have a neck pickup, or were all those recordings done with just a bridge pickup? I assumed the rythym tones on Chain Gang, etc. were done with a Tele with the neck and bridge pickups combined. Wrong? Thanks! Lew

 

[brianwenz]

Re: Tele grounding question

Hello Hello-
All of the lead bits were done with the bridge pickup [stock late '60's ] and the other stuff [ Chrissie's bits] were sometimes bridge and sometimes both in the middle position.
Brian.

 

[brianwenz]

Re: Tele grounding question

Hello Hello Again--
I forgot to say that I had installed a neck pickup [Schecter strat-type] a couple of years before that, and when I got the guitar back in '92 I returned the guitar to stock one-pickup Esquire condition.
Brian.