What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Eh, come on guys, it's like saying a PRS guitar is a long scale, because it's longer than a Gibson scale, when clearly we all know that it's a short scale guitar since it's shorter than Fender scale! It depends on where you're coming from. In marketing terms, they know that calling it a "large diaphragm" condenser is a selling point, so there it is.

Anyway back to the 57/58 I use the 57 (& 545's) to record, but rarely alone. If a 57 is involved I almost always include something else. To me they're special use mics now. Talking about reinventing the wheel is a perfect analogy. Since pre-historic times, no one can reinvent the wheel, but I'd rather not drive on four crudely chiseled stone tablets. I prefer alloy wheels with tires. When is the 57 going to be outdated? If not now, when? I mean you can call it vintage if you want, and say that it is the tool that captured all the classic tones, but then, why do we need a Mesa Triple Rectifier? It's because Mesa has progressed since the MKI. You can say the MKI is "all you need" but there are plenty of other Mesas out there. You can say the 57 is all you need, and the same would apply. In my opinion, if you only care about getting tones that were created decades ago, then use the 57 alone. But if you want some newer sounds, or to create and record signature sounds, then the 57 becomes just another tool in the arsenal.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Funny that I have a sweetwater catalog with an AT 2020 large diaphram condensor mic pictured right here beside me. So you're saying you would honestly consider this a small diaphragm condensor? I'll agree that most large diaphragm mics are larger but saying its a large characterizes it better than a small.

So the backup to your argument is "because Sweetwater says so"? The fact that the mfg isn't saying it doesn't give you even the slightest pause? Was actually researching this even a consideration?

:sad:

Live in ignorance if you like. No skin off my ass. The 2020 is not a large diaphragm condenser
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

The beta series are good for live usage which is what they were designed for. They've got a lot of presence and cut. They wouldn't be my first choice for a studio mic by any means
What were the 57's and 58's designed for? Even if you said they were designed solely for studio recording, it means they were designed for the old consoles, analog tape, etc. I'm not challenging your statement, I'm just adding that what a mic was designed for is sometimes not the definition of it's usefulness. I mean I concede that the EQ curve is live-centric. The EV N/DYM series is like that, too, but I like the EV 3xx series and/or Beta 57 on big magnet guitar speakers, a Boogie or Music Man with a single EV 12.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

I love how he's suggesting Vinterland is inexperienced - I'd love to learn from him.

Would you prefer "uninformed"? Either way he is incorrect.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

I'm not challenging your statement, I'm just adding that what a mic was designed for is sometimes not the definition of it's usefulness.

I guess I need to add IMO next to everything I mention in the tips n' clips room anymore. This is one of the reasons I don't reply in this room often since everyone is going to call someone out on something when my comments are not intended as an end all to be all fact but merely as an informed opinion. I know certain studio things work in certain circumstances when they it doesn't seem like they should. I understand some people might like the beta series for studio use. However, I just made the comment that the beta series definately have a "live" eq sound and feel as you said and wouldn't be my choice to mic a cabinet in a studio. The thread was about buying a good guitar mic across the board... 95/100 times you're probably going to get that good sound with a regular 57. Let's face it, it's tried and true period. We could nit pick all day in regards to discrepency's between mics for different applications but that wasn't the point here. I totally dig ribbon mics for certain guitar applications but I didn't mention that.

If it matters I've used a B57 and a 57 side by side for comparison. I'm not trying to rehash shure's specs on the model.
 
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Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Would you prefer "uninformed"? Either way he is incorrect.


Look dude, why don't you just let it be. Think however you want of me but you think one way, I think another.

... in regards to sweetwater however. Those are some of the most informed and knowledgeable sales engineers you'll ever find. They aren't some random customer service person... they're actual sound professionals.
 
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Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Hey that's why I said I wasn't challenging your statement. It's another way of saying I don't disagree with the things you said, but I'm adding some more content for the sake of everyone else, too. I'm just a little hair-triggered when someone talks about how great the 57 is when a newbie is looking for his first cabinet mic. To me, it comes with a pretty big learning curve. You can't just throw a 57 in front of a cabinet and get a great sound. Good, maybe, but if you're 3/4" off they sound horrible. And that sweet spot is different for every speaker and cabinet. I'd rather recommend some more user friendly, flatter response guitar cab mics, with better high and low end reproduction, because today's guitar sounds (especially heavy tones) have so much more information in the highs and lows than a dimed JCM800 from the 70's and 80's. That's why I call it a tool in the larger arsenal rather than the first mic someone should own.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

You can't just throw a 57 in front of a cabinet and get a great sound. Good, maybe, but if you're 3/4" off they sound horrible. And that sweet spot is different for every speaker and cabinet.

True... thats just one of those things one has to learn in regards to mic'ing a cab. Find the spot on your cab and mark it with a piece of tape and you're good to go.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Look dude, why don't you just let it be. Think however you want of me but you think one way, I think another.

... in regards to sweetwater however. Those are some of the most informed and knowledgeable sales engineers you'll ever find. They aren't some random customer service person... they're actual sound professionals.

Actual professionals working a day gig selling gear? 2+2 still doesn't equal 5. They are being paid to SELL things. :reporter:
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

I've heard the beta versions of the shure mics are fantastic and I have a professional friend who swears by them. I'm going to get a couple of the shure beta57's instead of the sm57's I was almost decided on. Apparently they're great!

The beta 57 is a great mic, but it does sound different than an sm 57. Beta 57 is great on toms, snare, alto sax, bright guitar cabs . . . it's not bad on bass drum, vocals, and acoustic guitar. This mic has less of a high mid boost than an sm 57 (so it sounds a little darker/more natural, and requires less gain from your preamp. It's also more directional, so mic positioning is more important with this mic. All that said, I wouldn't ever expect one mic to be perfect for everything. If I were you, I'd buy one of each and then look at other mics too . . . more mics means more choices when you're recording.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Hmm, I think Vinterland gets some points for being good natured on this thread if nothing else.

I can't give anything other than a layman's opinion on this but I have recorded quite a few things over the years and I have never used anything other than a 57 on a guitar amp/cab. I would recommend having one and learning how to use it before worrying about buying more expensive/better mics they are IMO pretty easy to use and fairly forgiving as well.

I have a Beta58 I use for some vocal recording but really I use my Studio Projects C1 for most vocals. I prefer everything about itto a 58 for vocals but some don't, a bit too much cut for some things I guess.

The best and simplest advice I ever got for mic placement was to trust your ear. Find the spot you come to stand in naturally and drop a mic there, odds are you will have the sound you are looking for, not always of course but it will get you real close consistently, you can tweak to taste from there.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

Like I said I'm getting some beta57's and possibley one sm57, but I was just wondering if anyone had experience with the Sennheiser guitar cab mics such as the e603 and the e903...they look rather sexy! (if they are the right model numbers...the flat ones made especially for guitar cabs)
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

I use Sennheiser 414c and 535.
And I am moving my mics farther away than I used to, the air movement seems better to me that way, have also used mic'ing the back of the cab and on in front, and one even further away in the front...gives a nice sound, very natural.
 
Re: What are some better mics than the typical sm57 and 58?

I should have a seinheizer e609 soon, i ordered it last week from my guitar shop so probably see it at the end of this week.
 
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