What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

[Mr Clean]

I've been trying to tune the Pearly Gates in my Les Paul Studio, and I seem to keep going from too dark to too bright.

Here's what I've tried so far:

250KA vol/500KL tone/.022 cap - Neck turns to mud, bridge workable but tone stays on 10.

500KA vol/500KL tone/.022 cap - Neck mud gone but quite bright, tone control stays under 5, treble on amp 0. Bridge pretty much the same but brighter.

500KA vol/500KL tone/.047 cap - Neck not muddy but anything under 10 on tone kills top end harmonics quickly. Bridge workable, but again, tone stays on 10.

Not sure where to go from here. Thinking about going to a 250K volume pot with a treble bleed. Might try the 300K linear on volume even though they say "tone control only". Linear pots seem to work okay for volume on my Carvin's. Also might try sticking with the 500k/500k/.022 but soldering on some covers.

I'm curious what circuits others are running and maybe getting some insights on what move to make from here. I love the Pearly's growl, and I think if I can get my tone control to effectively dial the brightness in and out I'll be in Heaven (pun intended:smokin

 

[dvanburen]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

I dont use the pg but in my les paul i did the rs guitarworks modern wiring kit with 500k pots and it was a huge upgrade. no complaints from me. No mud and not too bright. just big open clear sound with tight bottom

 

[Gone_Shootin]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

500k volume, 500k tone, .047uf cap for my PGn.

 

[blueman335]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

- I use 500K's on my neck HB's, and in LP's usually a 1-meg or two (volume and/or tone). PGN's have a warm, mellow tone, and certainly don't need a 250K to take away any more treble.

- In the bridge slot, I use 250K's on most PU's. PGB's are bright, and I don't see any sense in using 500K's with them. Way more treble than I'll ever use.

This way I get the EQ's balanced for each PU with the tone pots on '10.' If anything still needs tweaking, I'll swap a magnet.

 

[Mr Clean]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

After a little thought I ordered some A4 magnets and 300K pots last night. I think I'll start with an A4 in the neck, hopefully that'll give me a little bit of the articulation I want without removing all the PG attitude. I'm not sure if the A4 will make it brighter, but if it does I'll then go to the 300K pot.

On the bridge I don't see doing much besides changing the pot.

I'll post what I think when I'm done!!!

 

[blueman335]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

Good plan. An A4 will add some treble, but not a lot. It'll firm up the low-end too. A4's were used in a lot of the original PAF's, and it's Lindy Fralin's magnet-of-choice in his PAF's and P-90's. A number of members like A4's in neck PAF's (like '59's). For me, a PGB definitely needs 250K's to get it to balance with the neck. With 500K's it's 'treble city.'

Report back.

 

[mojosman]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

I bought a vintage style wiring harness from Tundratone.com. I told him I was putting a set of PG's in my Les Paul. He says I got you covered. He sent me this:

He used 500k CTS pots, and Sprague caps. The sound is a huge upgrade over the stock set up. Mine came with 490/498 pickups and the that crappy PC board tone set up.

I went from this:

To this:

Good luck with getting to where you want to go.

 

[dvanburen]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

yeah thats similar to the rs upgrade i did and it was a vast improvement over stock. sometimes just replacing the crappy stock electronics with quality components will make a world of difference. and its a simple and not very expensive mod.

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

I've never heard a PG that was "too dark" or that "turns to mud". Especially with two 500k pots...even with .047mu caps, unless you have the tone control below 5.

 

[blueman335]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

I've never heard a PG that was "too dark" or that "turns to mud". Especially with two 500k pots...even with .047mu caps, unless you have the tone control below 5.

PGN's are too dark for me in LP's with 500K pots. Just not enough high-end; too mellow and smooth for my tastes. A2P's and Seth's have more treble in the neck slot, and a little bite, which is why I like them much better. I don't think the PG set is a particularly good pairing. Bridge is pretty bright, and the neck is pretty warm. Not as drastic as the 498T/490R, but headed in that direction. But then, some players like a big contrast between bridge and neck PU's, I don't, I find that frustrating.

You know Doc, for someone who is so adamant about bridge PU's having 500K's and an abundance of treble, I'm surprised that theory isn't applied to your neck PU's. You think my bridge PU's are muffled with 250K's, but they have a lot more treble and bite than a PGN with 500K's. I'm in the process of converting all my neck HB's to have unbalanced coils to get more treble out of them, either thru hybrid coils, spin-a-split, or Artie's coil swap mod. I have a low tolerence threshold for warm/dark neck PU's. I want to get both PU's in a range of acceptable EQ (by my standards), regardless of which slot they're in. I don't cut the neck PU's any slack. I guess I'm surprised as to why a neck PU tone players like, would be absolutely unacceptable to them in a bridge PU as being way too dark and muffled. I look at it as: 'Either it's a good, usable tone or not, regardless of which slot it is.'

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

i like 500k for both and .022 caps. Pretty standard really.
Not just for pearly gates tho (although i did use these values for my set) but pretty much any humbucker set.

 

[MasterKtulu]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

After trying a lot of different combinations for my PGn in my Les Paul, I settled with CTS 500k Audio pots for both Vol & Tone with a .015uf Russian K40Y-9 paper-in-oil cap (I use the same setup for my PGb, except I use a .022uf cap).

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

i like 500k for both and .022 caps.

+1

My only other stipulation is that the pot resistance taper be Audio (logarithmic) rather than Linear. I do not generally add a treble bypass network across the volume pot terminals.

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

PGN's are too dark for me in LP's with 500K pots. Just not enough high-end; too mellow and smooth for my tastes. A2P's and Seth's have more treble in the neck slot, and a little bite, which is why I like them much better. I don't think the PG set is a particularly good pairing. Bridge is pretty bright, and the neck is pretty warm. Not as drastic as the 498T/490R, but headed in that direction. But then, some players like a big contrast between bridge and neck PU's, I don't, I find that frustrating.

You know Doc, for someone who is so adamant about bridge PU's having 500K's and an abundance of treble, I'm surprised that theory isn't applied to your neck PU's. You think my bridge PU's are muffled with 250K's, but they have a lot more treble and bite than a PGN with 500K's. I'm in the process of converting all my neck HB's to have unbalanced coils to get more treble out of them, either thru hybrid coils, spin-a-split, or Artie's coil swap mod. I have a low tolerence threshold for warm/dark neck PU's. I want to get both PU's in a range of acceptable EQ (by my standards), regardless of which slot they're in. I don't cut the neck PU's any slack. I guess I'm surprised as to why a neck PU tone players like, would be absolutely unacceptable to them in a bridge PU as being way too dark and muffled. I look at it as: 'Either it's a good, usable tone or not, regardless of which slot it is.'

Well, yes, you are right about me generally liking lots of treble in the bridge pups. However, I have several guitars where I have really tried to get lots of mids and much less treble in the bridge slot.

I AM one of those guys who likes a big difference in the tones of bridge vs neck pups. I like variety and versatility in most of my guitars. I have quite a few guitars that are put together to have some very specific sounds for limited applications, but most are set up for pretty extreme variety. And in a couple guitars I even have 250k vol pots for the neck pup. I could never really understand why I would want a bright neck pup when I could get that bright sound from my bridge pup. Why have two pups (in one guitar) that both sound the same?!

However, I'm very open to explanations if you'd care to enlighten me. Really. I guess there is something that I'm missing.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

The PGn is my favorite Duncan Neck Humbucker. I always used 500K CTS pots and a .02 cap connected to the middle terminal of the volume pot - the 50's Mod. The 50's Mod will help retain treble when you roll the volume down. You might also consider using a no-load tone pot although I didn't find that to be necessary.

I have never liked anything less than 500K for my volume and tone pots when using humbuckers. 250K or even 300K throws away to much treble and clarity - and once that treble clarity is gone, it's gone.

Only humbucker I've ever used with 250K that actually sounded OK was the JB. That's a pickup almost everyone seems to think is to bright with 500K pots. It's like the Vintage 30 of pickups.

Another thing: the pickups in Billy G's Les Paul have the nickel covers on them. I also prefer the covers on humbuckers. If your guitar sounds to bright to you with 500K pots, keep the pots and put the covers on the pickups. To me, they sound "right" with the covers on.

Guys like Eric Clapton and Jeff Beck started removing the covers in the 1960's to brighten their Gibsons up - now, 50 years later, many players complain about their uncovered humbuckers being to bright. So put the covers back on.

 

[blueman335]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

Well, yes, you are right about me generally liking lots of treble in the bridge pups...I AM one of those guys who likes a big difference in the tones of bridge vs neck pups. I like variety and versatility in most of my guitars. I have quite a few guitars that are put together to have some very specific sounds for limited applications, but most are set up for pretty extreme variety. And in a couple guitars I even have 250k vol pots for the neck pup. I could never really understand why I would want a bright neck pup when I could get that bright sound from my bridge pup. Why have two pups (in one guitar) that both sound the same?!

However, I'm very open to explanations if you'd care to enlighten me. Really. I guess there is something that I'm missing.

It's not that you're missing anything, just a matter of taste. I EQ my PU's to be closer to each other in EQ, so they both sound great with one amp EQ setting. They still sound different from each other, it's just no longer the day/night kind of difference (which drives me crazy). I'm not looking for 'extreme variety' from one guitar. When I want a bigger difference in tones, I'll switch guitars (and you really should have two guitars at a gig anyways). What I often see bands doing is EQ'ing for one PU, and when they switch to the other, it's either very dark, or bright and piercing. A lot of times they just end up using one PU the whole gig. The path of least resistence, but not an ideal solution. That's what I used to do too. With the help of this forum, I learned how to get usable tones from both PU's.

I'm also using light gauge strings (9's) and thin picks with a beveled edge that give a sharper, brighter sound. If I was playing with 10's or 11's and used thick picks with rounded edges, that might make it too warm for me. Don't forget, as you age you gradually lose the ability to hear high frequncies, a situation aggrevated by years of loud music. Not that I'm a spring chicken by any means, but some of the most vocal guys here about having bright bridge PU's are guys in their 60's.

 

[blueman335]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

The PGn is my favorite Duncan Neck Humbucker.

Are you using it in a Strat or LP?

 

[Mr Clean]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

I have come to suspect that the Pearly's that I am having such a hard time tuning to the guitar probably have had the magnets degaussed. I think this happened when I moved about 18 months ago - I vaguely remember seeing the guitar case in the shipping container right up against my boxed up Magnepan speakers. The guitar probably spent close to a month in the container, and my guess is the Maggie's did a number on the pickup magnets.

After playing a friends guitar with PG's I noticed right away that the output was much stronger. I don't have any means to measure the magnets strength, but using a compass, it seems the pickups in my other guitars effect the compass from further away and snaps the dial a little more firmly. Not very scientific, but repeatable and consistent.

Probably after the holiday's I'll contact Duncan and see if I can order a set of magnets for them. Several friends have suggested I just buy a pair of A2 magnets, but I do believe Pearly Gates have calibrated magnets. I saw a video online awhile ago where they were swapping magnets in Pearly Gates and the aftermarket A2's sounded different than the one's that the pickup came with. The guy doing the swapping ended up staying with the Duncan A2's and from what I could tell from the internet audio, they did sound the best.

I wanted to follow up on this post to make sure that I am adding good info to the knowledge base. While PG's are immensely popular, they do get accused of being overly bright sometimes. This was not the case here, and I'm disappointed that it took me so long to figure out what the problem was (and by accident at that).

 

[AlexR]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

I would doubt very much if the Duncan mags were calibrated for a production line pickup. What you probably find is that the source for raw materials for the Duncan mags and the aftermarket had different compositions, or that the charge applied to them to magnetise them was of a different level.

 

[ItsaBass]

Re: What pots/caps are you running with Pearly Gates in Les Paul???

500K linear for volume and tone. .01 uF cap for bridge pickup and .0047 uF for neck pickup.