Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

[Gtrjunior]

I’m having a really hard time understanding how to set up the midi functions on my recent pedalboard build.
Is there anybody that has done this that could possibly help guide me through this?

I have 3 midi pedals:
All in this order through the Fx loop

Strymon Mobius
Duncan Amdromeda
Duncan Silver Lake Reverb

All to be controlled with a Musicomlab MKiii+ switcher. Yes, it’s an older model but it functions perfectly.

I know how to set the switcher up so I can turn individual pedals on/off within the patch’s 4 presets slots.
And I’ve got the Mobius set on midi channel 1, but I can’t figure out how to setup the other pedals on their own midi channels (the Mobius keeps switching the presets in the Duncan pedals).
And I don’t know how to make the midi message pick the specific bank/patches I want to have change.
The manual, to me is confusing because I don’t understand what the midi function chart is trying to tell me.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[PFDarkside]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

There are two general methods.

Option A (simple, works on all switchers):
Have the Switcher transmit MIDI PC 1 on the switcher’s patch 1.
Program each of the 3 devices to have the sound you want on each patch.
For example:
Patch 1 is clean so you have your clean loops, a light chorus on Mobius PC1, Slapback Delay on Andromeda PC1 and Spring Reverb on Silver Lake PC1.
Patch 2 is swampy rhythm, so you have your rhythm loops, Tremolo on Mobius PC2, Slapback Delay on Andromeda PC2 and Spring Reverb on Silver Lake PC2
Patch 3 is your rock rhythm, so you have your rock loops, “Bypass” on Mobius PC3, Digital Delay on Andromeda PC3 and Plate Reverb on Silver Lake PC3
Etc....

You’ll see that you have programmed similar things in different Patches. The Spring Reverb and Slapback Delay are in two patches of the Andromeda and Silver Lake. If you use a lot of similar sounds, it’s a lot of redundancy.

Option B (more involved, I think the Musicomlab will do it):
Program the Mobius, Andromeda and Silver Lake with your most used sounds.
Mobius (MIDI CH1): PC1 = Chorus, PC2 = Tremolo, etc.
Andromeda (MIDI CH2): PC1 = Slapback, PC2 = Digital delay, etc.
Silver Lake (MIDI CH3): PC1 = Spring Reverb, PC2 = Plate Reverb, etc.
Now on the Switcher you program each patch to transmit the PC on the MIDI channel you want.
Patch 1 from above would be the same loops plus MIDI CH1 PC1, MIDI CH2 PC1, MIDI CH3 PC1. (Chorus, Slapback, Spring)
Patch 2 from above would be the same loops plus MIDI CH1 PC2, MIDI CH2 PC1, MIDI CH3 PC1. (Tremolo, Slapback, Spring)

It allows you to reuse each of the patches you create many times. I’m assuming you are trying to do this. You’ll have to look at the manual to figure out how to send each patch change on the right channels. If I get a chance I’ll try to diges the manual.

What do you mean by the Mobius is changing the other pedals presets? If you are using MIDI, you shouldn’t be stepping on the Mobius at all. Regardless, I think in the Globals menu there is a setting for MIDI Transmit, and you want that off.

[Gtrjunior]

Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

The second example you wrote out is what I’m trying to do.
Just as you said, I’ll “pre-program” each pedal with the patches (sounds) I’ll use, assign each pedal as Ch1/2/3...
I currently can do the pre-programming/saving the sounds. That’s the easy part.
What I’m having a hard time with is setting each pedal to a specific midi channel and then how to assign those pre-programmed patches. I tried reading the manual but it’s all Greek to me.

I think what happened with the Mobius is that I went into the global menu and set it to “midi thru”and I’m assuming it was sending midi changes to the reverb and delay pedals(?)
I wasn’t actually stepping on the Mobius, I had it set to go on the clean channel with chorus (like your example) but it was automatically changing the Duncan pedals to then next bank of presets.

I also can’t figure out how to set the delay and reverb to midi ch 2/3 respectively. It doesn’t have the same menu that the Strymon does....
Maybe I need to download the Duncan editor and do it through the computer?

[PFDarkside]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

It looks like the Andromeda and Silver Lake are setup for MIDI Global Unless you use the librarian (on your pc) to change it. That means no matter what MIDI Channel you are transmitting on, they react. That seems like an oversight that you need the librarian to change it.

So.... I guess it’s time to get a USB cable and the software from the Duncan site. Or use Method A above....

[PFDarkside]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

You DO want MIDI THROUGH enabled on the Mobius, that allows the messages to pass to the next pedals. Once you get the Reverb and delay on Channels 2 and 3, they’ll only respond to those channels and I think some of your issues will be solved.

[Gtrjunior]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

It looks like the Andromeda and Silver Lake are setup for MIDI Global Unless you use the librarian (on your pc) to change it. That means no matter what MIDI Channel you are transmitting on, they react. That seems like an oversight that you need the librarian to change it.

So.... I guess it’s time to get a USB cable and the software from the Duncan site. Or use Method A above....

Ok, I’ll get a cable and see if I can set them to their own channels.
Give me a few days to get what I need....I’m sure I’m gonna need some more help!!!

Thank you for your great responses....clearly you know what you’re doing. I appreciate your help tremendously.

[Gtrjunior]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

You DO want MIDI THROUGH enabled on the Mobius, that allows the messages to pass to the next pedals. Once you get the Reverb and delay on Channels 2 and 3, they’ll only respond to those channels and I think some of your issues will be solved.

I actually downloaded the librarian earlier today but didn’t have a usb so I’ll need to get one.

[PFDarkside]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

Ok, I’ll get a cable and see if I can set them to their own channels.
Give me a few days to get what I need....I’m sure I’m gonna need some more help!!!

Thank you for your great responses....clearly you know what you’re doing. I appreciate your help tremendously.

No problem, I hope I can help. I’m familiar with the Boss switchers (ES8, ES5), so I’ll be learning the Musicomlab with you.

[Gtrjunior]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

No problem, I hope I can help. I’m familiar with the Boss switchers (ES8, ES5), so I’ll be learning the Musicomlab with you.

You clearly are WAY more knowledgeable than me.
From what I’ve read in forums/seem on YouTube, once you get the procedure supposedly it’s a pretty easy process.
We shall see!!
Again, I greatly appreciate your help.

[Gtrjunior]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

Cable ordered

[PFDarkside]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

I think I’ve got a good handle on MIDI programming for the Mk III+ after reading the manual and watching a video. Once you get the cable and the two Duncans on unique channels we should be able to get it programmed pretty easily assuming you haven’t already got it programmed correctly.

[Gtrjunior]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

I think I’ve got a good handle on MIDI programming for the Mk III+ after reading the manual and watching a video. Once you get the cable and the two Duncans on unique channels we should be able to get it programmed pretty easily assuming you haven’t already got it programmed correctly.

Awesome!
No I haven’t worked with it anymore since we last chatted.
I should receive the cable by the end of the week.

[Gtrjunior]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

Tracking is showing delivery on the cable tomorrow.
I’ll try to set up the channel assignments after work if I have time.

[PFDarkside]

Re: Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

For programming the MIDI portion of the Musicomlab, I have a feeling you are well on your way, if not already there.

Basics as I understand it...

Select the Bank & Patch on the Musicomlab that you want to edit.
Hold the MODE switch for one second to enter Edit mode.
Use the FS Switch to scroll through the options until you get to "PC1". This is setting up the first MIDI Program Change Message that will be transmitted.
Press the CH Switch so select what channel the message will be tranmitted on. Use Bank Up/Down to select the Midi Channel. Press the CH Switch to save.
(If Mobius is on MIDI Channel 1, select Channel 1 for PC1)
Press the NUM Switch to select what Program Change Value you want transmitted. Use Bank Up/Down to select the Program Change Value and press the NUM Switch to save.
You can go back to the FS Switch to select PC2 and PC3 to setup the second and third MIDI Program Change messages you want transmitted for this same Bank / Patch on the Musicomlab.

I have a feeling you've already got all that. To understand the Program Change Value that is transmitted to a specific Patch in the Mobius, we have to understand the mapping of the Values to the Bank/Patch setup of the Mobius.

MIDI Values are either 0-127 or 1-128. It seems like the Musicomlab uses 1-128. After that, it's simply in order.

[color=black]
Value      Bank     Patch
  1         00        A
  2         00        B
  3         01        A
  4         01        B
  5         02        A
  6         02        B
  7         03        A
  8         03        B
etc....
[/color]

The calculation is:
(BANK x 2) + 1 = Preset A
(BANK x 2) + 2 = Preset B

(You may have to subtract 1 if it's using 0-127)

You can probably give this a go, if it all works and the Mobius is behaving as expected, then reassigning the Duncan MIDI Channels will definitely be the last piece of the puzzle.

[Gtrjunior]

Setting up midi functions with a pedal switcher

For programming the MIDI portion of the Musicomlab, I have a feeling you are well on your way, if not already there.

Basics as I understand it...

Select the Bank & Patch on the Musicomlab that you want to edit.
Hold the MODE switch for one second to enter Edit mode.
Use the FS Switch to scroll through the options until you get to "PC1". This is setting up the first MIDI Program Change Message that will be transmitted.
Press the CH Switch so select what channel the message will be tranmitted on. Use Bank Up/Down to select the Midi Channel. Press the CH Switch to save.
(If Mobius is on MIDI Channel 1, select Channel 1 for PC1)
Press the NUM Switch to select what Program Change Value you want transmitted. Use Bank Up/Down to select the Program Change Value and press the NUM Switch to save.
You can go back to the FS Switch to select PC2 and PC3 to setup the second and third MIDI Program Change messages you want transmitted for this same Bank / Patch on the Musicomlab.

I have a feeling you've already got all that. To understand the Program Change Value that is transmitted to a specific Patch in the Mobius, we have to understand the mapping of the Values to the Bank/Patch setup of the Mobius.

MIDI Values are either 0-127 or 1-128. It seems like the Musicomlab uses 1-128. After that, it's simply in order.

[color=black]
Value      Bank     Patch
  1         00        A
  2         00        B
  3         01        A
  4         01        B
  5         02        A
  6         02        B
  7         03        A
  8         03        B
etc....
[/color]

The calculation is:
(BANK x 2) + 1 = Preset A
(BANK x 2) + 2 = Preset B

(You may have to subtract 1 if it's using 0-127)

You can probably give this a go, if it all works and the Mobius is behaving as expected, then reassigning the Duncan MIDI Channels will definitely be the last piece of the puzzle.

I believe I do understand what you described in the first half of your post....I do have questions though.
For example:
Mobius is set to ch1
I set the Musicomlab to transmit on ch 1
Set pc “102” ( according to the chart this simply tells the pedal to either turn on or off”)
So far easy....
Now, the Musicomlab allows up to 5 pc/channel (I believe).
How do I make it change presets in the Mobius (or other pedals)?
Do I just set the Mobius on the patch I want it to change to or do I need to go back and assign another PC?
The chart you listed above where it shows
1. 00. A
2. 00. B
This is what I’m not 100% understanding. I think this is what I need to understand to set the actual preset changes in the pedals themselves?


The plan is to just preprogram whatever sounds I need for a particular song in the individual pedals and just be able to recall them working the patches I make on the Musicomlab (obviously....lol)


So as of right now I think I understand the first half of your post.....the last half is iffy.


I should be getting the cable tonight and I should have time to mess around with this after work....I’ll keep you posted.


Edit: just rechecked the tracking and now it’s showing delivery tomorrow....grrrr