Where/when did "modern" guitar tone begin?

[Solarflares]

You seem to know what you are talking about, but this take is bad. If we are considering your scope, which is a lot broader than the others here, Robert Johnson deserves the title more than Jimi. He wasn't as prolific of a guitar player, but his sound found its way into everyone's sound. Robert Lockwood Junior, Muddy Waters, Elmore James, Eric Clapton, Keith Richards, Peter Green, Led Zeppelin, Gary Moore, Eric Johnson, and basically everyone ever to some extent.

My scope goes way back to Paganini’s Guitar Concertos. Oh to be a fly on the wall there.
Fernando Sor was a real badass, but I’ll bet ol’ Nicoli was a monster.
Robert Johnson was lucky to be recorded, but thank goodness someone did.
Yardstick, benchmark, or whatever. He deserves his place as a forefather of popular mainstream performance guitar.
Jimi took a lot from everywhere and everyone, paid his dues ten times over as a sideman, was a supreme showman, and controlled equipment that would have the hardest modern rockers in tears. A real bandleader. A prolific songwriter. A visionary of dreamscapes and true extremes of emotion, which he put into his music - when his peers were still writing songs about boy meets girl stuff, and fast cars.

 

[Mincer]

I'll take McLaughlin, Fripp, and Steve Howe.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Well, but for the topic this thread is on, EVH did have a pretty direct influence. He had the 5150 voiced to his taste. Like 50% of the people who have posted in this thread mentioned the 5150 as a tool used in "Modern" tone, which we haven't agreed on what it means, BTW. But the 5150 keeps popping up.

 

[Solarflares]

But the 5150 keeps popping up.

The 5150 was an affordable high gain amp. When alternatives were silly money. With an average age of 50 on this forum, I would imagine 50% of people actually owned one, or at least played one in their teens.
The Wolfgang guitar is likewise - affordable.
At that time (1993), to be able to have Eddie’s complete rig for $1000 was a dream come true for most.
I would imagine the glasses are quite rose-tinted looking back.
If people think that VH1 is a fantastic album, then by the same token they will claim the 5150 to be the best amp ever made, and the Wolfgang guitar to be the unsung hero of a bygone age.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

The 5150 was an affordable high gain amp. When alternatives were silly money. With an average age of 50 on this forum, I would imagine 50% of people actually owned one, or at least played one in their teens.
The Wolfgang guitar is likewise - affordable.
At that time (1993), to be able to have Eddie’s complete rig for $1000 was a dream come true for most.
I would imagine the glasses are quite rose-tinted looking back.
If people think that VH1 is a fantastic album, then by the same token they will claim the 5150 to be the best amp ever made, and the Wolfgang guitar to be the unsung hero of a bygone age.

I'm not saying it's the best amp ever made, but the fact that it was affordable didn't mean it was not good-sounding. It's been on countless "Modern" records by people who have access to much fancier stuff.

I'm not really arguing it's good, honestly. I mean, I like it, but others may not. But it's been on quite a few records that may be pertinent for this thread.

 

[Solarflares]

Give me a night in Electric Ladyland with a Peavey Backstage 20, and a Raptor Plus - and I’ll define guitar tone for the next 100 years! Lol
From the royalties I promise to buy a 5150 and a Predator for the second album.
But I want a week in Monserrat.

 

[AdrianSD]

If people think that VH1 is a fantastic album, then by the same token they will claim the 5150 to be the best amp ever made, and the Wolfgang guitar to be the unsung hero of a bygone age.

Side note: I don't get people obsession with VH1 tone, I just do not get it full stop. S.o.r.r.y
Welcome to the forum btw!

 

[Chistopher]

This thread has inadvertently brought up a really cool difference in the way people think.

When I first read it, I only thought of "modern guitar sound" to mean hardware. But several other people took it to mean modern guitar playing.

EVH, Hendrix, Iommi, and others had the benefit of new toys to help them carve a new sound, but I'd argue the more influential guitar players didn't have any of that.

Django Reinhardt invented lead guitar near as I can tell.

Robert Johnson gave us fingerstyle to create melody and bass line at the same time

Muddy Waters gave us riff-oriented playing

B.B. King mastered vibrato and less-is-more style playing

T Bone Walker all but invented the moderm guitar solo

Chuck Berry showed us what you can do with double stops

Chet Atkins gave us modern country pickin

Duane Eddy invented twangy whammy dips

Hendrix combined rhythm and lead, showed us how to embellish chords, and invented a lot of cool tricks

Al Di Meola set an example of how clean and precise you can pick at speed. Also tied flamenco to shred

Holdsworth gave us outside harmony

EVH et al brought tapping into the mainstream. He also added extreme dive bomb techniques to the guitar library.

Yngwie added classical theory to shred

Some of these guys had the benefits of new toys, and I certainly didnt remember everyone, but if you strip away the hardware it becomes interesting how the order of who is the most pioneering shifts. Some of the older guys I listed don't really sound "interesting" to a casual listener purely because their sound was so influential that it became guitar music.

 

[Chistopher]

In that same breath, I would argue Steve Holmes is the biggest guitar pioneer of the last 30 years, even if most here don't know who he is.

 

[Securb]

EVH, Hendrix, Iommi, and others had the benefit of new toys to help them carve a new sound, but I'd argue the more influential guitar players didn't have any of that.

I was thinking Tony Iommi might be the father of the modern heavy guitar tone, and what’s wild is that he created it on the first Black Sabbath album with a pretty simple rig built around a Vox AC30 Top Boost. For that record he used his Gibson SG, tuned down because of his finger injury, running into the AC30 with a Dallas Rangemaster treble booster pushing the front end of the amp.

That setup gave him that thick, dark, saturated sound without huge amounts of gain, more of an overdriven, compressed roar than modern distortion, but it made the riffs sound massive.

 

[Chistopher]

Yeah, it gave him quite the clean sound too

 

[marcello252]

what a strange thread.

I ended up asking myself if a modern guitar tone ever existed

 

[Securb]

what a strange thread.

I ended up asking myself if a modern guitar tone ever existed

The modern tone era shall begin with my next album! I jest!

 

[Solarflares]

If you listen to Stone Free live from the Jimi Hendrix concerts - his sound eventually transcends into something you’d imagine emitting from an alien spaceship.
Burning of the Midnight Lamp, Are You Experienced, lots of it was very dark.
But Voodoo Chile broke the mould completely.
The opening E chord is pure rock, heavy-metal, modern guitar, satanic worship, Olympic standard cacophony, panty-wetting sonic assault, pure filth, with not a pedal in sight, except Wah.
The sound that would send Eric Clapton and Jeff Beck running to the toilets to throw up and cuddle each other sobbing uncontrollably.
That was the real beginning.

 

[marcello252]

you are talking to a Jimi's devotee , I've always said that my god is black and left handed

 

[Solarflares]

you are talking to a Jimi's devotee , I've always said that my god is black and left handed

Mind you - Tony Iommi wore all black clothes, had black amps and speakers, a black guitar, and was left-handed.
Just a small tin of black boot-polish, and being born in Seattle 5 years earlier, and he might have been a contender!

 

[Binnerscot]

Van Halen 1?
I’m afraid to say that I found the album a bit of a joke.
Aside from the incredible impact of hearing Eddie’s tapping for the first time, the rest was a re-hash of Les Pauls licks and attempted cop-outs of Al Di Melos’s stuff, mixed with very mundane tried and trusted R&B licks - with added vibrato.
The mix was brash, in your face, and party-friendly - this wasn’t a band to get intimate with in small clubs.
Incredible that people revere this album, when we had guitar gems from Frank Zappa, Allan Holdsworth, Pat Travers, Frank Marino - all the same year.

As regards Jimi, you just declared yourself unqualified to even comment.
Fuzz not used here for the most part, if at all - pure Strat, amp, and Wah.
A real performance, from the best Bluesman of his generation, and beyond.

Then add the fuzz.

Then the Univibe

I think you're opening statement would get you ostracized from most places, good thing this place isn't like SnipersHide.

 

[Binnerscot]

Side note: I don't get people obsession with VH1 tone, I just do not get it full stop. S.o.r.r.y
Welcome to the forum btw!

The tone is a thing, but his playing with that tone is was makes it so unique, especially in context of his contemporaries. The guy spoke through his instruments, the tone was his dialect. It was, and still is a landslide.

 

[Solarflares]

I think you're opening statement would get you ostracized from most places, good thing this place isn't like SnipersHide.

Running with the devil, You Really Got Me, Jamie’s Cryin, Little Dreamer, and Ice Cream Man!
Quite basically WTF are you on?
Party band that sucked their way to the top, and made no bones about it. Dave Lee Roth’s pretty pouting mouth being the stuff record executives dreams are made of. Ok, the bassist is a bit chubby, but those other 3 boys? Yeah, clean ‘em up and grease ‘em well, ‘cos me, Ted, and all the other Warner Bros boys are having a little Crisco party in the office.

 

[Binnerscot]

Well, but for the topic this thread is on, EVH did have a pretty direct influence. He had the 5150 voiced to his taste. Like 50% of the people who have posted in this thread mentioned the 5150 as a tool used in "Modern" tone, which we haven't agreed on what it means, BTW. But the 5150 keeps popping up.

So far, from what I gather.... "modern tone" would be high gain punctuality post "boosted/modified Marshalls". Production amps that popped up would be Mark IIC+ and SLO in '84/'85, but not the most common and expensive. That became a trend and by '92, there were a number of options from a number of manufacturers, including the 5150 (which was inspired by the SLO).

I'll add, thrash introduced far more percussive use of guitar, high gain amps were pretty integral to that.