whats with the solid state hate?

[blueman335]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

I think there's a definite place for tube amps at home, practicing and noodling around, and testing PU swaps and rewiring. I don't want to be powering up tubes that often for those kind of things.

Taking into account room acoustics and less-than-ideal volume mixes, onstage, with a decent SS amp and maybe some pedals, no one in the audience is going to know whether it's tube or SS. Another thing is that not every owner of a tube amp knows how to dial it in for the best sound. I've certainly seen plenty of players with tube amps that managed to get mediocre tones, something may not realize from their vantage point on stage. Plugging into a tube amp isn't a guarantee that beautiful, rich tones will automatically flow from it.

 

[dazedandconfused001]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

I think there's a definite place for tube amps at home, practicing and noodling around, and testing PU swaps and rewiring. I don't want to be powering up tubes that often for those kind of things.

Taking into account room acoustics and less-than-ideal volume mixes, onstage, with a decent SS amp and maybe some pedals, no one in the audience is going to know whether it's tube or SS. Another thing is that not every owner of a tube amp knows how to dial it in for the best sound. I've certainly seen plenty of players with tube amps that managed to get mediocre tones, something may not realize from their vantage point on stage. Plugging into a tube amp isn't a guarantee that beautiful, rich tones will automatically flow from it.

so thats kinda why i like ss cuz i feel m amp should sound the same no matter where im at. like obviously acoustics will affect sound but i mean tubs are just to finicky. like when they work well theyre amazing but when they dont well whats the point? i like my amps without a maybe it will maybe it wont ya know?

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

so thats kinda why i like ss cuz i feel m amp should sound the same no matter where im at. like obviously acoustics will affect sound but i mean tubs are just to finicky. like when they work well theyre amazing but when they dont well whats the point? i like my amps without a maybe it will maybe it wont ya know?

No, I don't know.

I've been playing live for almost 45 years, and always used valve (tube) amps, and never had any problems other than valves eventually sounding flat and lifeless as they reach the end of their useable life ... and that's just expected, they wear like car tyres wear. The user usually knows this going in.

Nowdays there are some stupidly cheap tube amps, and they are likely to be trouble because they're built to a price, and ya get what ya pay for. But a decent tube amp, treated with some respect, is no more or less prone to problems than a s/s amp. Indeed it is cheaper to build a s/s amp than an equivalent tube amp, and to be honest, I get the feeling this is at the core of your thread ... cheapness and the justification of such.

Tell us about the tube amps you've owned and used ....

 

[blueman335]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Indeed it is cheaper to build a s/s amp than an equivalent tube amp, and to be honest, I get the feeling this is at the core of your thread ... cheapness and the justification of such.

For home use it's easy to justify a small SS amp for noodling. The question is more for what people use on stage. You can't beat a good tube amp. Onstage is a cheap tube amp preferable to a higher quality SS amp?

 

[Securb]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

For home use it's easy to justify the use of a small SS amp for noodling. The question is more for what people use on stage. You can't beat a good tube amp. Onstage is a cheap tube amp preferable to a higher quality SS amp?

I would take a JC120, Orange Stripe Randell or a VS100 on stage anyday of the week. I have gigged with all three many times with great results.

 

[Mincer]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

I've been using a Fractal AX8 lately, and it sounds great in rooms big or small, through monitors or using IEMs. Really beautiful sounds come out of that.

 

[Godin15]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

I don't believe there is a hate for SS it all comes down to personal preference. I had a MarshallCFX15 SS it was ok played it for 3 mts it had all gizmos reverb and the works. But it just wasn't giving me the tones I liked. Took my guitar down to my local shop spent an hour and a half plugging into amps. I wasn't looking for the most powerful amp. I was looking for a compact, lightweight all around sounding amp for practice and for studio use. After trying out SS and tube amps the one for me I liked the most was the Vox AC4C1 tube. The nice thing about tube amps is that you can also change the tones using different tubes.

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Onstage is a cheap tube amp preferable to a higher quality SS amp?

That, in my worthless opinion, is a grey area, and something only the individual user can decide on a case-by-case basis.

The OP should tell us about his experiences with valve (tube) amps, the one's he's owned and used, to balance his scenario.

 

[DrNewcenstein]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Obviously the second-hand market come's into the equation when working to a lower budget, and that bring's it's own set of parameter's for both type's.

This is one point in the "pricey vs affordable/budget-priced" question regarding any musical gear that has always bugged me, especially when someone mentions they got a "crackhead" deal on a piece of gear that typically sells on the used market in the "pricey" range. They equate that particular purchase's price to the item falling into the "affordable" or "budget" category, and thus declare you can get high-quality at low prices "all day long, if you look around".

Hence, in these discussions, I discount the used market, because obviously if someone scores a vintage well-cared-for Marshall SuperLead head or Bluesbreaker combo for the same price as a brand-new Bugera, they're going to come in and say "oh yeah, inexpensive gear is highly reliable for gigging, you're just paying extra for the nameplate and marketing budget and artist freebies".

 

[dazedandconfused001]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

well i did completely discount the modabilty of tube amps although that does make me wonder if some one got a crappy cheap tube amp and put decent tubes in it would it still be crappy? but as far as my experience goes i base all my opinion of tubes on the ones ive played in shops because in my current budget/budget for the last 6years i can afford a cheap crappy ss amp, a decent ss amp or a crappy used tube amp. now honestly a did get to play an awesome jetcity amp that i still regret not buying. but that said i dont look at/for used gear because usually if i can get a 2000dollar amp for like 500 used that tells me something is wrong with that amp. my opinion is also swayed in the fact that i dont have the luxury of being able to play live or all that loud because of my location and crappy neighbors. so in my limited experience i decided early on to go ss. i also am not able to baby my gear so tube replacement would also be an issue. again im not saying all tubes are bad, im just saying i think ss fits my needs more.

 

[Red_Label]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Marshall Valvestates:



(I guess each one technically has one tube in it, so there's two tubes on stage there.)

I've had Valvestates as well. They were decent amps. But still aren't the same as having tubes in the power-amp section. So many hybrids put a tube in the pre-amp and go solid state with the power-amp. That might give the amp the partial feel of an all-tube amp... but it still doesn't give it the headroom and the punch in my experience. I've been playing live for over 32 years and tried/had just about everything out there in the mass market, and have formed my opinion based on that live experience. I really wanted to find a non-tube amp that could cut it. The thought of not having to replace tubes or bias or warm-up an amp appeals to me greatly. But so far... I'm still not sold. Even my Eleven Rack and Kemper weren't exactly like a real tube amp (though they were as close as anything).

Haven't tried any of the Quilter amps yet I must confess. If there was one locally, I'd been chomping at the bit to try it. My local shop finally got some Yamaha THR100s in recently. Based on the tone/feel of the THR5 and THR10s... I had high hopes for the 100 being a great backup to my primaries... or even the hope that it might replace them as a gigging amp. Its cleans are great IMO, but the overdrive tones are lack-luster and uninspiring to me. A big disappointment for me.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Hence, in these discussions, I discount the used market, because obviously if someone scores a vintage well-cared-for Marshall SuperLead head or Bluesbreaker combo for the same price as a brand-new Bugera, they're going to come in and say "oh yeah, inexpensive gear is highly reliable for gigging, you're just paying extra for the nameplate and marketing budget and artist freebies".

Eh..I'll bite

Truth be told I'd feel more secure gigging with my 3 yr old Bugera 333xl than I would gigging with a 30yr old, pre-owned (possibly countless times over) Marshall Superlead/bluesbreaker. If it was scored from a blues lawyer, maybe it was well cared for (..don't see them parting with theirs for Bugera prices though) ..from a crackhead..maybe not. I know the Bugera jokes...but I've actually seen a lot of old Marshall's give up the ghost onstage (sometimes pretty spectacularly...) and I'm yet to personally see a Bugera do that.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

No hate for ss here.
I just prefer playing through tubes rather than transistors.
I think it is due to the harmonic series and overtones.
Transistors seem to always have a single harmonic overtone when they distort, whereas tubes reproduce the harmonic series of every note.

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Hey OP, let's try this hypothetical scenario ...

You have your s/s amp and seem to enjoy it. Somebody gives you or lends you a mid-range tube amp, maybe something like a Peavey Classic in good working order. It's yours to use as you wish, with just a few basic instructions on treating it well (let it cool down before moving it, etc.) Do you think you'd end up prefering your s/s amp, the tube amp, or have uses for both ? Do you think you'd spend much time with it before making your own conclusions about which you liked best ?

There is/ was a member here called 'RavenDouglas' who had a music room with a couple of 4 x 12 cabs, and he would post about various s/s heads he acquired, extolling the virtues of each as they came along. He seemed happy.His threads often got comments along the lines of "you should try a tube amp, man", but like I said, he was happy with his s/s heads. Then one day he posted that he'd finally acquired his first tube head (nothing expensive or fancy, maybe a big old Peavey or something like that). He couldn't stop raving about it and it's sound, and gushed with thanks to all those who had been suggesting for a long time he try one.

No particular point in relating that, just an observation.

 

[Phantasmagoria]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Honestly, I just look at them (tube/SS) as different flavours (that are increasingly becoming very tough to tell apart)

The thing is, SS has come a fair way in recent times. I'd say if a tube snob were to play a good modern SS amp , he might actually be in for a pretty pleasant surprise as well

Not to say there are'nt some great sounding older SS/hybrid heads, but those do mostly tend to fall in the metal/death metal or really clean camps.

Not all of them though: This one has some SWEET classic tones!

 

[dazedandconfused001]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Hey OP, let's try this hypothetical scenario ...

You have your s/s amp and seem to enjoy it. Somebody gives you or lends you a mid-range tube amp, maybe something like a Peavey Classic in good working order. It's yours to use as you wish, with just a few basic instructions on treating it well (let it cool down before moving it, etc.) Do you think you'd end up prefering your s/s amp, the tube amp, or have uses for both ? Do you think you'd spend much time with it before making your own conclusions about which you liked best ?

There is/ was a member here called 'RavenDouglas' who had a music room with a couple of 4 x 12 cabs, and he would post about various s/s heads he acquired, extolling the virtues of each as they came along. He seemed happy.His threads often got comments along the lines of "you should try a tube amp, man", but like I said, he was happy with his s/s heads. Then one day he posted that he'd finally acquired his first tube head (nothing expensive or fancy, maybe a big old Peavey or something like that). He couldn't stop raving about it and it's sound, and gushed with thanks to all those who had been suggesting for a long time he try one.

No particular point in relating that, just an observation.

honestly if i could get my get my grubby little paws on a tube head i would love to give one a test run. i wont know for sure until i get one though, i personally am a very big fan of pedals and from my understanding tube distortion is one of the main reasons people love tubes so idk. its one of those ill know when i know. from what ive played of tubes how ever i personally prefer my ss amp because it sounds great with my pedal board, requires no matenince, is a solid workhorse, and is in no way fragile. after i get my new pc though im planing on gettin my 1st 'big boy amp' lol right now all ive ever owned is ss combos and im hoping to get a Randall RX120RH and RX412 Half Stack.

 

[aleclee]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

well.. there is good SS and then there is WTF bad SS

Pretty much. Most SS amps were designed to be as cheap as possible, not to sound great. Ones that weren't designed with such tight cost restrictions (Randall RG or GK ML) do much better.

Of course, some of this is attributed to the fact that 100 tube watts is way louder than 100 SS watts.

Actually, 100 tube watts through the speaker is identical to 100 SS watts. What's different is how the two technologies behave as they approach max rated power. Throw in the behavior of a high voltage power supply, the phase inverter (source of crunch in many tube amps) and output transformer and you might come to the conclusion that the glowing bottles impart less mojo than you previously thought.

 

[Gplayerzzz]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

I love tube amps, and have had a few. But i also like my peavey XXL, which is SS. SS is great for lower volume playing.

 

[dominus]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

honestly if i could get my get my grubby little paws on a tube head i would love to give one a test run. i wont know for sure until i get one though, i personally am a very big fan of pedals and from my understanding tube distortion is one of the main reasons people love tubes so idk. its one of those ill know when i know. from what ive played of tubes how ever i personally prefer my ss amp because it sounds great with my pedal board, requires no matenince, is a solid workhorse, and is in no way fragile. after i get my new pc though im planing on gettin my 1st 'big boy amp' lol right now all ive ever owned is ss combos and im hoping to get a Randall RX120RH and RX412 Half Stack.

Skip the RX if you can. It's *okay*, but there are better Randalls out there. Try to get an RG.

 

[Brandenburg]

Re: whats with the solid state hate?

Skip the RX if you can. It's *okay*, but there are better Randalls out there. Try to get an RG.

been meaning to ask smeone.. how do the newer rg's compare to the classic 80's rg