Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

nikosteph

New member
Hi everyone,

So, in my quest for the perfect guitar (for me at least :)), I've come to a point where I sort of know what I want based on several instruments I've owned or tried based on the different "highlights" of each. However, I'm not sure what guitar would best combine all these features, since none of the ones I've encountered nails them all. In the not-too-distant future I'd like to invest in a really nice, high-end guitar, and your advice would be greatly appreciated about what to look for!

Okay, so basically I used to think that the Les Paul was my "perfect" guitar. I love the thick growl, the sustain, and the sound of a high-output, PAF-flavored pickup (the SD forums were key in leading me to the legendary Custom 8, which was perfect for that!). However, three things keep it from being ideal: (1) they're heavy, even if weight-relieved, and bulky; (2) the sound is a little TOO thick, it's not as cutting and "shred-friendly" as I'd like (even with higher-output pickups); (3) the neck is a little too fat (even the 60's slim profile), and I find it hard to play fast.

So, I'm basically looking for a guitar that still has that thick tone and will retain the Custom 8 growl, but not quite SO thick. And a guitar with a thinner/faster neck and lighter. This may initially scream "PRS!", but I've tried the Custom 24/22, and while the neck is great, the tone is a little too thin and "raspy" (if that makes any sense). Maybe that's a pickup thing, but it seems to be similar across many models and it always left me a little wanting.

I also have an Ibanez RG, and the neck is fantastic, and the high-output pickups are definitely awesome, but it lacks that thicker tone, even after swapping several pickups into it. However, it definitely shreds, so that's a big plus.

Any recommendations on a good guitar that I might not know about that could meet these needs? I was thinking maybe an SG (I've never tried one), or a double-cutaway LP, but I'm open to any type of guitar as long as the tone is there. I don't care about a tremolo (though it's fine if the guitar has one), or the body style (though I do rather like the double-cutaway look; in that respect PRS is my optimal body type). The stock pickups aren't an issue; I fully plan on taking them out and putting in a couple SD pups, probably a Custom 8 and a 59 or something, so the guitar has to work well with that setup.

As for musical styles, I play mostly blues, classic and hard rock, with a little 80's metal thrown in. So nothing super heavy is necessary, but the guitar has to really growl and scream when pushed, yet be able to nail those beautiful glassy cleans as well.

I know there are a lot of smaller manufacturers out there that I've never heard of, so any advice would be greatly appreciated! And I guess that a custom job is also a possibility, but for the time being I'd like to stick to production models if possible, I'm not that rich :).

Thanks so much for the help!
 
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Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Try an SG for sure. They're more growly than rich though. personally, Godin makes my favorite playing guitar thus far. If you like ibanez, maybe look at the ART series. I don't remember what that double cutaway ARTs are, but I want one pretty bad. ESP/LTD are faster necks too, and you get a very shapely LP variant out of it.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

You really should look into a PRS, probably a McCarty.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Thanks! I'll look into the options you mentioned jon and I've never heard much about the McCarty uOpt, I'll take a look into that too!
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

ESP EC-1000 is a les paul-ish/single cut away that may be worth looking into also. slimmer body, less weight but still has all the basic elements
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

I was going to say Carvin CS models, but then I remember this audio sample I recorded a long time ago. This is between a real deal Les Paul vs another guitar. I posted a poll on the forum and people ended up voting for the non-Les Paul. Indeed, you can't tell the difference. Listen to the audio, make your choice, and let me know if you are interested in the answer...

http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=9667267
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

ESP EC-1000 is a les paul-ish/single cut away that may be worth looking into also. slimmer body, less weight but still has all the basic elements

This is the one. You can get it with EMG 81/60's or Seymour Duncans. Lightweight, sounds and plays amazing!!

-dave
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Hmm, it was hard to tell a big difference, but I think I liked the first one a little more, it was a little more defined and less thick to my ears. Definitely curious to know the answer!
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

My non-LP of choice is an Ibanez GR-520 Ghostrider. Back around '95 I was looking for a guitar with a thicker, more LP-ish tone than the Strats I was playing at the time, didn't have a lot of money and fortunately stumbled across one of these. It was love at first sight. Maple cap over an alder body, MIK, with a symmetrical double-cut. Infinity 1 & 2 buckers, stop-tail and tune-o-matic--it's lighter than any Les Paul and the body is very compact. The neck is set, and has a very fast profile similar to the Gibson Slim Taper.

I'd owned a Les Paul '55 Special Reissue since 1975, but I had never bonded with a 2HB LP--they just didn't work for me tonally for the things I was doing. But things change; and when I needed the LP tone I didn't have a lot of money, and this Ghostrider kinda magically appeared. They only made them for a couple of years--Shaun Lane was the big endorser--so Les Pauls are comparatively a dime-a-dozen; these things are RARE. I eventually found a second one; and even though I've been able to acquire some Les Pauls, nice ones, over the last decade or so, the Ghostriders remain two of my most prized guitars.

So there are guitars out there that can do the job, for not a lot of dough. One that comes to mind after reading your description would be one of the Schecter C-1 variations. And in the realm of PRS, my fav PRS right now is the Mira--don't need one, but I have been thinking really hard about getting it--just because it's cool, LOL. I think the Carvin CT would be a good choice, too. And definitely look into some of the chambered, lightweight Les Pauls. Another option might be one of the small Gibson semi-hollows, like the ES-339 or fancier ES-359. The CS-336 and CS-356 have different construction and sound closer to a Paul--they are spendy and rare; but wonderful, eye-catching guitars.

Good luck in your search.

Bill
 
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Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

+1 for ESP/LTD Eclipse series. Or Ibanez ARZ.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Thanks everyone, these are great suggestions, and ones I would never have come up with just by random Googling :).

And wow, that Ghostrider looks gorgeous and sounds great, from the few videos I can find online. Too bad they're discontinued, but I do see some on eBay, I just wish I could try one out first...It's definitely in the ballpark of what I'm looking for! The ESP's and Carvins look sweet as well!
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

The ESP Eclipse can do it. And the LTD EC-1000 isn't that far behind. I wouldn't knock the EMG 81/60 combo until you tried it, either. It is more versatile in a LP design since the thick body has so much natural warmth.

In my experience, you'll never have true max shredability unless you have a 25.5" scale (and preferably a bolt-on or neck thru design), but the Eclipse is a seriously hot rodded LP and brings huge, girthy tone into the equation, which many shred guitars lack. The actual selling price of new Carvins is quite high, but they can be fantastic values when used. The CS and CT series guitars are prime for what you describe, and the ESP Horizon is an interesting fusion.
 
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Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

I would also suggest checking out a SG. Something about that guitar just feel right and it has tone for days. You can play anything on it from blues to the heaviest of metal. The guitar is an all around workhorse.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Everything I was gonna suggest has been covered….
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

A SG is an entirely different beast, especially when it comes to neck pickups. It also hangs differently, including having the fretboard a bit to the left.

My old McCarty on the other hand sounded almost precisely like my LP Studio.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Hmm, it was hard to tell a big difference, but I think I liked the first one a little more, it was a little more defined and less thick to my ears. Definitely curious to know the answer!

Musicman Reflex. I don't know how they did it, but somehow got it to sound just like a Les Paul with the playability of a strat. It's a basswood body with mahogany tone block, maple neck, rosewood fretboard. It has locking tuners and a standard 2-point trem. It's a bolt-on but somehow sustains like a neck-through. It's one of the most amazing guitars I have ever owned. I need to go back and check to see which part of the clip was the Musicman because it has been a long time and I don't remember. I'll post back in a bit.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Thanks everybody, looks like I have some good leads! I think an extended visit to a guitar store is in order in the near future :)...
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

Ah the 2nd 1/2 of the audio was the Musicman Reflex. The first one was a Les Paul standard.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

I have an SG and have owned a PRS McCarty as well as an SC245 and I currently have a USA Dean Soltero. The McCarty definitely had great playability and has a tone a bit thinner than an LP. The SC245 has LP tone but I found is far easier to shred on compared to an LP. The Dean Soltero has LP feel and tone, but is a bit easier to rip on and has very tall frets and hot oddern pickups. I'd say look into a McCarty if you want a thick but not over the top thick tone. Beware though, the stock pickups are not for shred. I swapped mine out for a Custom and PGn and it sounded great. Santana to AIC tones for sure.
 
Re: Advice on a fast-playing, not-Les Paul-but-close guitar?

I'd vote SG, or one of many PRS guitars. PRS guitars are not raspy, but some of their pickups are.
 
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