What is your opinion on cabs

[NjuiMusic]

I have always thought a cheap cab I had was GREAT cause it was a 4x12 and duh, that's all that I needed to know, until I got a killer 2x12 custom cab and I noticed how much better it was. I then immediately sold the cheap 4x12 and own a Marshall 1960b which is a pretty nice cab, not as nice as a Mesa 4x12 but you know what they say, baby steps.

What do you think about this article? http://the-gear-files.blogspot.ca/2016/05/why-good-cab-is-beneficial-for-your-rig.html

 

[Sonic Alchemy]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Completely agree, I have a buddy who made a Peavey 5150 sound like utter garbage though a cheap cab (Peavey cab with blue marvel speakers...)... Played through a Marshall with vintage 30s (I think) made all the difference in the world.
Live, learn and waste a ton of money along the way (trying to cut corners mostly... and getting lot's of toys ) that is a guitarists' way lol...

 

[NjuiMusic]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Completely agree, I have a buddy who made a Peavey 5150 sound like utter garbage though a cheap cab (Peavey cab with blue marvel speakers...)... Played through a Marshall with vintage 30s (I think) made all the difference in the world.
Live, learn and waste a ton of money along the way (trying to cut corners mostly... and getting lot's of toys ) that is a guitarists' way lol...

and good speakers are only half the battle, if you stick V30s in a Bugera cab or something, it still will lack. I find that is what people have a hard time grasping.

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I like the Mesa cabs and have several. I LOVE the Mesa Thiele 112, and the older 212 and 412 Half-Back cabs, and I also have a newer 212 Horizontal Recto and the 112 ported Wide Body. I agree with the author, I really think that Mesa builds some of the best cabs around.

And don't be afraid to go back in time and grab a SUNN cab from the late '60s to mid-'70s. Really solid builds. Another favorite are the Fender small Blackface cabs of the mid '60s. The later CBS versions are too big and bulky, but those 210, 212, 115 and 215 cabs are really great. And I've had good luck with most Peavey cabs from the '70s through the late '90s. I have a couple of pieces of Peavey gear that still look new.

Woodworking aside, put crappy speakers in a good cab and you will sound like ...crap. And sometimes a certain cab won't match up well with a specific amp. That can drive you crazy.

Bill

 

[JeffB]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Poor quality cabs are poor quality cabs, no matter how big.

They are just as detrimental as poor quality speakers, and poor quality amplifiers. They have a very direct effect on your tone.

Many modern marshall cabs are not what they used to be. Many are made with mdf and pb. This includes the 1936, and basic 1960s. Some 1960s, like the silver jubilee reissues, handwired, tv, etc are still ply. Buy old and used if you can.

Orange, MESA, Bogner, Friedman are probably the best of the well known/easily found cabs out there. They all have their own sound. I think the EVH cabs are a good value too. I have a 2x12, and I like it. A little bassy/dark due to the grill cloth and depth. I prefer a more middy and brighter cab like a Marshall, but for the $ the EVH was tough to beat.

 

[NecroPolo]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Buy old and used if you can.

I can only agree. That's why I started using battered steampunk looking ancient Laney Klipp cabs a decade ago or so. Before I tried everything from price friendly 1x12"s to one-ton Engl tanks. Although the last was killer, I was never fan of V30s I guess. Instead of swapping the speakers I decided to sell it back in time.

Now I'm totally happy with these old Laneys. They sound killer, are sort of really cheap used, made of some durable real wood, still they are super light and roboust and occassionally they can contain some rare and cool speakers like pre-production 20W Greenbacks. I also like that they look honestly ****ed up.

 

[NjuiMusic]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I like the Mesa cabs and have several. I LOVE the Mesa Thiele 112, and the older 212 and 412 Half-Back cabs, and I also have a newer 212 Horizontal Recto and the 112 ported Wide Body. I agree with the author, I really think that Mesa builds some of the best cabs around.

And don't be afraid to go back in time and grab a SUNN cab from the late '60s to mid-'70s. Really solid builds. Another favorite are the Fender small Blackface cabs of the mid '60s. The later CBS versions are too big and bulky, but those 210, 212, 115 and 215 cabs are really great. And I've had good luck with most Peavey cabs from the '70s through the late '90s. I have a couple of pieces of Peavey gear that still look new.

Woodworking aside, put crappy speakers in a good cab and you will sound like ...crap. And sometimes a certain cab won't match up well with a specific amp. That can drive you crazy.

Bill

thanks, I wrote the article, I just didn't want to look to advertising-y lol

 

[NjuiMusic]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I have only been playing and analyzing gear for 5-6 years now, so I haven't had much experience in terms of older gear, I am just referring to the current items in this article, I have heard old peavey cabs are good but I have only tried newer ones and have not really been impressed. But maybe the old ones were better. I hope you guys dig the article

 

[JeffB]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I have only been playing and analyzing gear for 5-6 years now, so I haven't had much experience in terms of older gear, I am just referring to the current items in this article, I have heard old peavey cabs are good but I have only tried newer ones and have not really been impressed. But maybe the old ones were better. I hope you guys dig the article

Edit- maybe just a FYI

One thing I noticed is that your description of the EVH g12m is...incorrect. it is not a modern take nor designed just for EVH or his amps.. it is the exact same speaker as the heritage g12m20 with a different cap over the magnet. It is designed to sound like the original 20w G12ms from the 66/67/early 68 period. And Celestion had been making them.for many years prior to EVH gear. Celestion has confirmed the Heritage and EVH are the same time and time again. They have been hesitant to flat out confirm the EVH can handle 25w each..which has made some evh 4x12 fans uneasy with their 100w 5153s. But probably the reason why they put H30s in the 2x12 when the 50w head was introduced.

Essentially the evh/heritage G12m20s are the closest thing to the greenback 12ms with pulsonic cones of the late 60s/early 70s. And the current chinese "greenback" g12m25 with the mueller cone is historically more accurate to the Blackback g12m of the mid to late 1970s...which is when they started using the kurt mueller cones.

 

[NjuiMusic]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Edit- maybe just a FYI

One thing I noticed is that your description of the EVH g12m is...incorrect. it is not a modern take nor designed just for EVH or his amps.. it is the exact same speaker as the heritage g12m20 with a different cap over the magnet. It is designed to sound like the original 20w G12ms from the 66/67/early 68 period. And Celestion had been making them.for many years prior to EVH gear. Celestion has confirmed the Heritage and EVH are the same time and time again. They have been hesitant to flat out confirm the EVH can handle 25w each..which has made some evh 4x12 fans uneasy with their 100w 5153s. But probably the reason why they put H30s in the 2x12 when the 50w head was introduced.

Essentially the evh/heritage G12m20s are the closest thing to the greenback 12ms with pulsonic cones of the late 60s/early 70s. And the current chinese "greenback" g12m25 with the mueller cone is historically more accurate to the Blackback g12m of the mid to late 1970s...which is when they started using the kurt mueller cones.

oh, thanks. I did not know this.

 

[Kamanda~SD]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Many modern marshall cabs are not what they used to be. Many are made with mdf and pb. This includes the 1936, and basic 1960s. Some 1960s, like the silver jubilee reissues, handwired, tv, etc are still ply. Buy old and used if you can.

I've only ever seen this on the back panels for some modern Marshall cabs...? I do agree with the old and used regardless, better construction and...price.

I then immediately sold the cheap 4x12 and own a Marshall 1960b which is a pretty nice cab, not as nice as a Mesa 4x12 but you know what they say, baby steps.

Have you every played your rig through a Mesa 4x12? I don't mean to sound harsh but I feel like you're regurgitating alot of what you have read vs actual experience. Mesa cabs are good, yes. But the difference between that and what you have isn't how most people describe it on the internet. Which brings me to my next point...

and good speakers are only half the battle, if you stick V30s in a Bugera cab or something, it still will lack. I find that is what people have a hard time grasping.

True. Cab construction is very important. However, I also feel people don't grasp the speaker selection as much either...one main reason people like the Mesa's over the Marshall's is the Stock G12T-75's vs V30's.

Compare a stock 1960B and Mesa vs a 1960B with V30's and a Mesa and you will see what I mean. Difference? Yes. But not nearly as large as you read about online.

 

[blueman335]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I never take a cab unless I have to, and I make sure the driver doesn't run up the meter.

 

[NjuiMusic]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I've only ever seen this on the back panels for some modern Marshall cabs...? I do agree with the old and used regardless, better construction and...price.



Have you every played your rig through a Mesa 4x12? I don't mean to sound harsh but I feel like you're regurgitating alot of what you have read vs actual experience. Mesa cabs are good, yes. But the difference between that and what you have isn't how most people describe it on the internet. Which brings me to my next point...



True. Cab construction is very important. However, I also feel people don't grasp the speaker selection as much either...one main reason people like the Mesa's over the Marshall's is the Stock G12T-75's vs V30's.

Compare a stock 1960B and Mesa vs a 1960B with V30's and a Mesa and you will see what I mean. Difference? Yes. But not nearly as large as you read about online.

I have, and yeah speaker choice is a much larger factor in a "good cab" with that term even being subjective. When I was referring to Mesa I was referring to the quality in build, a Mesa cab is built better then a Marshall cab, regardless. speaker choice between the 2 is also important but switching speakers is not an incredibly common thing, most people buy a cab and use it till it either breaks or they want another for whatever reason.

and to your 2nd, Mesa vs stock marshall then Mesa vs Marshall with same speakers they will sound pretty identical but what I am trying to say is, the quality in build between the Marshall and Mesa are very different but once you go to a proper Marshall 4x12, anything more expensive then that like a Mesa 4x12 you won't notice much of a difference when it comes to the sound in terms of how well it is built but then cabs don't stop getting better once they sound good, they have to keep it together, which is one thing Mesa's do a lot better then Marshall cabs do.

 

[Lucy Diamond]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I own the major go to cabs and I have to say that over the years I prefer the spread of a 2x12 cab.

My favorite being a 2x12 open back cab with Celestian Greenbacks that I bought from Avatar about 10 years ago.

I love my Mesa 4x12 and the 2x12 but the closed backs lose something with me.

My Marshall 1969A is very lively and oddly enough, I love it for cleans. Sometimes I just take the speaker out from my Blues Deluxe and put it into that cab. This pairing is blissful to me.

 

[Demanic]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I have an old Carvin 4x12 and that thing is built like a tank. I can stand on the steel grill screen. It has the much maligned 12m-70's in it. I don't know why they are so hated, the mid spike just slices through the mix. Plus they seem to have a nice deep bottom to them.
A friend has an old Randall 4x12 with Jaguars and 70/80's in it. While still solid I think it's MDF. The Jaguars are supposed to be similar to the Vintage 30's. The cab doesn't seem to have as much bottom with a lot more mids. The 70/80's do add a nice top sizzle though.

Sent from my MotoE2(4G-LTE) using Tapatalk

 

[Lampy H]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I have one of those old Carvins too, it rules.

 

[Kamanda~SD]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

When I was referring to Mesa I was referring to the quality in build, a Mesa cab is built better then a Marshall cab, regardless.

The quality in build between the Marshall and Mesa are very different but once you go to a proper Marshall 4x12, anything more expensive then that like a Mesa 4x12 you won't notice much of a difference when it comes to the sound in terms of how well it is built but then cabs don't stop getting better once they sound good, they have to keep it together, which is one thing Mesa's do a lot better then Marshall cabs do.

I agree that both cabs are top notch, however, I do want to mention a few things as I still believe most of this is from what you have read, and not seen. My main point here being the build METHODS are very different, but not the QUALITY.

'Better Quality Build' is very subjective here as both use different cabinet construction. Ever opened one up and stripped the tolex?

-Marshall is generally 3/4" Baltic Birtch Plywood. Depending on year, the back panel is either plywood or some lesser material.
-Mesa up until somewhere in the 90's as Luan Plywood (I believe 3/4" as well but don't quote). Currently Baltic Birtch.

-Marshall uses glues Dovetail Joints
-Mesa uses half-lap Rabbet joints that they reinforce with nails/ wire brads

-Marshall has grill cloth right on the baffle
-Mesa has separate grille board

-Mesa does have more reinforcements in the baffle, and in some I've seen have a nice recess where the speaker sort of sits 'in' the baffle rather than 'on'

So does this mean one is better Quality? No, just different. I WILL say the one thing I do like about the Mesa's over the Marshall's is their baffle/ grille board design. Other than that, it's all preference.

 

[DeadandBuried]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

Over the years at cab-share gigs I've noticed the difference between cheaper brand cabs and the more higher budget ones. Like at one show I played through a Randall or something and it sounded really crap. Marshall's are a common cab brand and with V30's I can hear the brightness a bit more. Orange cabs are pretty cool too, but I've never played my 6505+ through a Mesa cab yet which is supposed to be the perfect match. I will say Orange and Mesa's are heavy as **** to carry around, I have a Marshall 4 x 12 and thankfully its not as heavy!

 

[Mincer]

Re: What is your opinion on cabs

I would dig 4 x 12s more if I wasn't the one carrying them. With good PA systems, it is becoming less of an issue, although it still looks like rock n roll.