TV Pelham Blue: The Secrets Revealed

[zenmindbeginner]

Re: TV Pelham Blue: The Secrets Revealed

As for grain filler on top of color, here's how it looks on Collings' Doghair finish:

View attachment 63127

Much more pronounced than the Epiphone, though *some* of that is likely the stronger contrast between black and white than blue and white. Also, Collings uses a stain for color on that finish, not lacquer. Someone more skilled than me might be able to get filler into the pores on top of Pelham Blue (and maybe even do it without destroying the sparkle) but, at least with the tools I have at my disposal, I cannot. But I'm increasingly convinced, based on what I'm seeing firsthand, that Epi didn't do theirs that way. In fact, I don't think they used filler at all.

So do you think they filled some of the grain the way Gibson did it by using light dry coats of primer? The pores are clearly filled with something that's white. It would be easier to just fill the grain with filler and remove some of it to get that effect.

I'm sure that you can get the same doghair effect using water based stain and oil based grain filler without putting the grain filler on top of the stain. Grain filler likes to be lightly sanded after it's applied... so I just see grain filling over color as problematic unless you seal in the color with some barrier coats of lacquer and even that can be sanded through.

If I was going to do the doghair finish, I would simply use oil based white grain filler and water based trans-black stain. With water as it's carrier, the black stain won't dye the white oil based filler and you'll get the exact same effect.

Putting on grain filler is probably the crappiest part of finishing mahogany... it's no fun and putting it over stain would make a difficult no-fun process more difficult and even less fun IMHO.

I'd love to see more interesting combinations of contrasting pore filed finishes... lots more interesting combinations than black and white although that is the punchiest visually.

Really love what you are doing here, it's going to turn out spectacular with all of these tests you are performing! I mean... practicing on scrap is a GENIUS move.

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: TV Pelham Blue: The Secrets Revealed

I think there are some other variations out there. I seem to recall seeing green and red versions at some point during my research. And since I'm now sitting on two different kinds of filler, as well as silver and black pigment, not to mention another 2 board feet of mahogany and an garage full of stain...I think I may have to get a bit silly.

I'd love to see more interesting combinations of contrasting pore filed finishes... lots more interesting combinations than black and white although that is the punchiest visually.

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: TV Pelham Blue: The Secrets Revealed

I'm not at all sure that they are.

Check this pic:



Or this one:



That said, I think doing some white grain fill might actually look BETTER than what Epi is doing, so I'm definitely going to try it.

Also, looking at the back of that Firebird headstock, I think it's safe to say that I, even with my paucity of experience, am a better painter than the 12-year-old chained to a radiator in China finishing these

The pores are clearly filled with something that's white. .

 

[AlexR]

Re: TV Pelham Blue: The Secrets Revealed

Transtint is the woodworking industry standard dye and it is soluble in alcohol and water.

I think you've confused yourself with your theory. You are assuming the oil and water won't mix. But whatever your base for the dye, it sits inside the finish you are applying and will tint the grainfill irrespective of the grainfill's original base. I have water based grainfill with nitro over the top and despite the incompatibility of the two while wet, the fact that the grainfill is dry means the nitro goes over just fine.
Same with oil based.

And to mix the transtint into nitro it has to be alcohol based anyhow, so it wouldn't be in its water thinned guise anyhow.