Alternate picking vs. economy picking

[JB_From_Hell]

I've been scratching my head lately, trying to figure out the advantage of strict alternate picking over economy picking. I've only started paying attention to the difference recently, and realized I've been using economy picking (unintentionally) since I started.

If you play three notes on the D string, starting with a downstroke, then play something on the G, why on earth would you not just use a downstroke (economy) rather than reach over the string to use an upstroke (alternate)?

 

[Tor]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I have no idea what I am doing, but I am almost positive I'm an economy picker..


^^ that was written before I actually picked up my acoustic to see what I'd do in your example, and I do instinctively use an upstroke on the first note on the G string. I tried using the downstroke there as well, but it does not feel natural to me at all. The motion I incorporate in my hand when doing the first three notes makes it much easier to continue by upstroking the G string..

That being said, I do think this largely depends on whatever feels natural -- and I am pretty sure I break the alternate picking pattern from time to time. But I will be more aware of it from now on..

 

[Mincer]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I use strictly economy picking, which is essentially alternate picking unless you are changing strings. I don't know- it does save time, motion and energy, but you can't argue with people like Steve Morse or DiMeola, who strictly alternate pick everything, and play more accurately and faster than most people on the planet. It works for them, just as economy picking works for Eric Johnson, Yngwie, and Frank Gambale (or not picking at all works for Allan Holdsworth).

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

....but you can't argue with people like Steve Morse or DiMeola, who strictly alternate pick everything.....

That's where the confusion comes from. I've been doing a lot of alternate picking exercises, and I'm wondering if my time wouldn't be better spent on something else.

Another thing I've unintentionally gotten really good at is legato. Since I started, I thought it looked really cool when somebody dropped their right hand, threw up devil horns, whatever... and kept playing with the left, so I've been doing that since day one

 

[Virtual Kevorkian]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I find that strict alternate picking tends to sound more machine-gun like and precise than economy picking. It also has a very different feel to it! I use both, but definitely use strict alternate more often.

 

[aleclee]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

The arguments I've heard in favor of alternate picking are that it's easier to play in time because your hand is always moving to the beat instead of skipping beats.

I don't care. I'm almost always an economy picker and not about to change. I think that there are some times when I'll do strict alternate picking to get a different feel but those are few and far between.

 

[gmacdonnell]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

Really, if you want to be the best player possible, you need to be as fluent in both techniques as possible. Alternate picking is great for some kinds of phrases, (think Al Dimeola) and is definitely key in building up speed.

But economy picking essential for gaining fluidity, and is absolutely essential, if you want to be able to play rhythmically or intervallicly spontaneous or unorthodox phrasing.

If you want to get your chops to their best possible level, I'd strong suggest getting this book:
http://www.sheetsofsound.net/

It's $30 or so for a lifetime of great ideas, concepts, and it's the most detailed, comprehensive guitar technique book I've ever seen, or that will likely ever be written.

It takes you through every kind of Right hand picking technique and shows your their application, all in straight-forward lessons. It also has great exercises and concepts for the left hand.

It seriously is the best guitar instruction method I've ever seen, and it's sequel is great too.

They use it at most music schools in their jazz guitar courses, but it works equally well for any style of music, and there are examples in it from many different great players in different genres.

 

[StillLearnin']

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

hmmmmmmm...... Without a combination of the two, you probably limit yourself immensely. I guess I quit thinking about it years ago and use whatever is called for at a particular time. I suppose it really depends on what you are trying to shoot for technique-wise and who your influences are...
Whatever you do, try not to think about it too much and get over analytical with it - you end up forgetting about making music and just end up making exercises...

 

[cream123]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

the economy picking has gone done the tank, better find an alternate

 

[sosomething]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I'm an alternate picker, but not because of any strict adherence to form. Rather, I find that it's just easier for me since I can approach the picking of most parts the exact same way. I like it because I don't need to learn a new "picking pattern" per se for every riff or run.. just alternate pick that sucker!

I know I employ some exceptions to that rule, but I can't be bothered to figure out any examples....

Mostly, I just play in the way that feels most natural/effortless. If I think I could use a more efficient method and still achieve the desired tonality, I make an effort to learn how.

 

[Lazarus1140]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I use both styles with equal ineptitude.

 

[super rad stuff]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I use both styles with equal ineptitude.

:haha:.....




















+1

 

[C-Martin]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

i'm got a very economy picking style of playing.. probably too much since now i find it really hard to try and learn alternate altho i can do it for patterned riffs, for solos and lead work its another story... i just find it allot harder to learn a new phrasing using alternate picking than economy.. i been focusing allot lately on trying to clean up my alternate and pick up decent speed, but it just seems like i'm more of an economy picker.. for some things i just cant do at all even with days and weeks of practice... guess we all have our limits?

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

i'm got a very economy picking style of playing.. probably too much since now i find it really hard to try and learn alternate altho i can do it for patterned riffs, for solos and lead work its another story... i just find it allot harder to learn a new phrasing using alternate picking than economy.. i been focusing allot lately on trying to clean up my alternate and pick up decent speed, but it just seems like i'm more of an economy picker.. for some things i just cant do at all even with days and weeks of practice... guess we all have our limits?

As Mincer stated, economy picking and alternate picking are the same thing unless you're going to a different string. The only instance in which I can think of strict alternate picking making an audible difference is when you're playing only on one string, and that would actually be economy picking, as well.

 

[Axl H]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I use alternate picking mainly....

However, I tend to do it like Vivian Campbell, where you play up-down-up-down instead of down-up-down-up... Depends on what I am playing.

 

[Petrovsk Mizinski]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I tend to find I didn't need to consciously start economy picking, it just happened over time as a result of just practicing and my picking hand looking for a way to do it more efficiently.
Practice both economy and alternate, because both have their uses.

 

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

Alittle bit of both, but mostly just alternate.

 

[Pierre]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

Depends what kind of riffs I play. When I do something like Affraid to Shoot Strangers, it's economy. I never noticed until it was pointed out to me. It comes naturally. Sometimes it's down/up/down, sometimes up/down/up, sometimes economy, sometimes sweeps... Meh. I just do it without thinking about it I guess.

 

[\m/(00)\m/]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

I've realized lately, that I'm not as good as I thought I was at alternate picking... I've been practicing this one lick and it has 2 string skips and it's beating me at about 150 bpm... but it's almost there. Not for the sake of speed, but for the sake of having a technique down better.

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Alternate picking vs. economy picking

Is that economy picking? I always thought of it as a mini sweep.

No, it's neither economy nor a sweep. A sweep is like strumming a chord, but slower, so you'd use one down or upstroke to cover all the strings you were playing.

I don't see how it would be economy picking either, because it would be much more economic to use a single downstroke for that. Using alternating up/down or down/up unless you're on a single string is alternate picking.