The '78

Re: The '78

9K
A2 mag
(i think) uses 42wire
unevenly wound coils
its based off the 50's P.A.F. pup that ed took out of his ES-335
it is said to be VERY harmonic resposive
form what ive heard, the sound is very spongy and has that crunchy sound off of VH1
 
Re: The '78

Tom Anderson worked on Ed's guitar and said that the pickup had virtually no output (barely registered) and was painfully bright sounding.

How close is the '78 REALLY?
 
Re: The '78

Archer_of_Fish said:
Tom Anderson worked on Ed's guitar and said that the pickup had virtually no output (barely registered) and was painfully bright sounding.

How close is the '78 REALLY?
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no, he said the pup read 0 when he plugged it in to a reader. Ed said its because he picks really hard and the high E string gets caught in the coils and just over time started to break them down, thats why it reads 0
 
Re: The '78

Christopher Caruana said:
no, he said the pup read 0 when he plugged it in to a reader. Ed said its because he picks really hard and the high E string gets caught in the coils and just over time started to break them down, thats why it reads 0
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A quote from Tom Anderson about the Frankenstein:

i've worked on that guitar, and it's not light by a long shot. it was a schecter made, charvel sold body from the days when schecter, charvel and boogie bodies tried an alliance with ISA as the selling agent. didn't work out for very long. the thing i remember most about that guitar is that the humbucker was crazy weak and very bright sounding. it didn't even read on an ohm meter which always made me suspect he may have tucked a capacitor in there to keep his sound secret. you really had to wind up the amp to make it do what he gets out of it.
 
Re: The '78

Okay all esotericness aside.....

The 78 sounds like a PAF. It has the bloomy, squishy, A2 sound that you get from an Ant, Seth, A2P, or PG....but it has an aggressiveness that is unmatched in my opinion. It has a "chewy" character through the mids. It is a very particular pup for a very particular sound. It is very touch sensitive, but it CAN be bright if you don't mind yourself. It has just the right touch of natural compression to give it a creaminess and an openness that is natural sounding.

I really dig them and I'm not a VH head. I've got one that's built like a Seth in my R8, and I have a trembucker in my CU24.

Luke
 
Re: The '78

Luke Duke said:
Okay all esotericness aside.....

The 78 sounds like a PAF. It has the bloomy, squishy, A2 sound that you get from an Ant, Seth, A2P, or PG....but it has an aggressiveness that is unmatched in my opinion. It has a "chewy" character through the mids. It is a very particular pup for a very particular sound. It is very touch sensitive, but it CAN be bright if you don't mind yourself. It has just the right touch of natural compression to give it a creaminess and an openness that is natural sounding.
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Pretty much what Luke said. I have one also, it really has no comparison in what it does.
 
Re: The '78

Archer_of_Fish said:
A quote from Tom Anderson about the Frankenstein:

i've worked on that guitar, and it's not light by a long shot. it was a schecter made, charvel sold body from the days when schecter, charvel and boogie bodies tried an alliance with ISA as the selling agent. didn't work out for very long. the thing i remember most about that guitar is that the humbucker was crazy weak and very bright sounding. it didn't even read on an ohm meter which always made me suspect he may have tucked a capacitor in there to keep his sound secret. you really had to wind up the amp to make it do what he gets out of it.
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hmm o well. i just stated what he and ed stated in the "Guitar World" issue when the replica first came out
 
Re: The '78

... if the original PAF on Frankie read 0... why does the EVH/'78 even have an ohm reading (@ 9K)? If there was a capacitor innit... then wouldn't that pickup have been less bright?

Also, if the pup on the Fender repro Frankie reads upwards of 12-14k... as some who've actually measured it have said... how could it be an accurate copy of the Frankie pickup? If it is... does that mean the repro pickup might just be a copy of a later version of the "broken" PAF... say post VH#1 and VHII? And since it's overwound, could the repro pup be closer to a Custom Custom w/ an A2 magnet and asymmetrical windings? Inquiring EVH Kool-Aid drinkers want to know. :scratchch
 
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Re: The '78

I understood that the coils were symmetrically wound. The '78 sounds nothing like a PAF IMO. It's bright and very "Fair Warning" sounding. It's great that's for sure...but is it what you want?
 
Re: The '78

YHWH said:
... if the original PAF on Frankie read 0... why does the EVH/'78 even have an ohm reading (@ 9K)? If there was a capacitor innit... then wouldn't that pickup have been less bright?

Also, if the pup on the Fender repro Frankie reads upwards of 12-14k... as some who've actually measured it have said... how could it be an accurate copy of the Frankie pickup? If it is... does that mean the repro pickup might just be a copy of a later version of the "broken" PAF... say post VH#1 and VHII? And since it's overwound, could the repro pup be closer to a Custom Custom w/ an A2 magnet and asymmetrical windings? Inquiring EVH Kool-Aid drinkers want to know. :scratchch
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You Eddie junkies crack me up....you read endlessly yet don't seem to simply listen to recordings or actually sit down and try to play his stuff and realize how much of his tone is really his technique and phrasing.

The '78 does everything up through Diver Down, its especially good for the earliest recordings. 1984 had a slightly different tone, hotter and more mid oriented (more roar than bite).

I have played a Franky and have a '78. Both sound like Ed, but the Frankie replica pup is a little hotter and sounds something like a CC with some of the bite of the '78 mixed in.

Yes, the '78 is a magical Ed sounding pup, but it won't make you sound like him unless you have the right amp tone and technique.
 
Re: The '78

revolution said:
I understood that the coils were symmetrically wound. The '78 sounds nothing like a PAF IMO. It's bright and very "Fair Warning" sounding. It's great that's for sure...but is it what you want?
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Unchained has GODLY chunk and power. I do realise that is of course in the stupendously awesome riffage, but that tone is definetly amazing also.

Fair Warning tone? Good thing :approve:
 
Re: The '78

YHWH said:
... if the original PAF on Frankie read 0... why does the EVH/'78 even have an ohm reading (@ 9K)? If there was a capacitor innit... then wouldn't that pickup have been less bright?
Click to expand...

A capacitor in parallel would allow ohm readings, I think this one would be in series.

Personally I think that Ed played a joke on Tom and put in the capacitor just for that session. It would fit his personality, I figure.
 
Re: The '78

revolution said:
I understood that the coils were symmetrically wound. The '78 sounds nothing like a PAF IMO. It's bright and very "Fair Warning" sounding. It's great that's for sure...but is it what you want?
Click to expand...

Just different perceptions I guess. To me it is more PAFish than the A2P.

Luke
 
Re: The '78

YHWH said:
... if the original PAF on Frankie read 0... why does the EVH/'78 even have an ohm reading (@ 9K)? If there was a capacitor innit... then wouldn't that pickup have been less bright?

Also, if the pup on the Fender repro Frankie reads upwards of 12-14k... as some who've actually measured it have said... how could it be an accurate copy of the Frankie pickup? If it is... does that mean the repro pickup might just be a copy of a later version of the "broken" PAF... say post VH#1 and VHII? And since it's overwound, could the repro pup be closer to a Custom Custom w/ an A2 magnet and asymmetrical windings? Inquiring EVH Kool-Aid drinkers want to know. :scratchch
Click to expand...


In a Guitar World feature the guy at Fender also noted that the pickup didnt read on a meter.

as for the cap making it less bright....depends on the cap and the pickup itself.
 
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Re: The '78

uOpt said:
A capacitor in parallel would allow ohm readings, I think this one would be in series.

Personally I think that Ed played a joke on Tom and put in the capacitor just for that session. It would fit his personality, I figure.
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2 pretty high level guitar guys (especially Tom who knows as much about pickups as anyone on the planet) have both commented on that pickup not having much output that could be measured. The notion that eddie would 'play a trick' (or even could) on 2 guys that are on the upper end of the guitar tech/luthier business is probably less than the chances of being struck by lightning while Unicorn hunting.

Tom fixed up that guitar on at least 2 different occasions.

Eddie didn't play any jokes.

I think it is WAY more likely that the tone is in the hands and amp and that the 'Eddie sounding' pickups out there are just approximations.
 
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Re: The '78

There have been pages and pages written about the '78's origins and authenticity.
Eddie Van Halen said in that famous interview just before the third album came out, that he rewound some of his pickups from old PAF's, and ruined a few till he got it right.
What I think he meant is, he had some pickups rewound for him. This is a guy who couldnt wire up a pickup into his guitar, and he's gonna rewind a pickup? I don't think so. Many have guessed that at the time ( and to this day probably) Van Halen was being gaurded about his trade secrets.
Anyway, If Seymour Duncan says he wound the '78 for Van Halen, then as was said by another forum member here on a different board, I'll take Duncans word on that everyday of the week compared to EVH.
Anyway, I digress. I've got a '78, but still waiting on a guitar to put it in. I've heard some great things about it.
And if it nails the VH-1 tone, and it does so from most reports< than thats fruther proof it isnt just an interpretation, but the exact pickup wound for VH-1.
 
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Re: The '78

With my PRS and a skewed EQ (to mimic alder) I can get some pretty close Little Dreamer tones. I'm almost tempted now to try and dial in some real deal VH-1 tones since the clips I've got are with my R8 and the 78 and not very Ed-Centric at all.
 
Re: The '78

If it doesn't read on a meter and still sounds like a pickup there much be a capacitor in series. I honestly can't imagine that this leads anywhere, but nothing that a few crocodiles clips and tests couldn't clarify.
 
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