Tone chart misleading

[jony]

I feel that the tone chart provided on the site by SD is rather misleading. It shows duckbuckers as having the same output as a HSSL-3 hot. I have both and the SSL-3 is way hotter. Is this another misconception of mine or have any of you felt this way? I do lyk the tone of SD's... I would be getting ine fir my middle position, but i'd rly want to make an informed choice.

 

[Kommerzbassist]

Re: Tone chart misleading

Yes i think there are more strange things... the Vintage rails and the Ducks are said to sound similar, but on the tone chart they have quite different eq settings...

 

[pinto79]

Re: Tone chart misleading

This is another thing I like about DiMarzio, they give you a mV output instead of a "bar Graph" to depict output, so you can actually rate the pups by power output.

 

[ratherdashing]

Re: Tone chart misleading

That's the thing with pickups though: what you see on paper doesn't necessarily translate to what you hear. It's very hard to quantify tone.

 

[Kommerzbassist]

Re: Tone chart misleading

That's the thing with pickups though: what you see on paper doesn't necessarily translate to what you hear. It's very hard to quantify tone.

This is a good point... this is why I think the written descriptions should be evenmore detailed... you can imagine more if it says like "pupx is brigther than pupy with a tighter low end" ... although you have to have a bit of knowledge of at least some of those pups to be able to use that info... but there are still the soundclips which are quite helpful imo

 

[slash857]

Re: Tone chart misleading

i can barely notice a difference between some of the soundclips. i thought the jb bridge sounded clearest clean and some people on here said that they didnt like the jb clean at all. thats why i think the forum is more helpful than the descriptions or clips.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Tone chart misleading

There's nothing really wrong with the tone chart.

Truth is: you just have to try any pickup in your own guitar with your own amp with your own playing style and your own pick to get a real handle on what it's going to sound like.

And then if you let your buddy try it and you listen, it'll sound differant...guaranteed.

It'll even sound differant the next day if YOU play it...or if you change the ht. adjustment or change your action or change your strings or play with your fingers instead of a pick.

The Tone Chart is just to give you a bit of a starting point and comparism.

But descriptions of reality are ALWAYS differant than the experience of reality.

It's like trying to describe the taste of an Orange vs. the taste of a Tangerine to someone who has tried neither. She'll never know until she's tried both for herself.

 

[Xeromus]

Re: Tone chart misleading

There's nothing really wrong with the tone chart.

Truth is: you just have to try any pickup in your own guitar with your own amp with your own playing style and your own pick to get a real handle on what it's going to sound like.

And then if you let your buddy try it and you listen, it'll sound differant...guaranteed.

It'll even sound differant the next day if YOU play it...or if you change the ht. adjustment or change your action or change your strings or play with your fingers instead of a pick.

The Tone Chart is just to give you a bit of a starting point and comparism.

But descriptions of reality are ALWAYS differant than the experience of reality.

It's like trying to describe the taste of an Orange vs. the taste of a Tangerine to someone who has tried neither. She'll never know until she's tried both for herself.

Best explanation EVER. That's exactly how I feel. Advice and opinions only go so far, you really need to try them to know what it's going to sound like.

 

[Luke Duke]

Re: Tone chart misleading

This is another thing I like about DiMarzio, they give you a mV output instead of a "bar Graph" to depict output, so you can actually rate the pups by power output.

But the problem with mV output is that the way it is generally used has way too many variables.

String size
String age
Pick thickness
Pot resistance
Extra wire
Pup height
Heaviess of attack

I know that I myself can get more output from my A2P with my style of playing, and tweaking of electronics than some can get from higher output buckers.

The only way to get rid of the majority of variable is to take out the strings, circuity, and person.

A machine would be the only way to do that something that moves and interacts with the magnetic field, and sends the mV reading directly to the meter.

Luke

 

[Biu]

Re: Tone chart misleading

Very good points made! However, I think DiMarzio gives you more info on pickup application (situations they handle well) and overall just MORE in their descriptions, so it's easier to narrow down your choices and leave you with less questions.

 

[Evan Skopp]

Re: Tone chart misleading

Stay tuned. Bigger product descriptions are on the way. I promise.

In the meantime, Lew is spot on about the use of the tone chart. Understanding the relationship between d.c. resistance and resonant peak, and knowing how different magnets work with bright guitars and warm guitars, is far more instructive than looking at output and EQ graphs. Of course, listening with your own ears in your own guitar is the only true way to tell if you're going to like the pickup.

 

[ranalli]

Re: Tone chart misleading

But the problem with mV output is that the way it is generally used has way too many variables.

String size
String age
Pick thickness
Pot resistance
Extra wire
Pup height
Heaviess of attack

I know that I myself can get more output from my A2P with my style of playing, and tweaking of electronics than some can get from higher output buckers.

The only way to get rid of the majority of variable is to take out the strings, circuity, and person.

A machine would be the only way to do that something that moves and interacts with the magnetic field, and sends the mV reading directly to the meter.

Luke

mV are extremely helpful in finding out how pickups relate to one another. That's what makes them so useful. Those output bars on the tone chart had to be derived from somewhere anyway.....are they completely fabricated?

I personally like the mV readings on the Dimarzio site....tells me EXACTLY how hot one pickup is in relation to another....makes selection in that line very easy.

 

[MikeF]

Re: Tone chart misleading

Speaking for myself, I find that my ears and perception of tone may be an even greater variable than those listed. This is where experience really comes to play. The day to day thing that Lew mentioned certainly is valid for me. Some days my rig sounds heavenly as soon as I plug in, others it sounds like crap and I end up tweaking knobs until I say screw it and concentrate on just playing. Inevitably an hour later I'm fine with it.

Another example is how my tastes constantly change and evolve....even after twenty plus years of chasing tone. My ears had gotten really use to overwound, darker pickups and thats what I liked. So I buy a 59, put it in a superstrat and right of the bat it's way too bright, twangy on the top and I'm shaking my head. So I stick with it for a few weeks and guess what? I'm now a big fan of low output PAF style pups. Shrill and twangy is now articulate with just the right amount of bite. Go figure. :smack:

 

[Luke Duke]

Re: Tone chart misleading

mV are extremely helpful in finding out how pickups relate to one another. That's what makes them so useful. Those output bars on the tone chart had to be derived from somewhere anyway.....are they completely fabricated?

I personally like the mV readings on the Dimarzio site....tells me EXACTLY how hot one pickup is in relation to another....makes selection in that line very easy.

I never said the reading was useful, but simply that it was problematic. I realize it is very helpful especially when only looking at one pup company, but when you switch companies the variable compound.

Luke